I just ordered a new Pentax pf65ed straight and then ordered a Baader Hyperion 8-24 Mark III zoom eyepiece but then I noticed that on some of the threads on this forum that it may not work. Does any one know why it won't work? I am primarily using this scope for viewing at distances greater than 200 yards and need to have zoom capabilities as I will packing long distances and carrying multiple eyepieces is not feasible. If the baader will not work what is my best bet for a zoom eyepiece?
-
Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.
Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
PF65EDII Straight need eyepiece (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter jgs8163
- Start date
mayoayo
Well-known member
The Pentax XF20-60X ,althoug bashed bu many user(included myself in the past!),Is not a bad zoom AT ALL,now that I see it in perspective...It really compares very well with the Nikon MC II zoom,in all regards---Is a high power eyepiece(short focal 6.5mm-19.5mm ,if i remember well,versus 8-24 in most zooms),and has short eye relief...So does the Nikon and It is widely accepted as a good eyepiece ,in general....
I am pointing You to the Pentax XF because I remember the eyepiece to be among,if not the best ,zoom i have seen in build quality,Is waterproof,as said gives high magnification(20-60 x in the PF65),and Is sharp and contrasty.
Now..make sure that Your Pentax PF65ED is a good sample and can take the 60X ..otherwise the zoom would seem to You,as to many others,a bit below expectations
I am pointing You to the Pentax XF because I remember the eyepiece to be among,if not the best ,zoom i have seen in build quality,Is waterproof,as said gives high magnification(20-60 x in the PF65),and Is sharp and contrasty.
Now..make sure that Your Pentax PF65ED is a good sample and can take the 60X ..otherwise the zoom would seem to You,as to many others,a bit below expectations
Is the pentax zoom that much better than the Vixen zoom which is half the price? The PF65ED II is rated by Pentax as 15X45X60 scope. I believe that Pentax believes this scope will work best in the 15x45 zoom range. Would you still reccommend the pentax zoom if that is the case?
Last edited:
mayoayo
Well-known member
Hi..No I dont think is much better..It is waterproof,but the Vixen has much better eye relief,and it is very good..It is a classic for sure,and affordable..
Now, I have heard a lot of people talking about the William Optics II zoom eyepiece (7.5-22.5)..lots of excellent reviews and I think it does work with the Pentax( anyone able to confirm this?)..This Zoom is VERY similar in all physical aspects to my ZEN ED 20-60 Zoom ,that is a clon of the Swarovski zoom...I put my zoom against the picture of the WO in my computer screen,both at similar size,and they look identical..So maybe they are closely related..I dont know the price of the WO or if is still in production
Now, I have heard a lot of people talking about the William Optics II zoom eyepiece (7.5-22.5)..lots of excellent reviews and I think it does work with the Pentax( anyone able to confirm this?)..This Zoom is VERY similar in all physical aspects to my ZEN ED 20-60 Zoom ,that is a clon of the Swarovski zoom...I put my zoom against the picture of the WO in my computer screen,both at similar size,and they look identical..So maybe they are closely related..I dont know the price of the WO or if is still in production
Attachments
FrankD
Well-known member
Manuel,
This is going back a few years so I am really going by memory here. I tried several zooms in the Pentax 65. The Williams Optics zoom was actually produced under several names. I tried the Williams Optics model and one of the clones. I think it was an Orion model (Deluxe maybe?). Both worked in the P 65 but, if I remember correctly, you had to modify the compression ring. From what I remember the compression ring, when tightened, actually lift the eyepiece out and away from the scope body which affected infinity focus a bit. By putting a thinner compression ring (and one without the "lip" on the outside) the eyepiece doesn't lift away from the body and allows you to use it at all distances and magnifications.
Someone posted an extensive thread on the subject, I think including pictures, here in the Pentax subforum. It is probably from back in 2007-2009 if I remember right.
On a related note, I used the relatively inexpensive Celestron zoom with the P 65 for many years. It did not measure up to the better zooms on the market but was acceptable for me for the applications I typically used it for. Price was around $80.
Also, didn't the Vixen go through at least one or two upgrades? I seem to remember an early Vixen zoom that was highly recommended and then they upgraded it (clickstops maybe?) and produced a "Mark II" unit. This is all from what I barely remember but it may spur some discussion from someone else that has one or can remember more.
