Vultures in Decline (1 Viewer)

Alan Hill wrote a piece with the above title on the 13 Feb 2004 I (in Birds and Birding) and yesterday I received the RSPB magazine with an article about the decline of Asian vultures, stating that if nothing is done these vultures could be extinct in the wild next year.

Anyone wanting to help please send a donation to RSPB who are acting with the Bombay Natural History Society, BirdLife International in India who is their partner in this vital work.



Thanks.


Ann

Hi Ann
OBC have also funded a fair bit of work on the vulture decline and hopefully a turning point has been reached now with the recent discovery of the cause of the decline:

However, new research published in the scientific journal Nature in January 2004 has confirmed that veterinary use of diclofenac is responsible for the recent devastating declines in south Asian vulture populations.

from http://www.birdlife.org/action/science/species/asia_vulture_crisis/diclofenac.html

the decline was one of the fastest recorded for any species....lets hope things start to improve now

Why didn't you tell us you were working on it too, where can I send a donation? PM me please.

Thank goodness they know the reason (will the farmers stop using the drug?) or will efforts to save the birds be wasted.

When problems like these are caused by man, they should be stopped and we should all do our best to stop them happening in the first place. If it was peoples' pets being affected there would be an outcry, people just don't seem to care about anything natural or wild.

Sorry rant over for tonight.


Ann

Tim Allwood said:

However, new research published in the scientific journal Nature in January 2004 has confirmed that veterinary use of diclofenac is responsible for the recent devastating declines in south Asian vulture populations.

from http://www.birdlife.org/action/science/species/asia_vulture_crisis/diclofenac.html

Click to expand...

Hi both,

There have been local views that cast doubt on the diclofenac theory.

"From: satheesan sugapurath <smsatheesan2001(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Reply from DrSatheesan, Mumbai on DICLOFENAC

