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Kowa genesis 8x33 (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Jods
- Start date
Jods,
I've only tried the 8x33 and 8.5x44 fairly briefly an the UK Bird Fair. Under very bright conditions I thought the 8.5x44 was sharpest of all the binoculars including the alpha brands I tested. The 8x33 was very close. In an odd sort of way I found the view a little underwhelming. Just too natural if that can be a fault. I suppose it must be the tweaks in the transmission profile in the the Nikons and Swaros for example that seem add a little vibrancy. The slight softening and field curvature at the edges just seemed 'real' rather than the slightly surreal, flat sharp edges of the EDG or EL SV for example. If I was being hyper-picky I thought the ergonomics weren't quite the best out there. A top class binocular, but maybe not everyone's first choice with an unlimited budget IMO.
David
I've only tried the 8x33 and 8.5x44 fairly briefly an the UK Bird Fair. Under very bright conditions I thought the 8.5x44 was sharpest of all the binoculars including the alpha brands I tested. The 8x33 was very close. In an odd sort of way I found the view a little underwhelming. Just too natural if that can be a fault. I suppose it must be the tweaks in the transmission profile in the the Nikons and Swaros for example that seem add a little vibrancy. The slight softening and field curvature at the edges just seemed 'real' rather than the slightly surreal, flat sharp edges of the EDG or EL SV for example. If I was being hyper-picky I thought the ergonomics weren't quite the best out there. A top class binocular, but maybe not everyone's first choice with an unlimited budget IMO.
David
brocknroller
porromaniac
Hey Jods,
Another hearty welcome to BF!
Haven't tried the baby Kowas, but you might want to read allbinos' review while waiting for other comments to be posted:
http://www.allbinos.com/182-binoculars_review-Kowa_Genesis_8x33.html
One comment that's important to note in this review, and something that I have taken issue with in Arek's reviews, is his use of the phrase "well-corrected distortion" as an optical attribute to be desired with bins used for terrestrial hobbies.
"Well-balanced distortion" would be a legitimate term for a bin where angular momentum distortion and pincushion were in a good balance, but that wouldn't apply to the 8x33 Kowa since it has very low distortion, something Arek likes, but that I don't, because significantly more AMD than pincushion can create a "rolling ball" effect -- if you are susceptible.
Most people aren't, so you probably won't have to worry about this, but it still helps to "Try before you buy" or find a store with a generous return period because if you do see "rolling ball," it might take some time to adjust to it.
"Rolling ball" is where the image appears to roll over a positively curved surface as you pan or tilt with the binoculars. If you see it, it can be very distracting since it makes you aware of the optics, and ideally, you want to see birds that look like they do through your eyes, but 8x closer, rather than birds that look like they're reflected in a Funhouse mirror.
If you're new to optics, what I just wrote probably sounds like gobbledegook. It simply means that when optics are made for terrestrial use, the designers usually add some degree of pincushion, which bends straight lines inward, so that the landscape looks natural while panning with the bins.
Too much pincushion or way too little and you might see a "rolling motion" when you pan. Since your eyes contain pincushion, you are more likely to note when there's too much pincushion rather than when there's not enough.
Some people (me included) who don't have enough distortion in their eyes will not be able to compensate for the lack of it in optics, and will see the "rolling ball effect" where the image will appear to roll over a positively curved surface, similar to a globe, as they pan the landscape with the bin. This is also called the "globe effect". Here's more info about it if you care to delve deeper.
It's a technical report, but don't get scared off by the equations, Holger's illustrations make clear what he's talking about.
http://holgermerlitz.de/globe/distortion.html
Ideally, you'd like to have the distortion in bins well balanced so the image neither rolls under or rolls over a curved surface, but appears as it does to your eyes. But since people's eyes differ, what's ideal for one person isn't necessarily ideal for another, but there is a typical range, as Holger shows.
The other issue with the 8x33 Kowa is fairly common with midsized roofs, and that is truncated exit pupils (exit pupils are the light cones coming from the eyepieces to your eyes). This cutoff is usually due to the prisms being undersized so as to keep the bulk and weight more manageable. But if the exit pupils are vignetted, you're not getting all the light to your eyes that you should with this size configuration.
Compare the Kowa's exit pupils to the Zeiss 8x32 FL in allbinos' review of that bin, and you'll see that despite the bin's small size, the cut off of the exit pupils is minimal.
http://www.allbinos.com/191-binoculars_review-Carl_Zeiss_Victory_8x32_T*_FL.html
The FL costs about $400 more than the Kowa, but from all the rave reviews on these forums, and its reputation as being the brightest 8x32 roof on the market, it would seem worth the extra $$$$ if you can afford it and are looking for a compact-sized 8x32 that delivers sharp, bright images.
