• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Vortex Talon HD 32mm class? Yes! (1 Viewer)

E

eitanaltman

Well-known member
I stumbled across this Vortex video on YouTube advertising their Talon HD binocular lineup: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PauT5PvytCY

I was surprised to see them note that the Talon HD is available in BOTH the 32mm and 42mm configurations, including both 8x32 and 10x32 models.

Say what? Never heard that before, never seen ANY of the "Chinese Open Bridge ED" bins in a 32mm configuration, no sign of Vortex Talon 32mm on any website.

So I emailed Vortex to ask, and they confirmed that it is true! There is a 32mm Vortex Talon HD coming in 2012. No advance specs, no other details.... so let the speculation begin!

Whaddya think? What open bridge Chinese ED designs are there that come in 32mm config? Is this going to come from the Vixen / Kenko / Sightron style? Or does one of the Zen ED / Vortex Talon / EO Ranger ED / Promaster / Hawke / Atlas Intrepid / etc. "family" already come in a 32mm design?
 
It should be pretty easy to figure out. Determine which Chinese manufacturer is producing the 42 mm Talons and then see what their 32 mm, open bridge offerings look like. I think xi'an had some attractive looking 32 mm ED glass bins.
 
Now up on the Eagle Optics website, both as the Vortex Talon HD 8x32 and as the Eagle Optics Ranger ED 8x32 (I presume the Vortex and the EO are essentially the same binocular, as the 42mm's are):

http://www.eagleoptics.com/binoculars/vortex/vortex-talon-hd-8x32-binocular

http://www.eagleoptics.com/binoculars/eagle-optics/eagle-optics-ranger-ed-8x32-binocular

(Also 10x32 versions in both brands)

A very, very nice spec for field of view (at least by the standards of today's birding bins): 477 ft. at 1000 yds. Now if only the focus is fast enough for small, fast-moving landbirds. Even if not, it might make a good specialty hawkwatching glass anyway.
 
nice catch!

477 ft!! :wowza:

not sure what they are a "clone" of, superficially possibly based on the Vixen New Foresta / Theron Wapiti LT 8x32 class? although of course that's a massive FOV compared to that 'family' of bins!
 
The FOV of both is about the same as the Nikon 8 x 30 EII. That is awful wide for an 8 x 32 Roof Prism. I'd like to compare one of them with my EII and see how they perform but I'm hesitant to drop $450.00 to do so. Lots of glass there and a complicated light path to wiggle through at that low price! The 10 x 32's also have a FOV of 378.' That's also very wide. Anyway they aren't in stock yet.

The new Vortex 8 x 32 and 10 x 32 Diamondbacks are also listed for under $200.00 but are not in stock yet either. 420' and 341' FOV respectively. They look short and weigh 18.4 ounces.

Bob
 
Last edited:
ceasar said:
The FOV of both is about the same as the Nikon 8 x 30 EII. That is awful wide for an 8 x 32 Roof Prism. I'd like to compare one of them with my EII and see how they perform but I'm hesitant to drop $450.00 to do so. Lots of glass there and a complicated light path to wiggle through at that low price! The 10 x 32's also have a FOV of 378.' That's also very wide. Anyway they aren't in stock yet.

The new Vortex 8 x 32 and 10 x 32 Diamondbacks are also listed for under $200.00 but are not in stock yet either. 420' and 341' FOV respectively. They look short and weigh 18.4 ounces.

Bob
Click to expand...

I preordered a pair of the 8x32 HD Vortex Talons. I will write my impressions of them when I get them. I like the EII like FOV and the size and weight of them. I believe 477' is the widest I have seen lately for an 8x roof.
 
I'm about to pre-order a pair myself. Curious to hear how they compare to the rock star of the 32mm class, those Sightrons, which are taking the world by storm....

The 477' FOV is sooooo enticing and if they can package the optical quality of the Talon HD / Zen ED3 class into a 32mm, 20oz body I am all in! I love the optics and ergonomics of my 8x43 ED3, and I am now a sucker for the open bridge feel, but they are a bit too bulky and heavy for my tastes. If the Talons can match the optical quality while shaving off an inch of length and 7oz I will be a happy camper.

Eagle Optics said they expect the 32mm Talons to be out early March (so soon!) and the black Ranger ED versions should arrive in May.
 
thanks for the link :) to be honest I stopped reading that thread a while ago!!

if Dennis' main concern is a better focus knob then he should be happy, Vortex knows how to make a good focus knob. Every one I have tried -- Fury 6.5x32, Viper 6x32, and Viper HD 8x32 -- had an awesome focus knob. Especially the Vipers. Not too loose, but very buttery smooth and not "stiff" at all. The Fury's are also quite nice but a wee bit looser/sloppier than the Vipers, you can feel the extra bit of engineering that went into the more expensive Viper line. Dennis is correct that Nikon makes very good focusers too, my wife's Monarch 10x42 isn't my favorite but it has great ergonomics and a really smooth focus knob (although much less tension than the Vortex Viper or Zen ED3, which my wife likes.... girl hands you know?).