My dear Ohad,
Your reply is welcome! In India hardly people take
human beings to a Doctor unless and otherwise the
patient is seriously ill. Then how can they take a
cattle or a buffalo to a vet for ordinary aches and
pains? More over the farmers and cattle owners are not
rich enough to give medication to domestic animals.
The main question is , if Diclofenac was in use in
Paistan for long time, how did Peregrine fund
Scientists observed large number of vultures in a few
PAs they surveyed? I am not contesting the action of
diclofenac, but is it work such a hue and cry when so
many other major causes for vulture decline in India
are there, which they want to cover up! Can diclofenac
be so deadly only for white-backed vultures(as
described by Dr Bob Risebrough?Then what about other
birds, animals, and human beings? I want more details
of the research that does not relate to ground reality
in India. There is some interesting message for you
pasted below:
Vulture crisis-expert statements, write and wrong!
1. Dr Asad Rahmani, Director of Bombay Natural History
Society, in “A Brief Report on the International
Seminar on Vulture Situation in India” organized by
the BNHS at WWF-India, New Delhi in September 2000 had
mentioned about the first VULTURE ALERT issued by him
on the INTERNET in November 1998 in which he had
stated that vulture decline was first noticed by their
scientists in Keoladeo National Park, Bharatpur,
Rajasthan in 1996. I, one of the scientists of the
Bird-aircraft-strike research team (under late Dr
Salim Ali) of BNHS working with the project since 1980
and having worked on vultures later over two decades,
knew why the vulture decline was one of the results of
implementation of recommendations by the Government of
India at various airports and their buffer zone, by
denying animal garbage and carcasses to vultures
combined with harassment and shooting. When we had a
“bird control at airport” training programme in
National Institute of Aviation Management and
Research, AAI, New Delhi in July 1992, conducted by us
(Dr Robert Grubh, Dr S M Satheesan and others from
BNHS), we had taken participants (aviation officers
from India and abroad) to well-known carcass dumps in
Delhi to show them vultures, but to our surprise no
vulture could be shown anywhere. Then we knew that our
bird control measures are working! Dr Rahmani in the
same report mentioned about the second VULTURE ALERT
issued by him on the INTERNET in August 1999 in which
he had made following statements: “Dr S M Satheesan of
the WWF-India claims that vultures have disappeared
due to lack of food, and lack of perching and nesting
sites (see Down To Earth, July 15, 1999, page 11. He
advocates creating vulture restaurants (see Outlook
magazine, 28 June 1999, p.79). I think Dr Satheesan is
wrong on all the three points”. He reiterated that
from reports from people all over the country (no body
was an expert on vultures) showed that there was no
scarcity for carcasses, perching, and nesting sites
for vultures. How can I, or anybody else, explain
these things to a person who does not know the
fundamentals of ecology and behaviour of vultures and
impact of human activities on vultures. When I have
said about various factors which had brought about
vulture decline he picks up only one or two points for
arguments which also is not done efficiently and
effectively.
2. Late Dr Anil Agarwal, Former Director CSE, New
Delhi and Dr A R Rahmani, BNHS, had said (in meeting
on14 January 1999 at Habitat Centre, New Delhi) that
vulture were dying due to pesticide bio-accumulation.
When I challenged them with strong points Dr Rahmani
had repeatedly said that at least for Bharatpur
pesticide bio-accumulation has caused the vulture
mortality at Keoladeo National Park in Bharatpur.
Later on 12 march 1999, to a question on causes of
vulture decline in the Rajya Sabha (Starred Question
No. 258) the report by the Ministry of Environment
and Forests, Government of India states “Dr A R
Rahmani, Director of Bombay Natural History Society
authored a report about the decline in the population
of vultures due to increased use of insecticides /
pesticides”
3. The meeting on “vulture crisis” held at BNHS on 6th
August 1999 there was a near-unanimous (I was the only
opposition, my views were ignored!) statement that the
major cause of vulture decline in India may be and
infectious disease and sick vultures should caught and
experimented on. Afterwards Hisar Veterinary College,
PDRC of Venkateshwara Hatcheries Ltd, Pune,
Enterovirus Research Institute of ICMR, Pune, RSPB,
ZSL, US F&WL and Peregrine Fund USA all entered to
help BNHS. Dr Riseborough of USA and Dr Bhagwat of
BNHS carried out the toxicological studies.
4. Dr Andrew Cunningham, a wildlife histopathologist,
