Hooded Crow? (1 Viewer)

mipettin · Mar 29, 2004

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Maybe these are visitors!

Took my boys to see Cat in the Hat yesterday and afterwards to McDonalds. Only to see what looked like a Hooded Crow by the drive thru. And this was in East Scotland at Dunfermline.

Anyway lunchtime today saw nothing of note when on the return to the car I saw this guy. Manage to walk round following him taking snaps. Light was really poor though. Is this a Hooded Crow or a Hooded Crow / Carrion cross.

Also maybe my imagination but the beak kinda seems heavier than a Carrion.
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scampo · Mar 29, 2004

Is it perhaps a moulting hooded crow - they are in moult now? As you say, what a beak - but that is fairly commonplace. I remember in Wales years ago looking for raven, the carrion crows often looked very raven-like; but then when a genuine raven turns up, all confusion is dispelled.

jeff · Mar 29, 2004

Hooded crow, what i think of as the northern version of the carrion crow, prob. wrong in my thinking, but i only ever see them up north.

steve_nova · Mar 29, 2004

I think this may be quite literally, borderline between the two subspecies. Seems just a tad too much black tips to the grey feathers so I would say intermediate.

Nice shots by the way whether I'm write or wrong.

Gill Osborne · Mar 29, 2004

What a beautiful bird...and fantastic photo! I first saw Hoodies in Crete in October 1992 but didn't get them onto my British List until march 2003 when I visited the West coast of Scotland for a few days. Just as we approached the outskirts of Oban I saw two in a field and over the next couple of days they were the only species I saw...no all-black Carrions along by Oban and up to Fort William.
Just a shame we don't get them in England more...I think they are SO attractive!
As to it being a possible hybrid between Carrion and Hooded...I wouldn't have the foggiest!!! LOL Just confuses me...ask Michael or Jane!

GILL XXX

jeff · Mar 29, 2004

steve_nova said:
I think this may be quite literally, borderline between the two subspecies. Seems just a tad too much black tips to the grey feathers so I would say intermediate.

Nice shots by the way whether I'm write or wrong.

If i had to tick it, it'd go in my hooded crow (cornix)tick box ;-)

steve_nova · Mar 29, 2004

Just for comparison: Hooded Crow

Gill Osborne · Mar 29, 2004

I see what you mean Steve...looks like a few differences in the plumage in your photo...brilliant pic by the way!
I'm with Jeff and would just tick it as a Hoodie...don't feel experienced enough to sort out the finer points of hybrids...I leave that to 'proper' birders....I'm just a humble naturalist LOL

GILL XXX

scampo · Mar 29, 2004

Gill Osborne said:
What a beautiful bird...and fantastic photo! I first saw Hoodies in Crete in October 1992 but didn't get them onto my British List until march 2003 when I visited the West coast of Scotland for a few days. Just as we approached the outskirts of Oban I saw two in a field and over the next couple of days they were the only species I saw...no all-black Carrions along by Oban and up to Fort William.
Just a shame we don't get them in England more...I think they are SO attractive!
As to it being a possible hybrid between Carrion and Hooded...I wouldn't have the foggiest!!! LOL Just confuses me...ask Michael or Jane!

GILL XXX

I think the north-west is full of 'em, Gill. When we were up in the Lakes many years ago, I remember seeing many (or is my memory letting me down?).

Steve G · Mar 29, 2004

I think this is a Hoodie-Carrion hybrid. It's probably the one that hangs about at Mcdonalds on the East end of Dunfermline- it's been around for about a year now. It's a big fan of Quarter pounders though it'll take a Big Mac at a push!

steve_nova · Mar 29, 2004

Gill Osborne said:
I see what you mean Steve...looks like a few differences in the plumage in your photo...brilliant pic by the way!
I'm with Jeff and would just tick it as a Hoodie...don't feel experienced enough to sort out the finer points of hybrids...I leave that to 'proper' birders....I'm just a humble naturalist LOL

GILL XXX

Oh, I'm no expert but I agree that it could be ticked as a Hoodie, it's just that I have seen enough of them to feel reasonably confident that this is no pure C. cornix..............any backup?......cuckooroller?......CJW?........anyone?

cuckooroller · Mar 29, 2004

This looks like a hybrid to me. You know that until recently cornix and corone was considered to be one species. The Hooded was Corvus corone cornix. It shouldn't be surprising to see hybrids around.

Michael Frankis · Mar 29, 2004

Hybrid corone x cornix for me too. Not an F1 cross, probably an nth generation mix-up, closer to Hooded than to Carrion, but certainly not pure Hooded. Maybe perhaps ¾ Hooded, ¼ Carrion.

Michael

cuckooroller · Mar 29, 2004

Michael, I just posted the only hard to find congener of Pinicola. Quiz. Go take a look, I know that you like birdies with pinus

CJW · Mar 29, 2004

Definitely a hybrid. They range from being almost Jackdaw-like to being very similar to the one in MY photo but with more black on the lower belly and scaps.
The more generations the darker (Carrion Crow genes are dominant), so this is perhaps a 2nd or 3rd generation 'greybrid' (as we call them over here).
Sorry, I wouldn't tick it as a Hooded Crow.

Chris

Joern Lehmhus · Mar 30, 2004

Hybrid for me too ; we have an area like a narrow belt through Germany where the two subspecies (I still privately consider hooded and black crows to be subspecies) meet and where they hybridise quite frequently.

CJW i would think the amount of grey is also dependent on what the F1 birds backcross with? In the hooded crow areas here you get some hybrids with quite a lot of grey.

Jörn

CJW · Mar 30, 2004

That's right Jörn, but it seems that they tend to be breeding with other hybrids and Carrion Crows, thus helping to darken them through the generations. Ofcourse there are still some 1st generation hybrids but as our population of 'pure' Hoodies gets watered down, there are fewer and fewer of them to maintain their purity. Indeed, there are only about 1 in 8 pure birds left now and these tend to be in the more isolated areas such as high ground and remote headlands.
I agree with you that they are just subspecies - a ridiculous split.

Chris.

James · Mar 30, 2004

Scampo

Your memory IS letting you down. Your're getting old mate. I live in the North-West and short of Scotland and one on Anglesey I've never seen a hoodie!!!

James

CJW · Mar 30, 2004

James said:
Scampo

Your memory IS letting you down. Your're getting old mate. I live in the North-West and short of Scotland and one on Anglesey I've never seen a hoodie!!!

James

And the Anglesey one was a hybrid!

James · Mar 30, 2004

Still is as far as I know!!!!
Still there I believe.
As it's not a full species in my mind I don't care!!!!

James

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