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Oberwerk Mariner 10x60? (1 Viewer)

EdZ over on CN included a number Marines in various comparisons a few years back. Holger looked at the Loava 10x50 IF version, and the United Optics 8x40 version of the Mariner.

I have an 12x50 IF version which would have the same eyepiece and prisms. Mine is optically very sharp, and low on CA and field curvature. Though over 90% transmission is claimed by the Chinese distributors, the colour rendition is not the best but I find it fine at long range. Like Hoger I found the actual entrance pupil was a little undersized. The stiff rubber eyecups are fairly unforgiving and I suspect some resort to trimming them to suite their ER. It is built like a brick. Overall I'd rate mine as excellent for the money. I believe the next model up, the Ultra, which is sold under various names, does colour better and gets good reviews.

David

Correction: It looks like the Mariner has twist-up eye cups now.
 
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Do let us know how you get on.

Over here the Olivon FZ series appears to be from the same source but they are more than double the Mariner price. IF versions are available from Strathspey.

David
 
I have used the Mariner 8x40. They have plastic eyecups that rotate in and out. I found that my eyes were a little too close together for these binoculars. The minimum IPD is at 62mm. If you are close, you might be tempted to snap the binoculars to the minimum spot. That snap will probably move the prisms off their mounting screws.

Over at Cloudy Nights one of the guys from Europe has the 10x60 and he like it! Right now Cloudy Nights is going through a new software upgrade. None of the forums are available.

I have looked through the 10x60 once. It was good.

I hope you like yours!
Sincerely,
Rob.
 
I have used the Mariner 8x40. They have plastic eyecups that rotate in and out. I found that my eyes were a little too close together for these binoculars. The minimum IPD is at 62mm. If you are close, you might be tempted to snap the binoculars to the minimum spot. That snap will probably move the prisms off their mounting screws.

Over at Cloudy Nights one of the guys from Europe has the 10x60 and he like it! Right now Cloudy Nights is going through a new software upgrade. None of the forums are available.

I have looked through the 10x60 once. It was good.

I hope you like yours!
Sincerely,
Rob.

Egads! "Snapping" the barrels to the minimum IPD causes the bin to lose collimation? Doesn't surprise me, really. Oberwerk has the wost prism seats of any bins I've tried. I had two 15x70 Obies, and both arrived out of collimation. The first sample was even initialed by the owner of Oberwerk, who had personally checked the collimation, so it was okay when it left his store in Ohio, but by the time it got to Pa., one state away, it was out.

Miscollimation is such a common problem with Obies that they have a webpage devoted on how to collimate the bins in case they go out or arrive knocked out.

Binocular Collimation

I knew about the Mariners being underspecked. The 8x40 is closer to an 8x32. But they look heavy duty (and weigh heavy duty), so I expected them to hold their collimation better, but I guess they use the same type of prism seat as the cheaper, lighter LW series.

I have read on CN that the Ultra series is supposed to have more robust prism seats, but they are IF EP bins, and I don't think Obie makes them. A lot of companies such as Orion and even Astrophysics, the high end APO refractor telescope maker, carry the Ultras under their brand name. I think they are made by General Hi-T.

ULTRAs

The shame is that the 15x70's optics were pretty good, but mechanically, they left a lot to be desired. Hopefully, Bryce won't have a problem with his Mariner, but if he does, he knows where to go for collimation instructions.

Brock
 
David, that one you referenced is not the one that is the Mariner at Oberwerk.

This is the one. BA3 Series at United Optics Link

I know that Brock can dismiss them, but they really have good features for the cheap price that they are sold for. The Prism is bigger sized than most consumer binoculars. That means they are heavier, and can be subject to knocks. I have taken care of mine. (except my hands betrayed me because I am slightly stronger than the average.) I have a 10x70 BA3 that are still true. I have my brother a 15x70 that is still going strong.

I know about the specifications that was discussed on Cloudy Nights. However, they still perform nicely.

I am glad that as a group, Birdform and Cloudy Nights speak up to the vendors for better details on their binoculars!
 
Brock,

Which of the Oberwerk 15x70s do you mean. The Lightweights (under various badges) decollimate if you sneeze on them:
http://www.bigbinoculars.com/1570.htm

Or the 5.5lb Ultras?
http://www.bigbinoculars.com/ultra70.htm

The Mariners are very solid, claimed to survive a 5m drop.
http://www.binocularschina.com/binoculars/Marine.html

On my IFs you can access the alignment screws.... just in case you try it. ;)

David

David,

They were both 15x70 LWs. In addition to arriving out of collimation, the right diopter was messed up. The markings showed 4 + or - diopters but I could barely reach focus, and I usually only need an adjustment of +1 diopter on most binoculars.