of Zoological Society of London, had suggested
(September 2000 meeting at WWF-India) that an
infectious disease was killing vultures in India.
5. Dr G A Ghalsasi, of Poultry Diagnostic Centre,
Pune had also indicated that a virus might be killing
vultures (September 2000 meeting at WWF-India).
6. Dr Atan Basu, National Institute of Virology had
said (September 2000 meeting at WWF-India) that there
was definite evidence of virus particles in vulture
tissues.
7. Dr Bob Risebrough of USA and Dr Bhagwat of BNHS had
mentioned (September 2000 meeting at WWF-India) that
toxicological studies revealed no bioaccumulation of
any pesticide n significant levels.
8. DR Munir Virani, Peregrine Fund had said (September
2000 meeting at WWF-India) that he had located dead
and sick vultures with deadly virus in several
localities in India, Pakistan, and Nepal. The sick
vultures had drooping necks / heads.
9. Dr Vijayan, Director SACON, Coimbatore had said
(September 2000 Meeting at WWF-India) that vulture
disappearance was due to increased sanitation and
killing of vultures by people including defense
personnel. This statement was the result of a joined
survey in which Dr Vijayan, Dr Robert Grubh (ex.
BNHS), Dr Satheesan and Dr Muralidharan participated.
10. Dr S K Mishra of Veterinary College, Hisar, had
said (September 2000 Meeting at WWF-India) that he had
seen visceral gout in two vulture carcasses and it
might be related to virus disease. He ruled out
possibility of pesticide contamination in vultures.
11. Dr Muralidharan, Ecotoxicologist, SACON,
Coimbatore (September 2000 meeting at WWF-India) also
had ruled out pesticide contamination as a cause of
vulture mortality.
12. The BNHS view represented by Dr Vibhu Prakash was
(September meeting 2000 at WWF-India) that
white-backed and long-billed vultures suffered a 90%
decline all over the country (without mentioning the
total vulture population that existed earlier in the
Subcontinent because they have not done a survey on
vultures previously) due to a disease, birds dying
sporadically 30-32 days after showing the symptoms,
first noticed in 1996 at Bharatpur. A BNHS report
published by J S Samant, Vibhu Prakash, and Rishad
Naoroji titled ”Ecology and behaviour of resident
raptors with special reference to endangered species”
Final Report (1990-1993) mentions, in page number 63,
“The Asian Whitebacked Vulture nested in very good
numbers but no systematic count of their nest was
done”. Again in the same report in page number 52 on
the present status of Asian Whitebacked Vulture it is
said “The species was most abundant in Semi-arid zone
(Nest density in Keoladeo National Park, 12.17/km
(Prakash 1988)… This showed that what Dr Vibhu Prakash
had mentioned in various places that Keoladeo National
Park had 353 Whitebacked vulture nests was nothing but
an extrapolation arrived at multiplying 12.17 by 29 Sq
km, the area of the Park. The vulture nests were
actually not counted. As 11 sq km area of the Park is
submerged in most months of an year, to have 353 nests
of Whitebacked vulture in 18 sq km area is impossible.
In Agra, only 52 km away from Bharatpur and with two
primitive slaughterhouses had only 104 nests of
Whitebacked vulture in 1980-81 in an area of 625 sq
km.
13. Dr S M Satheesan had expressed (in the September
2000 meeting at WWF-India and publications such as
Vulture News No. 40 March 1999, Vulture News No. 42
March 2000, Vulture News No. 45 September 2001,
WWF-India Network Newsletter Vol 9 No. 4 Jan 1999,
Science Reporter Feb 2001, Down To Earth March 31,
2001, Sanctuary Asia June 2001) that the major cause
of the colossal vulture mortality in India is
persecution by man through trapping, shooting, and
poisoning (deliberate and accidental). In order to
revive vulture populations to optimum levels setting
up vulture feeding centres is the best and the most
practical in situ conservation measure in hose lines
as carried out in other countries such as South
Africa, France, and Spain.
14. Dr Risebrough’s e-mail dated 22 May 2003,
forwarded by one of my friends, reads “ The mystery of
the vulture mortalities now appears to be solved.
Instead of a disease it is a common medicine for both
people and animals, Diclofenac, that is exceptionally
toxic to white-backed vultures. In the Sixth World
Conference on Birds of Prey held at Budapest, Dr
Lindsay oaks of Washington State University, who had
worked in Pakistan on vulture crisis for Peregrine
Fund. His research mentioned that virus and other
pathogens, pesticides, metals, and poisons are
negative as a cause of vulture mortality, but
Diclofenac is causing vulture deaths in Pakistan.
Tissues of 23 vultures that had died with gout
symptoms contained Diclofenac. Three vultures given
very small amount of Diclofenac also died with a short
time”.

