• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Undescribed (3 Viewers)

New world nine-primaried oscines

Only 3 so far:

A "warbler" in Colombia: Serraniá de los Yariguíes (this thread message #19)

The "Pujyani Flowerpiercer" Diglossa sp in Bolivia: Cochabamba: Cordillera Cocapata (Herzog & al 1999 - Bulletin BOC 119: 162-177).

The "San Pedro Tanager" New genus ? in Peru: Madre de Dios: San Pedro (Dan Lane & Gary Rosenberg 2000: http://www.surfbirds.com/mb/trips/manu-cg-0404.html )

More ?
 
The “Apurimac Black Antpitta” in Peru: Apurimac: Bosque Ampay found in the 90’s
http://www.birdingperu.com/forums/expeditionbirding/files.asp

The "Oxapampa Antpitta" in Peru : Pasco: Oxapampa http://www.birdingperu.com/forums/expeditionbirding/files.asp

The Perija and Tachira members of the Rufous Antpitta complex

The review of the entire Rufous Antpitta complex (which includes G. blakei) is in progress - the "Oxapampa Antpitta" is part of this. The "Apurimac Black Antpitta" is considered more likely to be simply poor views of known species (reputed to look like a dark Undulated Antpitta... and have the same voice! The Undulated is known to occur at the exact locality, so if the "Apurimac Black Antpitta" was a species we'd be looking at a pair of sympatric species of antpittas with the same voice... hmm! Let's just say that if anyone could point to *any* other comparable example in this family I'd be very interested in knowing about it). I would also add that while it certainly is entirely possible that a new tinamou is found somewhere in Central America (posts #51-53), claiming this based on a photo of an individual apparently taken quite a few years ago and where the photo now is lost is questionable at best. Especially considering the extreme variability of certain species found in this region, notably Little and Thicket Tinamou, and that tinamous - when present - typically are relatively easy to document by their voice (though seeing them is an entirely different matter). Similarly with the wren mentioned in post #54, where it would be pretty difficult to exclude an abnormal Black-throated based on the brief description - if its voice was recorded and it was different from Black-throated and other possibilities in the region, then it's a completely different matter. Otherwise, repeated views or a sample (for genetic check) are the only way to exclude an abnormal individual of an already known species. After all, we're in a region where even something as basic as the juvenile plumage of numerous species still hasn't been described. Add to that the possibilities of previously undocumented (or simply poorly known) morphs or variants (to illustrate that point one only has to look at the recent change in the taxonomic status of the Bulo Burti Boubou - now known to be a variant of Laniarius (aethiopicus) erlangeri).

As for undescribed Tyrannids I've seen a photograph of a Myiornis Pygmy- Tyrant from Pernambuco, if I'm not mistaken. But I can't find it anywhere anymore.

I'd add that it is very similar (both vocally and visually) to the Eared Pygmy-Tyrant (which occurs further north than typically reported, so Pernambuco isn't such a major jump as one could think). However, there are differences, Rio São Francisco is a major border in this region, and from what I've heard the people that are involved are likely to go for species status.

A Zimmerius “San Martin Tyrannulet” found in Peru (San Martin: Tarapoto),
http://www.birding-peru.com/masterpe...aginaactual=14
but I was told this is probably Z. villarejoi

Yes, but quite possibly a new ssp. There are other probably undescribed ssp's from this genus, incl. a member of Z. chrysops/viridiflavus and a member of Z. acer (recently split from Z. gracilipes).

A miner Geositta sp in Chile & Argentina (Alvaro Jaramillo) http://www.americanbirding.org/pubs/birding/archives/vol38no3p30to38.pdf

The miner isn't new. It's a matter of splitting already described taxa.

The “Iquitos Foliage-gleaner” Automolus sp in Peru: Loreto : Allaphuayao-Mishana reserve http://www.birdingperu.com/masterperu/exp_birds.asp?idbird=1933&p=10

The entire Automolus rubiginosus complex is in serious need of a review. The Iquitos population is quite probably closer to the taxa from the Guiana Shield (obscurus & venezuelanus) than the Andean taxa.

The “Ancash Canastero” Asthenes (dorbignyi ?) in Peru : Ancash (HBW 8: 309) http://www.birding-peru.com/masterperu/default.asp?paginaactual=9

The “Huanuco Canastero” Asthenes (dorbignyi ?) in Peru : Ayacusho (HBW 8: 309) http://www.birding-peru.com/masterperu/default.asp?paginaactual=9

The entire Asthenes dorbignyi complex is in serious need of a review, and even if limiting it to described taxa, we're probably looking at more than one species. Despite this having been known for a long time (decades), I'm not aware of anyone seriously looking into it right now (even if a fair percentage of the required data collecting has been done), but perhaps I just managed to miss it.

The “Apaya Spinetail” Cranioleuca sp in Peru : Junín: Satipo road (Gunnar Engblom & Mark Tasker) http://www.birding-peru.com/masterpe...paginaactual=9

Now known to actually be a range extension for Cranioleuca marcapatae weskei, which really is very different than the much better known nominate subspecies.

