HighNorth
Well-known member
Lucky you... :smoke:
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Discolouration and rusty hinges on Zeiss SF (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter HighNorth
- Start date
Lucky you... :smoke:
dwever
Well-known member
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HighNorth
Well-known member
BruceH
Avatar: Harris Hawk
HighNorth
Well-known member
What are you trying to say? That my claims have no validity? I think the pictures speak for themselves.
Of course, I am not going to argue with your experiences, or Lee's or anyone else's, as they are personal, and I have no right to.
HN
BruceH
Avatar: Harris Hawk
HN ... I am not questioning you claims at all. You posts have been very fair and informative. I agree that you have been unlucky, but I think your experience has been the exception.
It is easy for some to read about problems rightfully posted by a few and to conclude that the problems apply across the board, even when it may not the case. The impression may be blown more out of proportion by a certain member who trolls this sub forum to take things out of context, misrepresent the meaning and only add post after post with the intent of providing a negative slant.
As I said, your posts have been very fair and I do not think you are misrepresenting the issues you encountered. Actually you have approached them with good humor and the fact that you continue to have good things to say about the SF means a lot.
There have been several posts where people say they are reluctant to get an SF right now because of quality concerns and are waiting for the "bugs" to be worked out. I think it is good to let them know there are members, such as myself, who have had no problems and do not see any more risk in buying an SF than in buying another brand. I added Lee's post to the list to help show that perspective. There is a risk of getting a defect with any of the brands out there. The SF has been in manufacture for at least 10 months which is more than enough time to work out any initial production issues. I do not see it being any more risk prone than other models. No matter what the brand, if it is a bad one, then return it or send it back for warranty repair. I have done that multiple times with different brands. Waiting six months or two years is not a guarantee of a perfect unit from any manufacturer.
Sorry that you have had some issues. Sometimes it just works out that way. That is usually the case for me with computer components. If there is one bad one in a lot of 100, I will get the bad one.
It is easy for some to read about problems rightfully posted by a few and to conclude that the problems apply across the board, even when it may not the case. The impression may be blown more out of proportion by a certain member who trolls this sub forum to take things out of context, misrepresent the meaning and only add post after post with the intent of providing a negative slant.
As I said, your posts have been very fair and I do not think you are misrepresenting the issues you encountered. Actually you have approached them with good humor and the fact that you continue to have good things to say about the SF means a lot.
There have been several posts where people say they are reluctant to get an SF right now because of quality concerns and are waiting for the "bugs" to be worked out. I think it is good to let them know there are members, such as myself, who have had no problems and do not see any more risk in buying an SF than in buying another brand. I added Lee's post to the list to help show that perspective. There is a risk of getting a defect with any of the brands out there. The SF has been in manufacture for at least 10 months which is more than enough time to work out any initial production issues. I do not see it being any more risk prone than other models. No matter what the brand, if it is a bad one, then return it or send it back for warranty repair. I have done that multiple times with different brands. Waiting six months or two years is not a guarantee of a perfect unit from any manufacturer.
Sorry that you have had some issues. Sometimes it just works out that way. That is usually the case for me with computer components. If there is one bad one in a lot of 100, I will get the bad one.
I forgot to add on my earlier post that during testing I got goose droppings on the SF test unit and that didn't cause any stains either. I don't propose to experiment with other droppings but it might be fun for HN to test Steller's Eider poo on them 
Lee
Lee
John Dracon
John Dracon
My posts on this topic have hardly been enlightening. Perhaps it is time we give this thread a decent burial because it is getting a little bit rusty.
On the contrary I think we should stain with it.
I think three documented cases of staining by forum members is enough cause for concern. It certainly makes me pause before buying an SF. I am not implying that every SF will stain either but too me it is cause for concern.
jan van daalen
Well-known member
:clap:
:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:
Dennis
I might be wrong but I think 2 people have reported staining and a third said he was worried that the pale gray might show stains sooner than black.
Considering that neither my sweat nor goose poo don't stain SFs and that there are thousands out there now I really don't think its a worry.
Lee
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Goose poo? If that don't stain them nothing will.
No there were three complaints of staining on Bird Forum two with pictures. High North, Suppressor, and Juliet Moore as she quoted.
