EXCLUSIVE 8x32 & 10x32 Zeiss FL binos (1 Viewer)

henry link said:

CDK,
Thanks for your first reply. Sorry to pester you again, but did the Zeiss staff say why their Pechan prism has higher than normal light transmission?
Henry

Click to expand...

Henry.

I see that Andy has already answered your question, it is down to the special layers on the mirror surface, apparently something which has been known for a few years. However the Abbe Konig prism still has a higher light transmission than the Pechan, but apparently the transmission figures between one manufacturers use of Pechan versus another's use is quite different.

CDK

Leif said:

Many years ago I was strongly influenced by Bill Oddie's endorsement of Leica. I suspect I was not alone.
Leif

Click to expand...

Leif.

Very honest reply and I would think that you are not alone, I would have thought that there are BF members who if being honest would also say that they wanted to own the same binoculars as the man himself.

Leica must take full credit for using Bill Oddie in their marketing campaign. No doubt he is one of the most knowledgeable birders around, but I always wondered about his optical knowledge, especially after "The Leica 62 Televid, something that I have been waiting for" (or similar wording). I see in their latest brochure featuring celebrities, Chris Packham is shown with the Televid, however on the Nikon stand at bird fair his name appeared under a paragraph for Nikon binoculars, previously he was shown with both Leica bins and scopes. The man who did all those reviews for Birdwatching, (Steve Dudly) is featured promoting the Televid, so maybe all those posts in BF about biased reviews did have some credibilitiy.

I think Steve Dudley's long association with Leica is well-known. To be fair, he acts as a 'compiler' in Birdwatching mag's reviews these days, so presumably would say he's putting the facts together rather than offering an opinion that could be seen as biased.
At least he and Odd Billie are consistent in their brand loyalty.... it's the change of opinion that free gear seems to have prompted in some individuals featured in the Leica brochure that irks me. Well, not really, perhaps it just raises a cynical smile

Sean

All this chat about these bins and nowhere - unless my eyes fail me - any suggestion about how much the damn things will actually cost vis a vis their bigger brothers & the competition! Anybody have any clue? John

John Cantelo said:

All this chat about these bins and nowhere - unless my eyes fail me - any suggestion about how much the damn things will actually cost vis a vis their bigger brothers & the competition! Anybody have any clue? John

Click to expand...

John.

You obviously did not go to bird fair, because the Zeiss price list shows:
8x32 FL £905
10x32 FL £940

Apparently not available until December 2004.

Andy Bright said:

I must admit, I don't see any mass selling of EL's... quite a few people I have seen have sold their 42mm EL's to buy 32mm EL's (downsizing seems popular with the brightness achieved by modern 32mm binos)

Click to expand...

I bought a pair of 8x32ELs to back up my 7x42BGATs. All people who do similar need to be warned that getting an x32 bino is going to make your x42 that used to be completely unoticable around your neck, seem like a huge awkward lead weight. Tested back to back at the absolute limit of shooting light I reckon the 7x42s picked up an extra 5 minutes. In the woods this might be extended somewhat.

8x32s are SO nice to use.

Curtis,

Regarding this:

Curtis Croulet said:

Perhaps my brethren in The Colonies can fill me in on this. I've seen stuff in reviews about people like Pete Dunne (well-known North American birder) being consulted in the design of the Swarovski EL, and the cover of his new book, Pete Dunne on Birding, shows him with an EL hanging from his neck (and a Leica 77 hoisted on his shoulder), but I'm not aware of recent ads that include testimonials or endorsements from famous birders or naturalists. Are there any?

Click to expand...

I don't know how it is in the U.K., I can only speak from my experience here in the heartland of the U.S.A.

For the most part, Americans are (somewhat contrary to world opinion) extremely pragmatic and typically interested only in what works the BEST for the given task. Certainly, we "yanks" have our share of idiots and brainless advertising victims, but the vast majority of these types are unable to afford the types of optics we are discussing on this thread... they are instead likely to purchase Tasco or Bushnell, often second-hand at thrift stores or swap meets.

In this area (Midwestern United States), the birders I have had contact with have been split roughly into 3 camps.... Leica (most common), Nikon (close 2nd) and Swarovski (quite rare). I am the ONLY person I have ever run across who has owned either Zeiss or Pentax optics, they seem to be the rarest of the binocular brands in this area. I have YET to meet a birder in this area who knows of anyone in the "celebrity" birding world other than Steve Ingraham of BVD, and I've met ZERO birders who have based their equipment purchase decisions on the opinions of industry celebrities or magazines. I would say that probably 10% base their decision on what brand is the most expensive, regardless of objective optical quality (thus the rare Swarovski users in this area), around 50% base their decision on what binoculars are in the "high-end" (read "expensive") range and also have excellent optical quality (the Leica majority), and the remaining 40% or so look at ALL options and select the best quality optics, regardless of reputation or price range (the Nikon owners).