I suggest you check out the 8x32 FL in the BF reviews section and also on the Zeiss forum and more importantly compare it with the 8x33 Kowa at a store.
There's more than exit pupils and distortion levels that makes one bin better than another for any given individual - ergonomics, handling, eyecup comfort, diopter control, and focusing - among others.
What looks better on "paper" doesn't always translate to what looks better to your eyes or feels better in your hands. But reviews at least give you a starting place to find out which bins you want to try.
Brock
Another hearty welcome to BF!
Haven't tried the baby Kowas, but you might want to read allbinos' review while waiting for other comments to be posted:
http://www.allbinos.com/182-binoculars_review-Kowa_Genesis_8x33.html
One comment that's important to note in this review, and something that I have taken issue with in Arek's reviews, is his use of the phrase "well-corrected distortion" as an optical attribute to be desired with bins used for terrestrial hobbies.
"Well-balanced distortion" would be a legitimate term for a bin where angular momentum distortion and pincushion were in a good balance, but that wouldn't apply to the 8x33 Kowa since it has very low distortion, something Arek likes, but that I don't, because significantly more AMD than pincushion can create a "rolling ball" effect -- if you are susceptible.
Most people aren't, so you probably won't have to worry about this, but it still helps to "Try before you buy" or find a store with a generous return period because if you do see "rolling ball," it might take some time to adjust to it.
"Rolling ball" is where the image appears to roll over a positively curved surface as you pan or tilt with the binoculars. If you see it, it can be very distracting since it makes you aware of the optics, and ideally, you want to see birds that look like they do through your eyes, but 8x closer, rather than birds that look like they're reflected in a Funhouse mirror.
If you're new to optics, what I just wrote probably sounds like gobbledegook. It simply means that when optics are made for terrestrial use, the designers usually add some degree of pincushion, which bends straight lines inward, so that the landscape looks natural while panning with the bins.
Too much pincushion or way too little and you might see a "rolling motion" when you pan. Since your eyes contain pincushion, you are more likely to note when there's too much pincushion rather than when there's not enough.
Some people (me included) who don't have enough distortion in their eyes will not be able to compensate for the lack of it in optics, and will see the "rolling ball effect" where the image will appear to roll over a positively curved surface, similar to a globe, as they pan the landscape with the bin. This is also called the "globe effect". Here's more info about it if you care to delve deeper.
It's a technical report, but don't get scared off by the equations, Holger's illustrations make clear what he's talking about.
http://holgermerlitz.de/globe/distortion.html
Ideally, you'd like to have the distortion in bins well balanced so the image neither rolls under or rolls over a curved surface, but appears as it does to your eyes. But since people's eyes differ, what's ideal for one person isn't necessarily ideal for another, but there is a typical range, as Holger shows.
The other issue with the 8x33 Kowa is fairly common with midsized roofs, and that is truncated exit pupils (exit pupils are the light cones coming from the eyepieces to your eyes). This cutoff is usually due to the prisms being undersized so as to keep the bulk and weight more manageable. But if the exit pupils are vignetted, you're not getting all the light to your eyes that you should with this size configuration.
Compare the Kowa's exit pupils to the Zeiss 8x32 FL in allbinos' review of that bin, and you'll see that despite the bin's small size, the cut off of the exit pupils is minimal.
http://www.allbinos.com/191-binoculars_review-Carl_Zeiss_Victory_8x32_T*_FL.html
The FL costs about $400 more than the Kowa, but from all the rave reviews on these forums, and its reputation as being the brightest 8x32 roof on the market, it would seem worth the extra $$$$ if you can afford it and are looking for a compact-sized 8x32 that delivers sharp, bright images.
I suggest you check out the 8x32 FL in the BF reviews section and also on the Zeiss forum and more importantly compare it with the 8x33 Kowa at a store.
There's more than exit pupils and distortion levels that makes one bin better than another for any given individual - ergonomics, handling, eyecup comfort, diopter control, and focusing - among others.
What looks better on "paper" doesn't always translate to what looks better to your eyes or feels better in your hands. But reviews at least give you a starting place to find out which bins you want to try.
Brock
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marinemaster
Well-known member
I had the regular Kowa BD in 8x32, I did not like them at all, I don't know how much better/different the Genesis are, try them first.
14Goudvink
Well-known member
Holger Merlitz included the Kowa 8x33 in his review of 8x32 bins. See:
http://www.holgermerlitz.de/8x32/test8x32.html
He was impressed by them and ranked them just below Nikon EDG and Zeiss FL and on the same level as Leica HD.
The article is in German, but Google Translate should be able to help you out.
George
http://www.holgermerlitz.de/8x32/test8x32.html
He was impressed by them and ranked them just below Nikon EDG and Zeiss FL and on the same level as Leica HD.