My Zen ED3 (very similar to Vortex Talon) also has a very nice focus knob (much improved over the ED2) so I expect the Talon HD to be quite nice as well in this regard.

I am also not bothered, and actually *encouraged* by, the 15mm ER spec. I am a non-glasses-wearer who has lamented the push towards 18-20mm+ of ER, it makes it tough to use some of these modern bins without blackouts. I like to jam the eyecup into my eye socket so that 13-16mm ER range is really my sweet spot. For example, the 19.5mm of ER on the Viper 6x32 was too much for me, I was fighting blackouts, whereas the 16mm of the Viper 8x32 HD was juuuust right.

Having experience with Vortex products and several dielectric coated models, I am fully confident that it will be a high quality product, very bright and sharp in the center with great build quality. My only question is what comprises had to be made to get that 9.1* FOV? Obviously eye relief was one, but will it have excessive curvature and/or really poor edges?
 
eitanaltman said:
thanks for the link :) to be honest I stopped reading that thread a while ago!!

if Dennis' main concern is a better focus knob then he should be happy, Vortex knows how to make a good focus knob. Every one I have tried -- Fury 6.5x32, Viper 6x32, and Viper HD 8x32 -- had an awesome focus knob. Especially the Vipers. Not too loose, but very buttery smooth and not "stiff" at all. The Fury's are also quite nice but a wee bit looser/sloppier than the Vipers, you can feel the extra bit of engineering that went into the more expensive Viper line. Dennis is correct that Nikon makes very good focusers too, my wife's Monarch 10x42 isn't my favorite but it has great ergonomics and a really smooth focus knob (although much less tension than the Vortex Viper or Zen ED3, which my wife likes.... girl hands you know?).

My Zen ED3 (very similar to Vortex Talon) also has a very nice focus knob (much improved over the ED2) so I expect the Talon HD to be quite nice as well in this regard.

I am also not bothered, and actually *encouraged* by, the 15mm ER spec. I am a non-glasses-wearer who has lamented the push towards 18-20mm+ of ER, it makes it tough to use some of these modern bins without blackouts. I like to jam the eyecup into my eye socket so that 13-16mm ER range is really my sweet spot. For example, the 19.5mm of ER on the Viper 6x32 was too much for me, I was fighting blackouts, whereas the 16mm of the Viper 8x32 HD was juuuust right.

Having experience with Vortex products and several dielectric coated models, I am fully confident that it will be a high quality product, very bright and sharp in the center with great build quality. My only question is what comprises had to be made to get that 9.1* FOV? Obviously eye relief was one, but will it have excessive curvature and/or really poor edges?
Click to expand...


"Obviously eye relief was one, but will it have excessive curvature and/or really poor edges?"

THAT is the big question on these Talon's. What kind of edges and how big of a sweet spot will they have with the 9.1 degree field.The ER @ 15mm is perfect for me since I don't wear glasses either. I know the focus wheel will be smooth and the ergonomics should be great with the open bridge. If they have as big of a sweet spot and there edges are as good(Hope,Hope) as an EII then I will be happy. If not I will send them back.
 
To be honest, and after my experiences with the extra wide angle porros and the ZR ED2 7x36 I am having a hard time believing that there won't be either notable field curvature or notable pincushion in the image these bins are going to provide. It is the price point that is the primary indicator. Granted the Chinese are able to put together some great performance at any given price point but there has to be a limit to even what they can do.

Still, I would love to be proven wrong.

;)
 
Frank

These 8x32 Talon HD's have piqued my interest as well, but I'd have to agree with you, and suspect the sweetspot/edges would be a little suspect in this wide of a FOV. The best performer I've come across in an extra wide roof has been the 6.5x32 Meopro, so if Vortex could come close on the Talon HD, I'd be on them in a heartbeat.
 
More than the edge sharpness, the width in degrees of the sweet spot is what to look for.
My experience with many modern roofs is that they don't allow much turning of the eyes before blackouts occurs. For me that's no problem since I'm very fast with centering what I'm looking at.

So these Talons, both the 8x and the 10x are highly interesting for me as long as they have very good performance inside 60 degrees of the AFOV.
 
I think it's all about expectations. If you expect a $400 roof with a 477' FOV to have perfect edges like a Nikon Premier, then you are sure to be disappointed.