There are serious questions to be answered:
Since how long are diclofenac containing drugs being
used on cattle and other domestic animals in Pakistan?
If they were in use since long, then how was large
number of White-backed vultures observed by the
Peregrine Fund Researchers (Dr Munir Virani and
others) in a few Protected Areas in Pakistan in 2000?
Did the drug kill vultures because of administration
of normal dose or over dose? If it is normal dose
there is a problem with the drug. If it is overdose it
acts like a poison. Anyway, from a small sample from
Pakistan no one can conclude anything about situation
in India. Moreover, we have to know whether this drug
was in use in India between 1990 to 1999 and is it
continuing. Can there be an analgesic and
anti-inflammatory drug lethal only to White-backed
vultures and not to other birds and animals and man?
We do not want to ignore the finding. But was it (and
is it) a major cause of vulture mortality in India?

One thing is clear in India vultures were harassed,
trapped, shot, poisoned (directly and indirectly) and
denied food. By feeding them with poison-free
carcasses in a controlled way at feeding centres (open
from above) in areas selected, will assure both safety
and freedom for these birds. It is unfortunate that
this vulture feeding centre project, first proposed by
me in 1999 when I was with WWF-India, was opposed by
advocates of disease hypothesis now turning towards
diclofenac to save them so that they can hold and
breed vultures captive. Kindly do not forget we have
some healthy population of vultures in the wild and so
captive-holding and captive-breeding are totally
unwanted.

S M Satheesan, Mumbai

Regards,
S M Satheesan"

There is probably much more to this....

Andy.

Hi Andrew

thanks for that.....must be close on longest post on BF!

sounds very interesting - wasn't aware of it at all. I haven't time to read it properly at the moment but will go through it as soon as i can.

atb
Tim

And for a follow-up...

(the first letter was from mid November 2003 - the first publication blaming diclofenac that I am aware of dates to May 2003).

"Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 23:11:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: satheesan sugapurath <smsatheesan2001(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Message from Dr S M satheesan, Mumbai, India


Warning to Conservationists in IndiaSome premier Indian Environmental and Conservation NGOs, GOs, the Government of India and some Foreign agencies, trying to save endangered vultures in South Asia, should carry out some introspection before they substitute restoration methods through captive-holding and captive-breeding for actual conservation (the real need of the hour), ignoring the previous vulture-strongholds, their habitat, natural food, and above all scavenging as a function in ecosystems network.Some scientists in India and abroad tried hard since 1999 to prove that the major cause for the vulture mortality (and "near extinction") in South Asia was a deadly virus, but they have not succeeded so far. Some other scientists abroad are trying to prove that diclofenac, a commonly used veterinary drug, was responsible for all the known vulture mortality in South Asia. It is quite possible that the "viral disease hypothesis" and "diclofenac hypothesis" are used to defend the idea of
holding and breeding the vultures in captivity by the advocates of these hypotheses. Captive-holding and captive breeding is a mockery of environmental research and conservation because vulture mortality in the wild cannot be stopped by this methods nor the captive-held or captive-bred birds withstand the threats that brought about their "near wipeout" and the new threats that can arise from within (a handicap of over-protection and being separated from habitat and competitors) and without (changes in habitat and food sources). Setting up vulture feeding stations suggested by the author (while working with WWF-India Secretariat, New Delhi, in 1999 and approved by MoEF then, is the only practical solution for enhancing population of vultures naturally, of which the project proposal forwarded through the Director, Salim Ali Centre for Conservation and Natural History (SACON), Coimbatore, in 2002 is still with the Ministry of Environment and Forests, Government of India. This is a
request to the Government of India to support and fund practical and result-oriented projects such as setting up feeding stations rather than costly and impractical ones such as captive-breeding and captive-holding projects.What other conservationists think about vulture conservation in South Asia?Stan Moore, San Geronimo, CA (hawkman11(at)hotmail.com) a well-known Citizens Group environmentalist, recently wrote, "Aldo Leopold used to speak of the "ecological conscience" as the motivator for conservationism. David Brower spoke of the dire need for "Planetary CPR", which stood for conservation, protection, and restoration". I certainly agree with the need for appropriate applications of all three (conservation, protection and restoration), but feel that conscience-driven conservationism is now being sacrificed all too often by public agencies and wildlife consultants in favor of less politically-sensitive and more lucrative restoration projects. The reason that restoration has become
popular with the wildlife profession is that it offers less political resistance, and yet offers employment and career building opportunities using biological skills. He opines that restoration projects are often disguised as a form of "conservation", but reality says otherwise. The biological consultants and agencies involved in sage habitat restoration love the cash flow and the ability to claim "conservationism", but restoration is not conservation, and can actually be counterproductive to conservationism. Now we see a situation also developing in south Asia (India and Pakistan) in which certain formerly superabundant vulture populations are perceived to be at risk of extinction. The proposed solution is not conservation of vultures in their habitat, but restorationism, which is the modus operandi of most operations of The Peregrine Fund. If diclofenac is the cause of the vulture declines, as the Peregrine Fund states, then I see no reason that vultures need to be taken into
captivity for the lucrative long-term breeding project proposed by the Fund and others. I see no reason why those funds could not be placed into local hands for an intensive carcass management program at breeding sites for the vultures. The idea is to preserve as much as possible the ecological role of the vultures in wild nature, while managing to ensure that tainted carcasses are unavailable to the vultures.A major concern over the Asian vulture scenario, in my view, is the history of poor levels of effort in accurately assessing peregrine falcon populations
in the U.S. in the past. I believe that the peregrine falcon populations in western North America were never as low as indicated, and the principal reason was lack of effort in surveying. This history gives me pause in assessing the currently published population estimates of Gyps vultures in India and Pakistan. Are the populations REALLY that low, or has minimal effort been used to determine the numbers? Are there populations in surrounding countries that could offer the basis for recolonization of the region with good management?

