Nikon...over optimistic retail pricing...in the UK (1 Viewer)

Greetings all,

I've recently been drawn in to the discussions relating to the new Monarch series and other new Nikon offerings and just can't help thinking having tried them all out that Nikon are being somewhat over optimistic when it comes to retail pricing.

I remember being at Birdfair a couple of years ago when the M7 was about to be launched. I thought the 8x42 binoculars were ok, significant edge softness etc... And everything else that's been said about them since etc... I was surprised by the price at the time , retail £549 and I remember as I compared them directly with the Monarch MKiii that I didn't think they were worth the extra £200. I do remember the rep on the Nikon stand being a bit sheepish about the price, assuring me that he thought the price would fall significantly once the product had settled.

Having just purchased and now returned the Monarch 5 8x42 which retails at £399 I am drawn to the same conclusion....they are both overpriced in a retail price context. To me this is clear as we see retailers offering both models at significantly reduced discounts, I paid under £250 for the recently purchased Monarch 5, and given current competitive offerings from Opticron, Hawke, Helios, Vanguard etc...in the UK anyway are IMO still overpriced at this price point.

My final example is the new Aculon, Porro binoculars, a direct replacement for the Action series and still with wobbly bridge issue. Having purchased the Aculon 7x35 I was hoping for a little more. like the previous Action and Action EX, the best of the line up IMO the Aculons still boast the very average , some might say poor optical coatings suffered by the previous line up. This binocular retails at a staggering £169. thankfully some retailers are offering this particular model at around £69 which IMO is much closer to its true value.

All in all I can't help thinking ' It's a nikon - expect to pay more'

just my opinion of course.

regards

Steve

..........in fact , I'm going to stick my neck out a bit more on the above thread.

I'm critical of Nikon UK for the exaggerated retail pricing on the M7, M5 and Aculon for the UK markets as Nikons retail pricing on these products create a misconception that in the case of the Monarch 5 for example, with a retail price of £399 a bargain is to be had when purchased for sub £250. The reality is that they are just about worth this discounted price to begin with. This is how I see the true value of these products

Monarch 7 8x42 Nikon retail £549, true value more like £349
Monarch 5 8x42 Nikon retail £399, true value more like £199
Aculon 7x35 Nikon retail £169, true value more like £79

The above is based on competitors offering similar glass and enhanced prism coatings available in the UK.



A good example of a superior product to the Monarch 5 8x42 is the non ED Opticron Natura BGA 8x42 with dielectric prism coatings currently at a very similar price point to a Heavily discounted Monarch 5. It is brighter, sharper and has a much more neutral colour rendered image, is made in Japan, has superior build quality and comes with a 30 year guarantee.

thankfully most manufacturers are setting realistic and sensible retail pricing for optics.

just my opinion of course.......

Steve

Well, my gripe with Nikon, coming from a nation where spectacle usage is high, is eye relief. I mean, come on, 15 /14 mm relief? if you are lucky? what a way to bird...glasses on, glasses off...

I guess every one has their own opinion of worth, but Nikons ED82 is an absolute steal...but the eye relief is abysmal and thus negates the bargain nature of the optics.

Weird company for sure.

Seems that Nikon has better price policy in U.S there is arround 450$.
I bought M7 in Slovakia for 450€, and after half year changed it for SE.
IMHO was not competetive to Made in China ED bins. I think that M7 needs APO triplet objective, and Field flattener, which lacks. Customers will be pleased with it. Finally Nikon launched anti-scratch coating on M7, but I think that water repellent - easy cleaning coating is lagging. Hope that Nikon introduce it soon.

Best regards Kestrel

kestrel1 said:

Seems that Nikon has better price policy in U.S there is arround 450$.
I bought M7 in Slovakia for 450€, and after half year changed it for SE.
IMHO was not competetive to Made in China ED bins. I think that M7 needs APO triplet objective, and Field flattener, which lacks. Customers will be pleased with it. Finally Nikon launched anti-scratch coating on M7, but I think that water repellent - easy cleaning coating is lagging. Hope that Nikon introduce it soon.

Best regards Kestrel

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I don't think Nikon can put costly 3 element APO objectives and Field Flatteners on the Monarch 7s and still keep their prices any where near they are now.

Bob

Ratal said:

Well, my gripe with Nikon, coming from a nation where spectacle usage is high, is eye relief. I mean, come on, 15 /14 mm relief? if you are lucky? what a way to bird...glasses on, glasses off...

I guess every one has their own opinion of worth, but Nikons ED82 is an absolute steal...but the eye relief is abysmal and thus negates the bargain nature of the optics.

Weird company for sure.

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Indeed, what a way to bird, particularly for $1.5- $2K+!

The Nikon 8x42 Monarch 5 has 19.5mm ER! Nothing to complain about there except the narrowish 6.3* FOV.

If you need long ER, Nikon tops the others with their Premier and EDG series at the premium level.

Premier 8x42 (20mm ER)
EDG 8x42 (19mm ER)

Compare that to:

Leica 8x42 Ultravid HD (15mm ER!)
Leica 8x42 Trinovid (15.5mm ER)
Zeiss 8x42 FL (16mm ER)
Zeiss 8x42 HT (16mm ER)
Swaro 8x42 SLC (new) (18.5mm ER).
Swaro 8.5x42 SV LE (20mm ER)

Out of the top contenders, only Swarovski can match or come close to Nikon ER specs.