I have YET to see a pair of Zeiss FL binoculars in this area.... in fact, I am the only birder in this area I have ever run across who owns Zeiss of ANY kind... my 8X20 compacts). I have found that a grand total of ONE shop in the area has ordered Zeiss FL binoculars (and luckily for me, they consequently discounted earlier Victory II models!). I am curious if the new FL will find a place with the birders in this area... but if past experience is any guide, these will probably do quite well here.

Is this enough of a "colonies" viewpoint for you? I hope it has been somewhat informative...

Best wishes,
Bawko

Atomic Chicken said:

Curtis,

[SNIP] and the remaining 40% or so look at ALL options and select the best quality optics, regardless of reputation or price range (the Nikon owners).

Bawko

Click to expand...

Bawko,

I don't think "best quality optics" is the deciding factor for many folks. There are many quality binoculars with excellent optics. I think for many folks fit and feel are the main factors in determining which of these the buyer selects. Some binoculars that were highly recommended to me, and are certainly superb optically, just weren't right for me. Two felt very awkward in my hands, and the focus on another was too slow for my taste.

Clear skies, Alan

I usually work on weekends and don't have much chance to go to birding events, but on the organized bird outings I've been able to attend, I don't see many high-end binos. Of the binos I've seen, I'd have to say that Leica easily outnumbers all of the other high-end brands put together. At those unscheduled gatherings of experienced birders tracking down a reported rarity, Leica, B&L and Swarovski, in that order, are probably the most abundant brands I've seen. Nikon is rare; Zeiss is almost invisible.

Curtis Croulet said:

I usually work on weekends and don't have much chance to go to birding events, but on the organized bird outings I've been able to attend, I don't see many high-end binos. Of the binos I've seen, I'd have to say that Leica easily outnumbers all of the other high-end brands put together. At those unscheduled gatherings of experienced birders tracking down a reported rarity, Leica, B&L and Swarovski, in that order, are probably the most abundant brands I've seen. Nikon is rare; Zeiss is almost invisible.

Click to expand...

Curtis,

This is very interesting to hear. It sounds like in Europe, or at least in the U.K., the situation is similar to the U.S. with 2 exceptions. First off, it sounds like B&L has made significant inroads in your country... in the U.S. they are almost non-existent. Secondly, Nikon seems to be quite a bit more common here than in the U.K., at least from your experience. Other than that, the relative "ranking" of different brands in terms of commonality seems to be identical. Leica is #1, Swarovski is rare, and Zeiss is almost non-existent.

Best wishes,
Bawko

Well..............around this part of the US for high end bins, Swaro is very popular, especially the closer you get to Chicago. They showed up like corn being popped shortly after they became available. Zeiss Classics are fairly popular as are the B&L Elites. Leica (which I currently use) is down the list and Nikon is last. Not sure I've ever seen anyone with the LXs. I've seen one Brunton Epoch which I want to get my hands on again.

I expect to see more Zeiss Classics and B&Ls Elites being retired in the next few years.

Atomic Chicken said:

Curtis,

This is very interesting to hear. It sounds like in Europe, or at least in the U.K., the situation is similar to the U.S. with 2 exceptions. First off, it sounds like B&L has made significant inroads in your country... in the U.S. they are almost non-existent. Secondly, Nikon seems to be quite a bit more common here than in the U.K., at least from your experience. Other than that, the relative "ranking" of different brands in terms of commonality seems to be identical. Leica is #1, Swarovski is rare, and Zeiss is almost non-existent.

Best wishes,
Bawko

Click to expand...

I think Curtis is waving the stars and stripes, and lives in California?


Curtis, are you a priest or a wedding photographer?

I'd suggest that because birding has been a significant pastime in the U.K. (and maybe Northern Europe) for far longer than it has in North America, we see far more older high quality binos still in use... which invariably means Zeiss and Leica.
regards,
Andy

Maybe you're right, Andy. Only 100 years ago, Americans were more interested in blasting Passenger Pigeons and Carolina Parakeets out of the skies and into extinction.

Curtis Croulet said:

Maybe you're right, Andy. Only 100 years ago, Americans were more interested in blasting Passenger Pigeons and Carolina Parakeets out of the skies and into extinction.

Click to expand...

Well, we're no angels either, even to this day... but i think it's fair to say that 'birding' has been in an advanced state for many decades in the U.K. Which leads to having a large number of more mature birders with equally mature binos

As I stated before, the recent birdfair (by far the largest birding event in the world) showed just how many old Zeiss binos are still in use by British birders. Someone mentioned B&L but I think I just saw one pair during the 3 day event. A few Minox binos were around, which was interesting..... apparently they have some very good products on the market according to very respected sources.

regards,
Andy

Andy Bright said:

I'd suggest that because birding has been a significant pastime in the U.K. (and maybe Northern Europe) for far longer than it has in North America, we see far more older high quality binos still in use... which invariably means Zeiss and Leica.
regards,
Andy

Click to expand...

I cannot say that I am in total agreement, Andy, because the Americans have been innovative in so many ways. ABA, Bird Races, year listing, National listing have all come from America. Perhaps they are more competitive than we are.

What's a "bird race?"