"I have this similar problem on my 8x42's. The stains are only visible in natural light but as a result of using Mr Muscle cleaner most have disappeared.
The whole casing is poor to say the least as marks very easily. Had swarovskis before - build quality far superior!
I would be interested to see what Zeiss say - if they reply!"
Three complaints on the relatively small sampling on Bird Forum is cause for concern in my eyes. We don't know about the other thousands that have been sold if they had problems with staining or not. That is an unknown. We DO know we had 3 legitimate complaints here.
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I stand corrected Dennis.
But put it like this. There have been many more who have complained about Swaro focusers on BF so are you going to warn people not to buy Swaros because of the risk they are taking? Using the same logic as you I should also say that we don't know how many more have suffered from poor focusers either.
I can tell you that the Swaro focusers at Bird Fair 2013 were all as smooth as silk. Last year more than half felt like they were lubricated by spit and grit. If I had the same reaction as you I should be warning people off Swaros, because while we don't know what was on these peoples' hands that has caused the staining of SF armour, we do know that the rubbish focusers were assembled and passed as OK by Swaro.
But I would certainly not warn anyone off Swaros because of it. I think that would be making it out to be a bigger problem than it is. Get my drift?
Lee
dwever
Well-known member
Well once again I'm done. How can glass at this price point not be exquisite to look through and and have fantastically engineered and produced housing? It is feeling like either 1. the alpha glass consumer base is not large enough to justify the proper R&D and production budgets needed by the manufacturers; or, 2. There is some very subtle and sophisticated fan-boy trolling going on here - there just seems to be some brand agendas delicately being prosecuted here at the expense of the discussion. Just my impressions of the sub-forum but not being stated with certainty.
Last year it was even worse when I was an HT shopper and waded in to Henry Link's HT review and the ensuing discussion in June of 2014.
In the shooting-scope world you sure as heck don't get this malarkey with Alpha glass scopes by e.g. Schmidt & Bender. They are $4K though. But at this point I'd gladly pay that for an equivalently engineered and manufactured pair of binoculars. This forum would certainly become more enjoyable.
Anyway, maybe I just don't understand the culture here. I've learned a bit for sure. Many thanks.
Last year it was even worse when I was an HT shopper and waded in to Henry Link's HT review and the ensuing discussion in June of 2014.
In the shooting-scope world you sure as heck don't get this malarkey with Alpha glass scopes by e.g. Schmidt & Bender. They are $4K though. But at this point I'd gladly pay that for an equivalently engineered and manufactured pair of binoculars. This forum would certainly become more enjoyable.
Anyway, maybe I just don't understand the culture here. I've learned a bit for sure. Many thanks.
james holdsworth
Consulting Biologist
If you are listening to Dennis, then you are being steered well off in the wrong direction.
This whole thread, about stains, is IMO, farcical. Troubador's last post made the most sense. I was going to say the same thing but didn't want the Swaro ****storm raining down on me......
Am I saying this is all a ''non-issue?''
No, but the level of interest in stains goes beyond cultish.Edit - just to be fair, this over-attention to minor problems is a bit of an epidemic here and does extend to Swaro as well, with a very few posters that push the ''anti-rolling ball'' agenda and the like, to the point where an outside observer is [very falsely] led to believe they are dealing with a huge problem. I think this sort of over-the-top repetition [because some people just love to express themselves, even if for the 1000th time on the same subject] does a real disservice to this forum and the binoculars discussed here.
All very IMO.
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dwever
Well-known member
If you are listening to Dennis, then you are being steered well off in the wrong direction.
This whole thread, about stains, is IMO, farcical. Troubador's last post made the most sense. I was going to say the same thing but didn't want the Swaro ****storm raining down on me......
Am I saying this is all a ''non-issue?''
Edit - just to be fair, this over-attention to minor problems is a bit of an epidemic here and does extend to Swaro as well, with a very few posters that push the ''anti-rolling ball'' agenda and the like, to the point where an outside observer is [very falsely] led to believe they are dealing with a huge problem. I think this sort of over-the-top repetition [because some people just love to express themselves, even if for the 1000th time on the same subject] does a real disservice to this forum and the binoculars discussed here.
All very IMO.
Well said, thank you.