This is going back a few years so I am really going by memory here. I tried several zooms in the Pentax 65. The Williams Optics zoom was actually produced under several names. I tried the Williams Optics model and one of the clones. I think it was an Orion model (Deluxe maybe?). Both worked in the P 65 but, if I remember correctly, you had to modify the compression ring. From what I remember the compression ring, when tightened, actually lift the eyepiece out and away from the scope body which affected infinity focus a bit. By putting a thinner compression ring (and one without the "lip" on the outside) the eyepiece doesn't lift away from the body and allows you to use it at all distances and magnifications.
Someone posted an extensive thread on the subject, I think including pictures, here in the Pentax subforum. It is probably from back in 2007-2009 if I remember right.
On a related note, I used the relatively inexpensive Celestron zoom with the P 65 for many years. It did not measure up to the better zooms on the market but was acceptable for me for the applications I typically used it for. Price was around $80.
Also, didn't the Vixen go through at least one or two upgrades? I seem to remember an early Vixen zoom that was highly recommended and then they upgraded it (clickstops maybe?) and produced a "Mark II" unit. This is all from what I barely remember but it may spur some discussion from someone else that has one or can remember more.
eitanaltman
Well-known member
yes, the William Optics zoom worked but only with a compression ring modification. I used this zoom successfully for many years with my PF-65 until it disappeared along with my (stolen) car. It is NOT the same as the Swaro/Zen 20-60x zoom; it just has some physical similarities being a big, wide-angle-ish zoom ep.
the best compromise for price / quality / ease (i.e. no mods needed) is definitely the various 8-24mm zooms, which included Vixen, Televue, and Meade versions. The only ding with these zooms is the narrow FOV, which is why so many people (myself included) flailed around looking for other options including the Baader and William Optic zooms. If you can handle the narrow FOV they are great little zooms and readily available used on the astro market for $100ish. AFAIK there is no optical difference between the regular versions and the "click stop" versions; the click stop ones are a bit more popular with astro folks who use them for binoviewing and the click stops can keep the two ep's synced at the same focal length.
to the OP -- ALL of this info is easily available if you just take some time to read through some older threads in this Pentax forum. There isn't much new to add to the subject that hasn't been said before.
the best compromise for price / quality / ease (i.e. no mods needed) is definitely the various 8-24mm zooms, which included Vixen, Televue, and Meade versions. The only ding with these zooms is the narrow FOV, which is why so many people (myself included) flailed around looking for other options including the Baader and William Optic zooms. If you can handle the narrow FOV they are great little zooms and readily available used on the astro market for $100ish. AFAIK there is no optical difference between the regular versions and the "click stop" versions; the click stop ones are a bit more popular with astro folks who use them for binoviewing and the click stops can keep the two ep's synced at the same focal length.
to the OP -- ALL of this info is easily available if you just take some time to read through some older threads in this Pentax forum. There isn't much new to add to the subject that hasn't been said before.
Last edited:
mayoayo
Well-known member
It did surprised Me the exactitude of those similarities.. the lens size seems exact in diameter and coatings hue and the body is a nailed match for dimenssions...Even the three Phillips screws holding the bottom plate are identical,like if they would allow to take one or the other style mount....
Have You actually compared both eyepieces,the Zen 20-60X and the WO zoom side by side?....
henry link
Well-known member
This Orion zoom looks like it could be the same eyepiece as the William Optics.
http://www.telescope.com/Accessorie...Telescope-Eyepiece/pc/-1/c/3/sc/47/p/8238.uts
Both of these eyepieces look to me suspiciously like the Swarovski 20-60x zoom. If they're good quality knock-offs, like the Zen-Ray/Vortex zooms, they should be excellent eyepieces, essentially indistinguishable from the real Swarovski zoom. Orion also sells a less expensive zoom which looks like it could be a copy of the Nikon MCII zoom. That could also be a nice eyepiece, but it has short eye relief and narrow apparent fields similar to the Pentax XF zoom. I own the Pentax XF zoom only because I got lazy and didn't return it. I agree that it's very well made, but mine is optically pretty poor, mainly from excessive lateral chromatic aberration near the field center, especially at high magnification.