The article is in German, but Google Translate should be able to help you out.
George
binomania
Well-known member
Hi! If you want to use google translate, there is also my review, in italian language,
Best Regards from Italy
Piergiovanni
george-spiridakis
Well-known member
Piergiovanni,
how did you find the Kowa's performance in low light conditions, compared with the rest and more specific with the Zeiss FL?
Also, the sweetspot of the Kowa's compared with the top of the line binos.
And more general, do you think that the Genesis is a good choice for a 8x32?
Do you think that it lags something noticeably compared with the top competitors?
Thanks in advance,
George
P.S.: I' ve read your review, but the google translate is very difficult for me and i prefer to ask you in person these more specific questions.
Brock, afraid that does. Try "magnification". Seems the rolling fixation has got a bit serious. Steady there!
PS in edit Clarification, if needed: angular magnification distortion.
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Kowa Genesis 8x33
I have a pair, they are better than OK but not by much.
The focusing wheel on my pair is hollow plastic, very flimsy and a bit wobbly.
The view is in my opinion just very slightly better than the Meopta 8x32 which have a much better focusing mechanism and are lighter.
IMHO the Meopta are a better value, the same view, better construction and lighter.
I was disappointed, for the money spent ($1,100.00) you can do better.
This is strictly my opinion based on a pair obtained three years ago, I hope that improvements have been made since then.
Art
I have a pair, they are better than OK but not by much.
The focusing wheel on my pair is hollow plastic, very flimsy and a bit wobbly.
The view is in my opinion just very slightly better than the Meopta 8x32 which have a much better focusing mechanism and are lighter.
IMHO the Meopta are a better value, the same view, better construction and lighter.
I was disappointed, for the money spent ($1,100.00) you can do better.
This is strictly my opinion based on a pair obtained three years ago, I hope that improvements have been made since then.
Art
John Russell
Well-known member
Did you buy it new and if it is so bad, why?
Every Kowa Genesis I have seen had a milled aluminium focusing wheel, which operated very precisely. Holger Merlitz and Piergiovanni Salimbeni of Binomania also commented in their tests of Kowa Genesis models on the precision and lack of play of the focusing.
John
oetzi
Well-known member
Mine, too. But its scraping a bit here and there when being turned through the whole arc and when "accelerating" the wheel very fast, there is a "clack" noise.
By comparison, a Leica Ultravid I happened to check out several weeks ago, had the same scraping plus 1+mm slack.
oetzi
Well-known member
Try google translate to english, it works much better (when compared italian to german anyway)
brocknroller
porromaniac
Angular momentum is the feeling I get while panning with a bin with excessive AMD, probably because I like to conserve energy. :bounce:
<RB>
brocknroller
porromaniac
Your Kowa focuser sounds more like the one on the BD model rather than the Genesis:
http://www.eagleoptics.com/external/media/images/586/bin-kw-bd32-8-m_original.jpg?1316172847
<RB>
Hello all:
Mine were an early pair, bought new from Eagle Optics about three+ years ago.
They were not what I expected in terms of optics, they focus fine and make good range glasses..I was using my Swaro EL's and they were getting dinged up.
Maybe the new ones are better, I just think for less money the Meopta's are a better buy.
I took mine in and compared them to the BD's and my focusing wheel was substandard compared to the BD wheel, very strange indeed, hollow plastic that is not used on any other Kowa product to my knowledge.
Kowa products are good to superb optically, especially the Genesis line if a bit overweight.
The box and all the paperwork say they are 8x33 Genesis and the bino's themselves are marked 8x33 and Genesis.
Art
Mine were an early pair, bought new from Eagle Optics about three+ years ago.
They were not what I expected in terms of optics, they focus fine and make good range glasses..I was using my Swaro EL's and they were getting dinged up.
Maybe the new ones are better, I just think for less money the Meopta's are a better buy.
I took mine in and compared them to the BD's and my focusing wheel was substandard compared to the BD wheel, very strange indeed, hollow plastic that is not used on any other Kowa product to my knowledge.
Kowa products are good to superb optically, especially the Genesis line if a bit overweight.
The box and all the paperwork say they are 8x33 Genesis and the bino's themselves are marked 8x33 and Genesis.
Art
Birdman7
Bird photographer
Kowa Genesis 10.5X44
I agree with Gulf1263 with regards the Kowa Genesis line, a tad on the heavy side, but i find that sort of helps as a counter balance and makes it feel good on the hands. I use the Kowa Genesis 10.5x44 and the clarity, sharpness and definition is insane!
I agree with Gulf1263 with regards the Kowa Genesis line, a tad on the heavy side, but i find that sort of helps as a counter balance and makes it feel good on the hands. I use the Kowa Genesis 10.5x44 and the clarity, sharpness and definition is insane!
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