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North Cliffe East Yorkshire Area- a disturbing incident 2nd January 2011 (1 Viewer)

annesi

Well-known member
Dear All

I am just curious to see if anyone else on Birdforum has encountered the same problem when birding in the North Cliffe area of East Yorkshire.

I was birding from the car (specifically about half way along the length of the minor road running between the A163 and North Cliffe village) this last Sunday (2nd January) whilst on my way between North Duffield Carr and North Cave YWT reserve. It’s a journey I have done many times in the past, stopping along the way to bird watch, and have encountered no previous problems.

I had been parked there no more than three minutes or so when I was approached by a young lady in a grey BMW 4x4. She completely blocked my vehicle in, even thought it was parked safely and legally, rendering me temporarily unable to move from my parking spot. As far as I am aware this stretch of road is not private and there are no highway signs indicating “no stopping”, so I wasn’t aware of breaking any laws whatsoever- I was only carrying out my usual weekend hobby of bird watching.

The young lady demanded to know what I was doing, so I explained I was a bird watching, a member of York Ornithological Club and on my way to North Cave wetlands. She informed me that there had been a number of burglaries in the area (I’m not sure if this particular individual thought I was a member of the criminal fraternity- who knows what other people think?). She asked me to move on, so I immediately moved my vehicle as requested and was practically escorted off the remaining stretch of road back to North Cliffe, even though it’s a public highway.

Although I can thoroughly appreciate that rural crime is a very serious and very real issue for residents in country areas, this whole incident has left me somewhat shaken.
I gained the distinct impression from this incident that bird watching, or for that matter even stopping your vehicle for even the shortest length of time, in the North Cliffe area is not welcome.
It will certainly make me consider very carefully whether to bird watch or even drive my vehicle at all in that particular part of East Yorkshire again.

Humberside Police and several of the appropriate authorities have been informed in writing about the incident and my concerns, so I am awaiting their response. However, I’m very interested to see if anyone else on the forum has encountered any similar problems in that particular area.

Let’s hope that this is just a one off incident- I wouldn't like to think it was the shape of things to come in rural areas….

Kind regards
Anne
 
Hi Anne

I’ve spent many hours birding in the area you mention, although not in the last few months. The only problems I have come across are speeding drivers, especially along the road past North Cliffe Woods.

It seems to me that a local (and perhaps not the most intelligent one at that) mistook you for a burglar who was on the lookout for items of value. As you say, rural crime is a big problem and often the criminals spend a fair amount of time watching an area in the day time, evaluating security etc.

Perhaps a high dose of adrenaline clouded the BMW driver’s judgement a little. I would be interested to know how she would react to four burly men in a similar situation!

I certainly don’t think you should worry too much about it. It’s a public road and so long as you consider other road users, pedestrians etc (which I’m sure you do) the locals should leave you in peace. The BMW driver certainly had no business escorting you off the lane.
 
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Maybe she is the burgler and wanted you out of the way so she could do her dirty deed...... I wouldn't let her put you off going to the places you enjoy
 
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Hi Anne

Sorry to hear about your experience. I haven't heard about any burglaries in the area and I live not far from there. Don't let such a silly women put you off as Mike has already said how she would react to four burly men in a similar situation!

Jules
 
Most Police Forces have a/some dedicated wildlife officers perhaps ringing Humberside Police [hope this is the correct one] and asking for the Wildlife Officer that covers this patch....He may be a bit hard to get hold of as on some forces they do this alongside other policing duties. They may be able to tell you what action to take etc when this happens

My first thought would have been to contact the police as this happened on my mobile [worth having your local forces no in mobile] and told them what was happening that you are being blocked in by a member of public who is questioning your validity to be there[it is highly unlikely that any person on the wrong side of the law is going to ring up ad say by the way I am here come and get me"] At least you would call her bluff, I hope that you got her reg no to pass onto police as well.

You will find that quite a lot of the Wldlife officers are actually into Birding themselves, in fact our local one is a member of BF.
 
I'd have ignored her request and told her to phone the police if my presence was a problem as they'd know the legal side of things. Nobody has the right to tell you to leave a public area without a very good reason.
 
You're right in saying that rural crime is a big issue, and the woman was doing what she thought was her civic duty by checking out a unknown car. She clearly went well beyond this though in asking you to move off, and I can't help asking why you agreed to do so? You knew you were doing no harm so, unless you felt physically threatened, why move? Maybe plenty of return trips to the same spot (preferably by a range of birders) would be the next step.