Personally, my expectation floor (hope) is "better than the 7x36 ED2". I am not close to expecting the sweet spot to be sharp for 90% of the FOV or having a perfectly flat field. Based on my experience with Zen ED2 and ED3, Vortex Fury, Vortex Viper, etc. my realistic expectation is that it should have an extremely bright view, be very sharp on axis, control lateral CA very well (absent in the center, slight outside of the center), be sharp throughout 60-70% of the FOV, and have a decent amount of pincushion.

So, for me, if it can outperform the 7x36 ED2 slightly like the ED3 or Viper HD does -- better sweet spot, a wee bit brighter, less curvature and better edge performance -- with good ergonomics in a compact, open bridge design, the Vortex warranty, and come in at under 20oz... it's a big winner. That is pretty much exactly what I want, like my 8x43 ED3 optically but shrunk down a bit, and the added FOV is a bonus.
 
eitanaltman said:
I think it's all about expectations. If you expect a $400 roof with a 477' FOV to have perfect edges like a Nikon Premier, then you are sure to be disappointed.

Personally, my expectation floor (hope) is "better than the 7x36 ED2". I am not close to expecting the sweet spot to be sharp for 90% of the FOV or having a perfectly flat field. Based on my experience with Zen ED2 and ED3, Vortex Fury, Vortex Viper, etc. my realistic expectation is that it should have an extremely bright view, be very sharp on axis, control lateral CA very well (absent in the center, slight outside of the center), be sharp throughout 60-70% of the FOV, and have a decent amount of pincushion.

So, for me, if it can outperform the 7x36 ED2 slightly like the ED3 or Viper HD does -- better sweet spot, a wee bit brighter, less curvature and better edge performance -- with good ergonomics in a compact, open bridge design, the Vortex warranty, and come in at under 20oz... it's a big winner. That is pretty much exactly what I want, like my 8x43 ED3 optically but shrunk down a bit, and the added FOV is a bonus.
Click to expand...

"I think it's all about expectations. If you expect a $400 roof with a 477' FOV to have perfect edges like a Nikon Premier, then you are sure to be disappointed."

I don't remember my Nikon Premier having perfect edges. Do they? I remember quite a bit of CA at the edge and that is what caused me to sell them. I would like to see an EII like view in this new glass but maybe I am dreaming.It's the first Chinese HD WA 8x32 so it should be interesting to see what the Chinese can do for $400.00.
 
eitanaltman said:
nice catch!

477 ft!! :wowza:

not sure what they are a "clone" of, superficially possibly based on the Vixen New Foresta / Theron Wapiti LT 8x32 class? although of course that's a massive FOV compared to that 'family' of bins!
Click to expand...

According to the Agent over here, The Talon is the same as the Eagle Ranger.
 
Caslad66 said:
According to the Agent over here, The Talon is the same as the Eagle Ranger.
Click to expand...

yes, we already knew that ;)

the question I was really asking is what factory in China they are coming from.

It is a known fact that the Eagle Optics Ranger ED and the Vortex Talon HD are clones, but it is *also* known that the 42mm versions are essentially the same design as the Zen-Ray ED series, Hawke Frontier, etc. This was obvious from the outward appearance and identical specs (like 426' FOV for all the 8x43 versions). Similarly, we know that bins like the Theron Wapiti LT 32mm are the same thing as Vixen New Foresta, etc.

any time a new "China bin" appears you can usually get a good prognosis for what its performance will be like by identifying similar "clones". Like I said, we already know about the 42mm versions being that standard "open bridge ED" china bin, and thus everyone predicted (correctly) that the Talon HD / Ranger ED would perform essentially the same as the Zen-Ray ED2. Someone even can identify the Chinese source: http://www.united-optics.com/Produc...tdoor_Binoculars/BW16_Series/BW16_Series.html

So, the point is that when the 32mm class was introduced, it doesn't really look like any of the "known quantities" already on the market. Thus my question ;) There is no 32mm open bridge china-bin with a 477' FOV out there (AFAIK) so the performance of these new Talon/Ranger 32mm models is up for speculation.
 
Warning! This thread is more than 12 years ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.

Similar threads

N
SF 42 & 32 Brief Comparisons
Replies
8
Views
2K
Scott98
S
B
Nikon Monarch 7 8x30, 10x30 vs Vortex Diamondback HD 8x32
Replies
4
Views
6K
ZDHart
Z
yarrellii
Let’s talk about eyecups (comfort, dimensions, preferences, etc.)
2 3
Replies
53
Views
8K
Patudo
P
Troubador
Zeiss Binocular Design: A Personal Overview Part 2
2 3
Replies
47
Views
7K
eronald
E
R
Athlon Midas 8x42 vs. Viper HD vs. Vanguard ED II
2
Replies
25
Views
11K
dries1
dries1

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 2 (members: 0, guests: 2)
Back
Top