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Old Tuesday 4th January 2011, 06:56   #1
balex78
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Gull ID , Italy

Hello,

I digiscoped this gull on a lake here in north western Italy on 12/30/2010.
I would identify it as a Lesser black backed gull ssp intermedius or dutch integrade...Is that correct?

There's something strange about this bird though..Shouldn't winter individual have some dark and clearly visible streakings on head?? This bird's head is completely white and clean!

Could it be a Larus fuscus fuscus (Baltic gull) ???

here's the link:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/48743015@N03/5309509548/

thanks to all in advance
Alex
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Old Tuesday 4th January 2011, 19:12   #2
tittletattler
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Originally Posted by balex78 View Post
Hello,

I digiscoped this gull on a lake here in north western Italy on 12/30/2010.
I would identify it as a Lesser black backed gull ssp intermedius or dutch integrade...Is that correct?

There's something strange about this bird though..Shouldn't winter individual have some dark and clearly visible streakings on head?? This bird's head is completely white and clean!

Could it be a Larus fuscus fuscus (Baltic gull) ???

here's the link:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/48743015@N03/5309509548/

thanks to all in advance
Alex
Hi Alex,

From early December onwards, a few Lesser Black-backeds here in SE England start to attain a white headed appearance as they lose their streaks. Now, I have quite a lot locally which look like your bird. Your bird is quite dark so I'd guess it's an intermedius but I find it very hard to tell.

What is interesting is that the most of the primary tips appear dark. I wonder what the reason for that is?

Cheers,

Andy.
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Old Tuesday 4th January 2011, 21:37   #3
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Can't see why this couldn't be fuscus. Though it impossible to be sure ofcourse.
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Old Tuesday 4th January 2011, 21:37   #4
lou salomon
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it's not excluded that this is a nominate fuscus. but could be intermedius though. primary tips? - either a 4 cy intermedius or an adult fuscus with worn off white tips (remember that fuscus usually suspends moult until arrival in tropical wintering grounds so these would be old primaries. maybe an indice that it is nominate fuscus - but impossible to separate from black mantled intermedius.
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Old Tuesday 4th January 2011, 22:33   #5
tittletattler
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remember that fuscus usually suspends moult until arrival in tropical wintering grounds so these would be old primaries. maybe an indice that it is nominate fuscus - but impossible to separate from black mantled intermedius.
Thanks Lou. That's useful to know!

Cheers,

Andy.
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Old Wednesday 5th January 2011, 07:46   #6
balex78
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Thanks a lot guys. I initially thought of fuscus ssp also because of the slender and long bill (an intermedius individual generally has a shorter bill), the long primary projection and the slender general build of the bird!
Could these characters also point towards a Larus fuscus fuscus?

Thanks
Alex
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Old Wednesday 5th January 2011, 11:56   #7
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Living in northern Sweden we allmost only have fuscus. Some ssp Heuglini? and some Intermedius as well seen in spring up here.

Alex, your bird could be a fuscus but you can´t be 100% sure to exclude a dark intermedius. Shape is not useful. Back-colour is often difficult to judge on pictures as it often differs depending on the angle. Back-colour looks dark with a greyish tone that´s within the range of fuscus (and Intermedius) IMO.
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