http://www.telescope.com/Accessorie...Telescope-Eyepiece/pc/-1/c/3/sc/47/p/8238.uts
Both of these eyepieces look to me suspiciously like the Swarovski 20-60x zoom. If they're good quality knock-offs, like the Zen-Ray/Vortex zooms, they should be excellent eyepieces, essentially indistinguishable from the real Swarovski zoom. Orion also sells a less expensive zoom which looks like it could be a copy of the Nikon MCII zoom. That could also be a nice eyepiece, but it has short eye relief and narrow apparent fields similar to the Pentax XF zoom. I own the Pentax XF zoom only because I got lazy and didn't return it. I agree that it's very well made, but mine is optically pretty poor, mainly from excessive lateral chromatic aberration near the field center, especially at high magnification.
thanks but no thanks
I read numerous other threads on the website but was looking for more info on the NEW Baader zoom version 3 which none of the threads discuss. Most of the threads are very old and the scope pf65ed is still in production. There have been numerous eyepiece upgrades and changes and was looking for some help on the newer eyepieces. The Williams is no longer made. Thanks, JGS
I read numerous other threads on the website but was looking for more info on the NEW Baader zoom version 3 which none of the threads discuss. Most of the threads are very old and the scope pf65ed is still in production. There have been numerous eyepiece upgrades and changes and was looking for some help on the newer eyepieces. The Williams is no longer made. Thanks, JGS
mayoayo
Well-known member
Well,If you already ordered the NEW Baader ,and ,as You mentioned,Should be in Your hands soon,The best thing is to try it..!...You will find first hand if the eyepiece is compatible with your scope.
If You are buying the eyepiece from a reputable seller,The fact that You try the eyepiece ,If kept in New condition,is not going to affect the return policy,So really,..give it a try..and let us Know
If You are buying the eyepiece from a reputable seller,The fact that You try the eyepiece ,If kept in New condition,is not going to affect the return policy,So really,..give it a try..and let us Know
Thanks for all your advice mayo. Will do just that but I talked with the seller and the specs have not changed. The changes are all in the lenses and their coatings. I am a total novice at this and am in the infancy of learning about them. I think I will order the SMC eyepiece by Pentax as you suggested. It's just a lot more than I want to spend but the waterproofing is important to me. The Baader is also waterproof. Best regards, JGS
RJM
Don't Worry, Be Happy!
Understand the DISCONTINUED Pentax SMC 8mm-24mm zoom is as big as a beer can, weighs 550g and is only JIS Class 4 splash RESISTANT and made for the 100/80 size scopes. It delivers 16-48x on the 65ED wtih good 18mm-22mm of eyerelief.
The much smaller SMC XF 6.5mm-19.5mm zoom weighs 240g and was made for the 65mm scope. It is well made, but its optical quality is inferior with 11mm-15mm eyerelief (lousy IMO), certainly compared to the Vixen/Tele Vue 8mm-24mm. The the XF 8.5mm and 12mm eyepieces have excellent IQ however and are small/light and a good fit for the 65ED. None of the XF's have any water resistance.
The much smaller SMC XF 6.5mm-19.5mm zoom weighs 240g and was made for the 65mm scope. It is well made, but its optical quality is inferior with 11mm-15mm eyerelief (lousy IMO), certainly compared to the Vixen/Tele Vue 8mm-24mm. The the XF 8.5mm and 12mm eyepieces have excellent IQ however and are small/light and a good fit for the 65ED. None of the XF's have any water resistance.
Last edited:
mayoayo
Well-known member
The eyepiece I brought up was not the SMC ,but the XF Zoom..I thought it was waterproof, my mistake...The 8-24mm SMC Zoom,as RJM (Nick?)is mentioning, is as heavy and expensive as the scope itself,not sure if many PF65 users would go this route..
The WO is discontinued ,but the Orion Zoom should be available,and as Henry points,If is a Swaro clon,as the Vortex-ZEN ,It could be an excellent choice.
On the safe side,The inexpensive Vixen,Televue,Meade etc...a fine eyepiece ,tested and easy to find..I saw a Meade 8-24mm on Eb@y for 75$ BIN,just yesterday..With the kind of money you are savingYou can go the fixed power route as well ,maybe with one of the excellent Pentax XW eyepieces.Waterproof and Exceptional
The WO is discontinued ,but the Orion Zoom should be available,and as Henry points,If is a Swaro clon,as the Vortex-ZEN ,It could be an excellent choice.