I apparently turned it too far and the eyecups housing came apart in my hands. It consisted of a rubber covering and underneath instead of metal housing like the Vixen 7x50 Foresta has, the tube under the rubber was made of cardboard! I couldn't believe it. Of course, they only cost $149, so you can't expect the best materials at that price point, but I never imagined the eyecup housing would be made of cardboard. Decent optics, poor mechanics.

I haven't tried the Mariner, it certainly looks well built, huge prism housings, but if there's truth to a rough IPD adjustment knocking them out of collimation, they are not as robust internally as they seem on the outside. Marine bins are supposed to be "Built Ford Tough."

I wrote a thread on CN many moons ago, titled "Haute Chinese," about the coming age when Chinese bins would have a better build quality than what was offered by Obie, and we do have better made Chinese bins today, but Obie keeps churning out the same cheaply made stuff year after year, so I guess there's a market for them, and enough people who don't mind having to collimate their binoculars.

They did introduce a series of roofs - Sport RP Series - which by virtue of them being roofs should be more robust, but looking at the prices, I have to wonder. They are as cheap as the LW porros, and no phase coatings:

Sport RP Series

Obies turned me off to Chinese bins. Then I took a chance and bought a Minolta 7x35 Activa WP FP. One eyecup was "floppy," but the ergonomics were very well done and the images in the center 2/3 of the field were sharp and bright, and the outer third was mostly field curvature. Those would have been keepers, but my aunt from Florida was a budding birder, so when she came up to visit, I gave them to her. I thought I could always buy another sometime, but then Minolta got absorbed into Konica, and they stopped making sport optics.

I've since tried ZRs, Hawkes, Promasters, and Nikon Monarchs, and they are all better than Obie LWs, but they are also more expensive and all roofs.

Chinese bins have definitely made strides, but they still have a way to go to catch up to Japanese optics, which up until the tsunami and the recent demise of the late, great Superior Es, offered the best bang for the buck.

Brock
 
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Brock,

Somewhere else on that Chinese site it tells you that distributors/retailers can select different grinding quality of the glass, where and what the coatings are, finish on the armour etc. so I wouldn't assume that all the 'light weight' versions of the 15x70 from different companies are the same. I've only tried the Celestron's, which sell for less the Oberwerk, even with British pricing. That felt very flimsy and mechanically crude. I don't normally make brightness comparisons but it was obvious there was a lot of light loss and the contrast pretty poor. It still won a group test in a UK astro magazine.

My 12x50 IF looks more like the UO BM-2 and it's in a totally different league. It at least feels like you could use it to knock in tent pegs. It's certainly not state of the art, but optically it's amazing for the price (about $90).
http://www.united-optics.com/products/binoculars/Military_Binoculars/BM2_Series/BM2_Series.html

As for Chinese made roofs, I've certainly seen good, bad and very ugly. No one seems to know for sure who makes what, but Kamakura China seems to be behind at least some of the best models.

David
 
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David, that one you referenced is not the one that is the Mariner at Oberwerk.

This is the one. BA3 Series at United Optics Link

I know that Brock can dismiss them, but they really have good features for the cheap price that they are sold for. The Prism is bigger sized than most consumer binoculars. That means they are heavier, and can be subject to knocks. I have taken care of mine. (except my hands betrayed me because I am slightly stronger than the average.) I have a 10x70 BA3 that are still true. I have my brother a 15x70 that is still going strong.

I know about the specifications that was discussed on Cloudy Nights. However, they still perform nicely.

I am glad that as a group, Birdform and Cloudy Nights speak up to the vendors for better details on their binoculars!

I just used that one because the picture was clearer. I have no idea if BigBinoculars uses either Binoculars China or United Optics but I suspect neither. They are just marketing companies that promote products from a whole bunch of independent manufacturing companies around Kunming and made and specified to order. I've seen those tell tale prism housings under other names as well. I would imagine BB buys direct from the manufacturer(s) and I think I've seen it suggested that they do some assembly work though their own outfit in China. The CN guys probably know more.

David
 
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Anybody used or have one? Look very similar to the older Celestron Ultima's I used to have.
Want a decent Porro for tripod use.
Bryce...


I own several and the closest to what you want is the 11x56. At about $89 I think it may be the best value for buck I've ever gotten in a binocular. They are pretty darn good optically imo.
 
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