Stan Moore adds "My preference would be to see immediate start to management of all affected vultures that can be identified in the wild, particularly at breeding locations. I would much rather see monies spent on conservation than on restoration."

To be sure, conservation is much more politically difficult than restoration. Our throwaway society sometimes has pangs of conscience, usually belated and inadequate to actual need. Even in our treatment of the human components of our society, we devise pollicies that create large numbers of needy humans, and then barely address those needs. How much more true is the situation with most types of wildlife!
Can Diclofenac(used as a veterinary drug)be the major cause of vulture mortality in India?Dr Risebrough’s e-mail dated 22 May 2003, forwarded byone of my friends, reads "The mystery of the vulturemortalities now appears to be solved. Instead of adisease it is a common medicine for both people andanimals, Diclofenac, that is exceptionally toxic towhite-backed vultures. In the Sixth World Conferenceon Birds of Prey held at Budapest, Dr Lindsay oaks ofWashington State University, who had worked inPakistan on vulture crisis for Peregrine Fund. Hisresearch mentioned that virus and other pathogens,pesticides, metals, and poisons are negative as acause of vulture mortality, but Diclofenac is causingvulture deaths in Pakistan. Tissues of 23 vulturesthat had died with gout symptoms contained Diclofenac.Three vultures given very small amount of Diclofenacalso died with a short time. ..As far as I can tell,poisoning from this source would explain all theobserved mortalities, whereas known
pesticides andother poisons would not".What is diclofenac?Diclofenac (dye KLO fen ak) is the generic name forvoltaren with brand names such as Cataflam, Voltaren,Voltaren-XR. Diclofenac is in a class of drugs callednonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs).Diclofenac works by reducing hormones that causeinflammation and pain in the body. It is used toreduce pain, inflammation and stiffness caused by manyconditions, such as osteoarthritis, rheumatoidarthritis, abdominal cramps associated withmenstruation, and ankylosing spondylitis. It may alsobe used for purposes other than those listed in thismedication guide. Symptoms of a diclofenac overdoseinclude nausea, vomiting, stomach pain, dizziness,drowsiness, headache, ringing in the ears, blurredvision, seizures, sweating, numbness or tingling,little or no urine production, and slow breathing. Ifthe overdose of diclofenac is used to kill pests orused as a poison-bait it is very difficult to find outthe culprit..There are serious
questions to be answered before itcan be considered as a cause of vulture mortality inIndia:Since how long are diclofenac containing drugs beingused on cattle and other domestic animals in Pakistan?If they were in use since long, then how was largenumber of White-backed vultures (3,969 WbVs and 418vulture nests) in the Punjab Province of Pakistanobserved by the Peregrine Fund Researchers (Dr MunirVirani and others)in 2000? Did the drug kill vulturesbecause of administration of normal dose or overdose?If it is normal dose there is a problem with the drug.If it is overdose it acts like a poison.. Anyway, froma small sample from Pakistan no one can concludeanything about situation in India. Moreover, we haveto know whether this drug was in use in India between1990 to 1999 and is it continuing. Can there be ananalgesic and anti-inflammatory drug lethal only toWhite-backed vultures and not to other birds andanimals and man? We do not want to ignore the finding.But was it (and is it) a
major cause of vulturemortality in India? Even human beings are not taken toa doctor unless and otherwise the patient is seriouslyill, then how does one expect a cattle or sheepcarried to a veterinary doctor for ordinary aches andpains? Then where is the question of cattle beingkilled by diclofeanc used as a drug? Then how can thevultures be affected by diclofenac?Stan Moore, San Geronimo, CA (hawkman11(at)hotmail.com) says, "However, other experts are not convinced that diclofenac is the only culprit. Vibhu Prakash, an Ornithologist and chief of the Vulture Care Center in Pinjore, Haryana, India, says that the drug is rapidly excreted by livestock and is thus unlikely to be responsible for large numbers of bird deaths. Prakash suspects that some as-yet-unknown virus is killing vultures in the subcontinent.