On the safe side,The inexpensive Vixen,Televue,Meade etc...a fine eyepiece ,tested and easy to find..I saw a Meade 8-24mm on Eb@y for 75$ BIN,just yesterday..With the kind of money you are savingYou can go the fixed power route as well ,maybe with one of the excellent Pentax XW eyepieces.Waterproof and Exceptional
If the Orion is the same as the WO is it going to need modifications to the compression ring as mentioned in the other posts? What eyepiece would be recommended without needing modifications? Does anyone know if the Vixen will work without any modifications. Also there are 2 differ models of the Vixen. The NLV and the LV, I can't figure out what the differences are. Thanks.
RJM
Don't Worry, Be Happy!
I have the old LV zoom and I think it only differs from the NLV in body style and the clickstops. Same optics. Should work fine on the Pentax 65ED.
Having once owned this scope and all the eyepieces, I would buy the XF 12mm or XW 14mm and be done with it. Both yield ~30x mag while still keeping a relatively bright exit pupil. The view thru the XW should be very pleasant but the XF is much smaller/lighter/cheaper while staying true to the main benefit of the 65ED for its small compact size compared to other scopes in its class from Kowa and Nikon.
Having once owned this scope and all the eyepieces, I would buy the XF 12mm or XW 14mm and be done with it. Both yield ~30x mag while still keeping a relatively bright exit pupil. The view thru the XW should be very pleasant but the XF is much smaller/lighter/cheaper while staying true to the main benefit of the 65ED for its small compact size compared to other scopes in its class from Kowa and Nikon.
Last edited:
jmepler
It's just a flesh wound.
When I got my first scope I thought I had to have a zoom. After buying the XW14 to use while digiscoping I found myself using the fixed eyepieces more and more. I have a few of them. I will either pick the one that I feel will meet my needs for the day, or I will throw a second one in my pack.
Recently I was using a PF-80ED with the SMC Zoom and the view through it was quite claustrophobic compared to the view through the XWs. You can probably find some old threads here of me defending the SMC as "not that bad", but I will now concede that the fixed magnification XWs are much better.
Here is a list of magnification and field of view that you will get with the PF-65ED and various Pentax eyepieces.
Eyepiece...Magnification....Field of view @ 1,000 yards
XW7.............55.5x...............63ft
XW10.............39x................93ft
XW14.............28x...............132ft
XF12.............32.5x..............96ft
XF Zoom.......20x-60x.........117-51ft
SMC Zoom.....16x-48x.........120-63ft
You can see that the XW14 gives you a bigger field of view at 28x than the XF Zoom does at 20x or the SMC Zoom at 16x.
For a little more reach the XW10 gives you 39x with a still respectable 93ft field of view.
Mike
Recently I was using a PF-80ED with the SMC Zoom and the view through it was quite claustrophobic compared to the view through the XWs. You can probably find some old threads here of me defending the SMC as "not that bad", but I will now concede that the fixed magnification XWs are much better.
Here is a list of magnification and field of view that you will get with the PF-65ED and various Pentax eyepieces.
Eyepiece...Magnification....Field of view @ 1,000 yards
XW7.............55.5x...............63ft
XW10.............39x................93ft
XW14.............28x...............132ft
XF12.............32.5x..............96ft
XF Zoom.......20x-60x.........117-51ft
SMC Zoom.....16x-48x.........120-63ft
You can see that the XW14 gives you a bigger field of view at 28x than the XF Zoom does at 20x or the SMC Zoom at 16x.
For a little more reach the XW10 gives you 39x with a still respectable 93ft field of view.
Mike
Mike,
Thanks for the comment on my thread as it was very informative. I am not only a novice birder but as well a big game hunter and this will be used in both applications. What do you think about the fixed power BST eyepieces? They are more affordable. I was thinking about the one below and then a XW to compliment it and then maybe a inexpensive zoom eyepiece at a later date. Any help is much appreciated. Best regards, Jay
http://my.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?MyEbay&gbh=1
Thanks for the comment on my thread as it was very informative. I am not only a novice birder but as well a big game hunter and this will be used in both applications. What do you think about the fixed power BST eyepieces? They are more affordable. I was thinking about the one below and then a XW to compliment it and then maybe a inexpensive zoom eyepiece at a later date. Any help is much appreciated. Best regards, Jay
http://my.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?MyEbay&gbh=1