Two ways to get high ER bins (1) use simple EP design - trade-off, narrowish FOV like the M5, or (2) make a WF complex EP that cost $$$.

AI agree that Nikon's pricing in the UK has been overblown, but I wonder if the discounts on the M5 may be due to the introduction of the upgraded ED model, not sure, but I'd be far more upset about the fact that I paid over $2K for a premium roof with 15-16mm ER if I were an eyeglass wearer. Some people have flat facial features and glasses that sit back on their face, so they can get away with it, but a lot of people need more ER. Leica and Zeiss both know that, but continue to ignore the four-eyed birder!

Brock

brocknroller said:

Although I agree that Nikon's pricing in the UK has been overblown, and the discounts on the M5 may be due to the introduction of the upgraded ED model, not sure, but I'd be far more upset about the fact that I paid over $2K for a premium roof with 15-16mm ER if I were an eyeglass wearer. Some people have flat facial features and glass that sit back on their face, so they can get away with it, but a lot of people need more ER. Leica and Zeiss both know that, but continue to ignore the four-eyed birder!

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Interestingly I don't know that many birders over here who complain about the eye relief of their Zeiss and/or Leica bins. And there are still plenty of those around in my neck of the woods.

Those who complain loudest are usually those who only know these bins from their technical specifications.

Hermann

Hermann said:

Interestingly I don't know that many birders over here who complain about the eye relief of their Zeiss and/or Leica bins. And there are still plenty of those around in my neck of the woods.

Those who complain loudest are usually those who only know these bins from their technical specifications.

Hermann

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I have glasses, although I don't wear them for birding, but I have tried them with my bins.

With the HT, I get the best view with glasses on - a perfect circle FOV with almost no fieldstop visible. The FL works almost as well, with a bit more fieldstop visible but still the full FOV.

I have a friend that wears glasses when birding, and he has found the SV to have inadequate eye-relief but the HT/FL sufficient - so specs do not tell the tale for each person.

ceasar said:

I don't think Nikon can put costly 3 element APO objectives and Field Flatteners on the Monarch 7s and still keep their prices any where near they are now.

Bob

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Yes , I would accept that soution at higher price, if price will be on par with Conquest, Mckinley or similar priced HD models. Many peoples expecting better performance from M7, and think that it does not bring binocular which will compete to Chinese ED bins. I changed M7 to SE, which was worth higher price than M7.

With reference to Steve's original post here's some comparative pricing for the Nikon Monarch 5 8x56 :

£720.00 / $1152.00 at Nikon Store.uk

£620.00 / $992.00 on Amazon.uk

£470.00 / $750.00 on Amazon.usa

£370.00 / $590.00 retailer in Japan

Although I am a dedicated user of Nikon optics you rather get the feeling that 'brands' are simply a comfort blanket for consumers and much that is seen as 'value' in the market place is simply 'perceived value' rather than 'real value' be it either prestige or monetary.

Don't forget that the UK price on Amazon includes 20% VAT whilst the US price does not include sales tax. That would make the UK listing $800 ish at $1.55/£1.

Cheers, Pete

Inflated MSRP or suggested retail is a part of pricing for a lot of consumer goods from new cars to binoculars to shaving cream. Consumers have learned to expect good deals so the mark-it-up-to-mark-it-down school of pricing is with us for the long haul. To me the retail price is what it the binoculars sell for. Some rug merchants, jewelers and electronics dealers carry the mark-up game to extremes with perpetual 70% off sales.

Amazon.com now have the Monarch 7 8X42 at only $380 = £239
Allowing for + 20% for VAT would put it at £287

Amazon.co.uk has it at £409

So we pay a whopping £122 or 42% more for the privilege of buying from Nikon UK.

By the way this is a great forum. I have just joined and am considering a wide angle 8x42 pair of good binoculars. My old CZJ Deltrintem 8x30 are showing signs of wear and tear after many years of sterling service.

paul530a said:

considering a wide angle 8x42 pair of good binoculars

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Welcome, Paul, there are some nice choices in wider angle 8x42.

Vortex Diamondback is popular, the Celestron Granite may be better, then there's always Zeiss ! What's your price range ?

Samandag said:

Vortex Diamondback is popular, the Celestron Granite may be better, then there's always Zeiss ! What's your price range ?

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Thanks for the recommendations, I'll certainly look at them. I'm thinking somewhere around the £300-400 range.

As stated I believe this is in response to the market demanding sales or bargains! Nikon is saying I want to achieve a price of say 200 so I'll price at 300.

Its is happy to keep its price at 300 and encourage customers down the third party route - ie buy elsewhere at 200. This reduces its need for large sales departments and the need to deal with individuals. The bottom line is they are still getting the price they need for the product and the customer is getting a 'bargain'.

This has been going on for years in the retail market. The premium brands will have contracts limiting the amount of discount that can be given on their products - a lot of the time this will come out of the sellers commision - hence you don't see those in 'sales'. This strengthens the brand in the exclusive stakes where constant 'bargains' devalue the brand.