Mike
 
Hi all

Thanks for all your replies. Thanks Marmot- Goods advice regarding the mobile. Unfortunately I'm one of those people who usually have their phone on me but very rarely has it switched on unless I need to make a call. I seem to remember in the past that my Mobile doesn't have the best signal in the Cave/Cliffe area. If anything like this incident ever happens again then I might just give the police an immediate call and get them to attend. I'm not sure where the local police station is in the Cliffe area - either South or North Cave I would think- assuming that there is one in the area. Most of the local police stations here in York only allow contact via the non emergency police number nowadays. Gone are the days you could ring up the "Nick" on Fulford Road in York or at Strensall and get a quick response from a local "bobby".
I must stress that when this incident was happening, that although it was all handled fairly pleasantly, the whole thing made me really uneasy. There was a second vehicle travelling with the BMW, which parked a little way up the road. The BMW driver had blocked me in, left the vehicle and was approaching my car. Being a lone female birder, in the middle of nowhere, blocked in and being approached by a stranger it is amazing what goes through your mind (car hijacking etc). Yes Apodemus I did feel physically threatened when she approached, even though I was behind the locked doors of my car, especially as I was aware of that second vehicle parked nearby.
Had I been one of the criminal fraternity then I suspect my first thoughts would have been to get away, even if it meant resorting to removal of the BMW by whatever means- not a nice thought at all but you never know how the criminal mind works. Maybe that's just me- perhaps I spent too much time watching detective series on the TV in my youth and have got paranoid about people in my old age! Still living in the city it pays to be careful.
I think one of my major concerns, which I pointed out in my letter to the police, was that the young lady had put herself in needless danger. She didn't know who I was; I was a complete stranger, and she was out of the car approaching me not knowing if I was going to do her any harm. I'm fairly sure I would not have thrown caution to the wind and taken the same course of action as the young lady. My instincts would have been to stay in my car, get the number of the suspect vehicle and ring the police, observing from a safe distance if necessary and not putting myself at needless risk.
Unfortunately I was unable to get her plate number. Her car was parked right in front of me. I was at about right angles to her car. The road bends where I was parked and so I was able to tuck the car away at the side of the road, nice and safe and completely off the carriageway, and well away from the entrance to a field which was nearby. When her car reversed back, allowing me to immediately pull away, I didn't get chance to check out the plate- all I wanted to do was get away! I tried to look at the plate as I drove along the lane but as it was icy and rutted on that road I needed my full attention for driving. I didn't want to risk skidding or breaking a spring on the car by hitting a hole. I’ve been down the spring route early last year thanks to pot holes- a £1200 bill and no car for days on end as it had to make three visits to the garage to fix the damage.
Yes I’ll certainly agree that I could have refused to move as the woman had no legal right to move me on as I was not commenting a crime. No doubt the lady thought she was doing public duty when she saw something she viewed as suspicious. Yes I could have called the police on 999 and got them to attend and sort it out there and then. However I felt this was not the best course of action at the time. The situation may have escalated if I’d refused to comply - not good plan with no one else in the car to help me and me twenty odd miles from my home patch. My other worry was that it probably wouldn’t have put any future visiting birders in a good light if I’d created a huge scene with the woman. People tend to remember incidents which leave a bad impression for a very long time.
I'll see what response I get from the authorities from the letters I sent. The authorities have been informed of who I am, what my birding credentials are and also my employment. It is up to them to check out the information I have given them and request any appropriate references from my employer and relevant bird watching organisations. I shouldn’t have to go to this extent to prove to them that I was not in the area to commit any crime, that I was only in fact bird watching. However the details are all there in the letter and have been freely given with my consent to follow it up if necessary. It’s up to the authorities what they do with it-I have nothing whatsoever to hide.
Also it wasn't my aim at all to risk getting the young lady in trouble with the police or anything; I just want to make sure that she and the other members of her community don't put themselves at unnecessary risk by not considering the full implications of their actions.
I think my main hope in sending the letters is that the police or other agencies will now be aware of what has happened and hopefully it will get them to give some advice to the resident's on how to go about dealing with anything they see as suspicious. Here in York we have things called Ward Committees which are organised by the local ward of the council. They happen about once every couple of months and the police attend. If a crime issue of concern has come up the local police offer advice. It’s all done informally and in a relaxed atmosphere. Something similar might be worth them trying in that community to raise awareness.
I'll await the response to the letters with baited breath....
I'm hoping the whole experience hasn't tainted what I feel about that area of East Yorkshire. There are some good birding sites- North Cave Wetlands especially is a credit to all concerned- no doubt there are other bird watching sites of a similar high standard nearby. Let's hope time will heal....
Kind regards
Anne
 
Settle down now lass, don't be put off......she probably boiled a couple of bunnies when she got home........!! Joe...:-O
 
I'd have found it hard not to be aggressive as I can be quite easily wound up at times. Depends on how the other person approaches me.

I've been trying to think how I would have reacted in the same situation. The truth is her shiny BMW would have ended up in a ditch.

Anne did very well to keep calm.
 
Best of luck next time Anne! I hope it hasn't put you off too much, although it does sound as though the whole experience unnerved you.

Mike
 
Best of luck next time Anne! I hope it hasn't put you off too much, although it does sound as though the whole experience unnerved you.

Mike

Get back out there!! I will make an effort to do so asap, do not let these people spoil it. She didn't realise that u were more likely to call police than any of her neighbours if you saw something suspicious! You acted responsibly and with great tact. I would have told her where to go..and call the police.And I would have sat there waiting for them to arrive...just to see the embarrassment on her face....but thats more a reflection of my current state of mind than the right thing to do....Once she had inevitably apologised...I would probably asked her out for a date..if she was attractive that is!!

Sorry, not very helpul ,but probably not far from truth!!;)

Paul
 
Get back out there!! I will make an effort to do so asap, do not let these people spoil it. She didn't realise that u were more likely to call police than any of her neighbours if you saw something suspicious! You acted responsibly and with great tact. I would have told her where to go..and call the police.And I would have sat there waiting for them to arrive...just to see the embarrassment on her face....but thats more a reflection of my current state of mind than the right thing to do....Once she had inevitably apologised...I would probably asked her out for a date..if she was attractive that is!!

Sorry, not very helpul ,but probably not far from truth!!;)

Paul

Wow,you're a brave lad Doc, wanting a date with a bunny boiler... :-O :t:
( or desperate ...?)
 
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the lady in question use the term loosley she sounds like a maggie thatcher.frustrated comes to mind.carry on regardles b---s to her.
 
Wow,you're a brave lad Doc, wanting a date with a bunny boiler... :-O :t:
( or desperate ...?)

Nice one..but be careful..the regulars on here will be soon complaining its a dating agency ..o:)

Seriously though.....get out and bird the area again...never had a problem myself...u must be good loooking;)

Paul
 
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