"It is a questionable finding," concurs Mahendra Pal Yadav, a veterinary microbiologist and director of the Indian Veterinary Research Institute in Izatnagar. "Oaks and his team are reading more than the science is offering them." Yadav points out that diclofenac is not widely used in India, which also experienced a large vulture die-off. That suggests there's some other culprit.Why is a captive-holding / captive-breeding programme not needed to save vultures in India now?In the first place vultures in India including theWhite-backed and the Long-billed Vultures are notextinct now. About 30,000-50,000 individuals of theWhite-backed vultures are still present in the wild in India. The captive-breeding of the California Condor in USA was necessitated because their population was critically low in the wild due to reasons including human persecution (Jurek 1993) whereas in France captive breeding of the Eurasian Griffon in France became essential because vultures became extinct there by
1960 (Piper 1992).I want Doctors in India and abroad (both veterinary and physicians) to answer a few questions given below to educate Conservationists, Environmental NGOS, GOs and the Government of India on what is real vulture conservation:If diclofenac is a dangerous drug, without satisfactory clinical trials and explanations, why is it still used for man and animals?If the drug cannot be excreted readily, its residues will kill man and animals in large numbers; but it appears it has not happened so. Why? Why is it that only vultures (that too mainly White-backed and Long-billed) are said to be killed by diclofenac (according to some scientists)after feeding on cattle and sheep or other animals treated with diclofenac, when some scientists claim that the drug is readily excreted by cattle quickly and cannot affect cattle or sheep themselves? Dogs feeding on cattle carcasses are not affected apparently and teir population increases everywhere in India.If diclofenac is the major
cause of vulture mortality, do you have to ban the drug from use or confine the vultures and punish them?Do virus diseases stay long in the population on a large landmass such as India to finish off the total population in the country? Sars and poultry flu had come and gone without such an impact as vulture mortality. Why?Many scientists in India say that decease in food availability and accessibility did not contribute to lowering vulture decline. When primitive slaughterhouses are modernized or closed down, carcass dumps and bone mills are removed from the surroundings (25 km in radius)of over 500 aerodromes (civil and military) in India and carcass-processing plants, meat markets are bird-proofed, will it not reduce the food available to vultures?When modernization and sanitation combined with trapping, shooting, poisoning (direct and indirect)of animals and birds have contributed to vulture decline in other parts of the world, why in India alone do we require "a virus disease
or diclofenac hypothesis" to explain this phenomenon?Dr S M Satheesan,Vulture Enthusuast,Mumbai"

Plenty of food for thought there.....

Andy.

Wow Andy, how long did that research take you?

Reading it through do you think it is too easy to blame a drug (which I used to take but stopped) a quick fix (they think) rather than look at environmental reasons (too political and would upset too many people).

Am I stupid in thinking that a lot of the trouble is caused by a too clean world? we have gone "dirt mad", people here digging up gardens etc, concrete or decking easier to care for.

Look at all the allergies people have now as against 20/30 years ago as my grandfather used to say (God bless him dead now at a ripe old age of 90) "a bit of muck never did anyone any harm".

