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?Whinchat Today in Gloucestershire (1 Viewer)

changer400 said:
Yes

Bye Again.

Si ;)
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Comments like that make it all flare up. Maybe you are laughing to yourself but personally i am not taking it the same way as you. I am sure i am not the only one who doesnt like some of the negative comments that get thrown about on here sometimes (by a number of posters).

Why do we need people on here who call others 'stupid' just because they identify a bird incorrectly? Keeping this forum a friendly place where beginners and experts can both enjoy their hobby is far more important to us all than trying to win with sarcastic comments.

I don't want to make our hobby seem trivial but this forum is only about 'birds' not politics or religion why does there have to be so much back-biting and sarcasm and then trying to cover it up saying others have no sense of humour?

Its a shame because it does put off some beginners and regular posters who want to enjoy their hobby and contribute without fear of ridicule.
 
To the few who seem to get frustrated about answering a legitimate identification question on what you consider a common bird, we would ask that you refrain from posting in the theads if they upset you and you can't reply civily.

BirdForum did not reach its present stature by giving a new comer a hard time. BirdForum is for birders of all levels and as mentioned earlier, if you cannot cope with a kind suggestion for a question then just don't bother replying. It's really that simple.
 
Mark Payne said:
Whinchat in January, where was it seen again, south of the sahara ?
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Sorry to resurrect this thread, it has made entertaining reading about the basics of identification and the ethics of treating newcomers to birding. But I was taken by the sub-topic of Whinchats in the UK in January. I saw this yesterday and as you can see took a particularly lousey photo - but do you think there is enough there to believe it was a male Whinchat.......in February?
 

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I think that what appears to be a white eyebrow might just be sunlight reflecting. The throat looks quite dark, so although I ca't be certain, I think this is a stonechat.

Coincidentally today's 'bird of the day' on the BTO bird atlas websiteis the whinchat, with a scattering of winter records in the south.
 
I agree with Caper that it's a Stonechat. Stonechat, especially female Stonechat, can look similar to Whinchat and, being a chat, behave in a similar fashion. The super on a Whinchat is fairly obvious when perched and they seem to have a more "square-headed" look to me.
 
Capercaillie71 said:
Coincidentally today's 'bird of the day' on the BTO bird atlas websiteis the whinchat, with a scattering of winter records in the south.
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Am I alone in being worried about today's 'bird of the day' map? Are there really that many Whinchats currently wintering in the UK? One in Northern Ireland??

I can see three things;

- Whinchats do, very rarely, try to winter in the UK (for example, one did in Bucks a few years back).

- Anyone, regardless of experience or knowledge, can contribute to Birdtrack.

- This thread shows that some people struggle to ID Whinchats from Stonechats, and are prepared to believe they can be seen in the winter.

There appears to be birds reported from Lincs, Cornwall & Hants amongst others; any local birders able to shed any light on this? Any thoughts?

BT
 
TO ALL - by way of a little story - many years ago I had the pleasure to take around Bahrain someone known to you but to save his blushes he will remain anonymous here. He is in my opinion, one of the worlds leading ornithologists and birding authors however, on our first field trip out together he misidentified one of our more common species for a really rare one - oops he said after I, a mere mortal pointed out to the great man his mistake – I learnt that day that heros are not perfect but more to the point even great birders are human. To all those arrogant and patronising know it alls who have and continue to post some really nasty comments on this and other threads - I notice that when the ID is a difficult one to sort out you don’t participate in the thread or when you do you do, it is much later and always after a tentative conclusion has been reached.

One day soon I will retire from here and I hope to God that I don’t bump into any of you when I start birding back home in Wales.

PS I had a Whinchat here yesterday
 
BobTag said:
Am I alone in being worried about today's 'bird of the day' map? Are there really that many Whinchats currently wintering in the UK? One in Northern Ireland??

I can see three things;

- Whinchats do, very rarely, try to winter in the UK (for example, one did in Bucks a few years back).

- Anyone, regardless of experience or knowledge, can contribute to Birdtrack.

- This thread shows that some people struggle to ID Whinchats from Stonechats, and are prepared to believe they can be seen in the winter.

There appears to be birds reported from Lincs, Cornwall & Hants amongst others; any local birders able to shed any light on this? Any thoughts?

BT
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No, you're not alone... and I suspect that there are almost certainly people at the BTO who would think the same way. I hope so, anyway.