Maybe Vultures etc. are being denied food because of people getting rid of carcasses (hope that's spelt right) poisoning etc. After all they were part of the "refuse squad" for centuries.


Ann

P.S. I hate anything happening to birds, more than any other creature on earth to me they have true freedom "they can fly".

A CHAPLIN said:

Wow Andy, how long did that research take you?

Click to expand...

I spent 8 or 9 months trying to follow the arguments!

A CHAPLIN said:

Reading it through do you think it is too easy to blame a drug (which I used to take but stopped) a quick fix (they think) rather than look at environmental reasons (too political and would upset too many people).

Click to expand...

Politics and making a quick buck - the quick fix does not come close to a fix!

A CHAPLIN said:

Am I stupid in thinking that a lot of the trouble is caused by a too clean world? we have gone "dirt mad", people here digging up gardens etc, concrete or decking easier to care for.

Click to expand...

A clean and tidy environment does not equate to a healthy food chain - farmers that cut their hedgerows from July until April (as some do here) leave nothing for the wildlife through the most difficult (post breeding dispersal/winter) period.

A CHAPLIN said:

Look at all the allergies people have now as against 20/30 years ago as my grandfather used to say (God bless him dead now at a ripe old age of 90) "a bit of muck never did anyone any harm".

Maybe Vultures etc. are being denied food because of people getting rid of carcasses (hope that's spelt right) poisoning etc. After all they were part of the "refuse squad" for centuries.


Ann

P.S. I hate anything happening to birds, more than any other creature on earth to me they have true freedom "they can fly".

Click to expand...

The European vultures will be put under more pressure by the EU rules on disposal of carcasses, too.

The times are changing and it is being funded by those that believe that we can go on 'growing'; more profit, bigger markets (insert what you like), without any thought of sustainability or the long-term damage to the environment or health.

Andy.

Depressing, that's the way I think as well, wonder how much longer it can go on, I don't think people will ever change, they only want one thing more and more. Only hope I am around to see the "big bang".

I too haven't yet had time to go through the very long and detailed arguments about diclofenac in the posts above.
It seems strange that the decline in the vulture population is also around 90% in southern Africa, and that can't be due to diclofenac. Is that down to quite separate factors? If so, it seems quite a coincidence that vulture populations have plummeted in two different regions for entirely different reasons.

Alan Hill

Vulture decline----were they tested for avian influenza or Nipah virus?

Hello all,
I am new to this, so please bear with me. I am wondering if the vulture decline in India could be caused by Nipah virus. Right now children in Northern India are dying of an unknown disease. It is not Japanese encephalitis---but looks very much like Nipah virus.
Here is link to story:
http://www.rediff.com/news/2004/nov/17up.htm

I also wonder if there could be some connection between the avian influenza in Asia and the vulture decline.

I do not believe the Diclofenac was the problem for the vulture decline.
Does anyone know if the vultures were tested for Nipah virus or Avian influenza H5N1? THANK YOU!!!
Patty

Just to reinforce the point I made in an earlier post: the universal finger pointing to Diclofenac doesn't explain the equally dramatic decline of the African vulture population. Also I take the point made in one of the posts that there is little evidence to suggest that the majority Asian farmers are in any position to afford anti-biotics for their cattle. So I also, have never been convinced about the Diclofenac theory.

Alan Hill

alanhill said:

It seems strange that the decline in the vulture population is also around 90% in southern Africa, and that can't be due to diclofenac. Is that down to quite separate factors? Alan Hill

Click to expand...

I hadn't heard about this. Which countries have been affected and over what sort of period? Has it affected all species of vulture or only some?

Rhion,

If you typed "african vulture decline" into Google you would get a number of sources for the marked decline in their populations.

Alan Hill

Watcha Alan

this is news to me too

is there a good URL out there linking to some good info on what's happening?

atb
Tim

If anyone interested attached is the pdf of a paper in the latest Jorunal of Applied Ecology (one of the most well respected and high impact conservation journals) titled "Diclofenac poisoning as a cause of Vulture population declines across the Indian sub-continant".