I can't see anything wrong with a healthy dose of scepticism either (or maybe it's actually just realism, based on experience). It's not a 'nasty' or 'patronising' comment - it's just pointing out that everyone is human, and that the data going into BirdTrack is not, and cannot be, perfect.
 
Howard King said:
To all those arrogant and patronising know it alls who have and continue to post some really nasty comments on this and other threads
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Howard, I can only assume that your rant was aimed at me.

What can I do? Re-read the post above and tell me how it wasn't constructive and objective, based on three points and asking for info - as dbradnum states; thanks.

Why suddenly fly off into such a rant? What as "really nasty" about what I've just written? Why can't a fact-based discussion take place? I only asked for info.

The BTO survey of our birds is very important, and many people (myself included) have willingly given a lot of time already, in year 1. What is wrong with discussing the data?

BT

PS - Really, this thread is full of old bad blood. I wish it hadn't been re-opened...
 
Wrong - Bob my comments where not intended for anybody in particular - but if the cap fits
-- anyhow it wasn't a rant it was more a dig - not aimed at you but at everything that PGTips, sibs, the constant use of jargon and all that stuff stands for. We were not all born into the 400 club, most of us are not in the UK and haven't a clue what your jargon means, many of us have a life outside birding and our expectations from our hobby and this forum are obviously totally different from that of the arrogant few who thinks before anybody picks up a pair of binoculars they should swallow a bird guide first. The best thing about this forum is the wide range of knowledge to be found - where else can a complete novice benifit from the advice of such experts. Birding is hard enough when you first start and if you are on your own even harder lets not add to the difficulties and put people off or push them away. We should all learn from our mistakes but then maybe there are on the forum some who haven't made one yet.
 
Howard King said:
Wrong - Bob my comments where not intended for anybody in particular - but if the cap fits
-- anyhow it wasn't a rant it was more a dig - not aimed at you but at everything that PGTips, sibs, the constant use of jargon and all that stuff stands for. We were not all born into the 400 club, most of us are not in the UK and haven't a clue what your jargon means, many of us have a life outside birding and our expectations from our hobby and this forum are obviously totally different from that of the arrogant few who thinks before anybody picks up a pair of binoculars they should swallow a bird guide first. The best thing about this forum is the wide range of knowledge to be found - where else can a complete novice benifit from the advice of such experts. Birding is hard enough when you first start and if you are on your own even harder lets not add to the difficulties and put people off or push them away. We should all learn from our mistakes but then maybe there are on the forum some who haven't made one yet.
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Howard, I do believe the "arrogant few" are indeed just that - few - and are best ignored. The alternative is to raise your blood pressure in arguments you just cannot win! It's the same in all fields, not just birding - I get the odd client at work who's heard something from a "bloke down the pub" and won't accept my explanation, based on 25 years experience, because it's not what he wants to hear. Case in point - it's a little exasperating to see dodgy records appearing on Birdnet, but that's probably the only place they will appear - they do get filtered, and certainly won't be in the Dorset report ;) At least Birdnet helps many "casual" birders feel that they are doing something worthwhile, and anything that makes people value birds and birding can't be a bad thing.
 
BobTag said:
Am I alone in being worried about today's 'bird of the day' map? Are there really that many Whinchats currently wintering in the UK? One in Northern Ireland??
Click to expand...

Of course the winter atlas started on 1 November, so some of these could be late stragglers, rather than truly overwintering birds.
 
Mods,

please close this thread or do i have to say 'pretty please' while kneeling in a praying motion, its was quite clearly a Reed bunting x Whinchat hybrid and lets leave it at that......
 
Thanks to Capercaillie and John C. - I think it's a good point about the sun shining over the eye, giving a false impression. I'll try to get over to the same spot with some more time to get a better ID & photo hopefully.

Sorry to all for opening some old wounds!
 
dbradnum said:
it's just pointing out that everyone is human, and that the data going into BirdTrack is not, and cannot be, perfect.
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Bodes well for the Atlas then....

I agree though, there's a lot of mid-id. You only have to look on the Identification threads on here to see that even people with a lot of experience can make mistakes. Not a lot you can do about it though, except maybe exclude such 'questionable' records from the Atlas. You may lose data, such as a new trend for Whinchats to be wintering, but it's always better to have no data than wrong data.
 
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