I have a few more additions:
"Anchietas Sunbird" from Zambia (see mutinondozambia site with photo)

Not new (Anthreptes anchietae), but a nice species nevertheless.
 
Last edited:
the Rusty-breasted Antpitta, in Venezuela (this thread message #15)

Missed that. While certainly possible that there are undescribed taxa within this complex, it is more of a matter of (re-)splitting already described taxa. Of note that the taxon leymebambae occurs much further north than typically mentioned (the most northern population is in Pululahua near Quito, Ecuador, but the possibility that this is a new taxon has not been discounted beyond all doubts) and for this reason one could argue that the suggested "Leymebamba Antpitta", even if reflecting its scientific name, wouldn't be the best name if (when!) it is split. Paper in progress, too.
 
Last edited:
The “Sandia Thistletail” Schizoeaca sp in Peru : Puno http://www.birding-in-peru.com/pdf-d...y_Aug_2005.doc

The “Apurimac Thistletail” Schizoeaca sp in Peru : Apurimac http://www.birding-peru.com/masterpe...paginaactual=9

Lots of work needed in this genus. Check for example the peculiar distribution of S. fuliginosa and S. griseomurina... yet another example of a leapfrog patter in the Andes:

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/224/4645/171

The situation regarding S. helleri is equally peculiar. While currently considered monotypic, population in the south likely represent an undescribed taxon, while populations in north (the "Sandia Thistletail" you mention) also are likely to represent an undescribed taxon. Anyhow, voice and morphology often directly contradict each other in this genus, so it is pretty obvious that genetics is the only way the species limits can be established with a fair level of certainty.
 
Last edited:
Yes, Rasmus, you're absolutely right. The sunbird I meant has nothing to do with anchietae. It is supposed to be an undescribed taxon close to the Greater Double-collared Sunbird. Furthermore I remember a strange (undescribed ?) sunbird reported from the Gola Forest, Sierra Leone in the eighties.
 
I'd add that it is very similar (both vocally and visually) to the Eared Pygmy-Tyrant (which occurs further north than typically reported, so Pernambuco isn't such a major jump as one could think). However, there are differences, Rio São Francisco is a major border in this region, and from what I've heard the people that are involved are likely to go for species status.

I'd say the vocalizations are pretty distinct IMO, at least the primary song. The amazing thing is that the new Pygmy-tyrant doesn't appear to be at Murici whereas the other mega-rare Alagoas / Pernambuco endemic passerines are at "both" sites.

excellent thread btw - anyone know more about Bret Witney's new antbirds at Roosevelt?

cheers, alan
 
anyone know more about Bret Witney's new antbirds at Roosevelt?

One each in the genera Herpsilochmus, Hypocnemis & Myrmeciza. Which of these are subspecies and which are species is something I'll leave for the people describing it, but I do have my opinions of course (I'd add that from what I've heard I'm not convinced all will be described as species - especially now where the Warbling Antbird has been split into several spp). Even without those Rio Roosevelt is antbird heaven (Pale-faced Antbird, White-breasted Antbird, Rondonia Bushbird...)!
 
Last edited:
The Rio Roosevelt Herpsilochmus you're writing about, is it the same undescribed bird as the one from the upper rio Urucu and Reserva de Desenvolvimento Uakarai on the middle rio Juruá ? This one is being described by Cohn-Haft.
 
Not yet – check the SACC pages: http://www.museum.lsu.edu/~Remsen/SACCBaseline07.html (Notes 51, 55b, 55c).

The question isn't if SACC have changed the genus. The question is if any old genera are available for the various groups within Myrmeciza sensu lato. I haven't checked, and in any case there still are a few things that need solving before this can be done consistenly throughout the members currently placed in Myrmeciza (there can be absolutely no doubts that it will need to be split, though).

The Rio Roosevelt Herpsilochmus you're writing about, is it the same undescribed bird as the one from the upper rio Urucu and Reserva de Desenvolvimento Uakarai on the middle rio Juruá ? This one is being described by Cohn-Haft.

I'm not sure what reserve you're talking about (it occurs in several reserves, but I'm not aware of any Brazilian reserve named "Reserva de Desenvolvimento Uakarai"). Anyhow, let's just say that there are several interesting things within the genus Herpsilochmus in the western and southern Amazon of Brazil and while there certainly is a "hole" in the distribution of this genus in this region, it is likely not as large as now generally believed. In addition to the just mentioned, it is worth noting that the "H. sellowi" from Serra do Cachimbo likely represent an undescribed taxon. And while we're in the Brazilian Amazon south of Rio Amazon/Solimões, there are also interesting things going on in Cyanocorax and Rhegmatorhina.
 
I'm not sure what reserve you're talking about (it occurs in several reserves, but I'm not aware of any Brazilian reserve named "Reserva de Desenvolvimento Uakarai").

Rasmus, this is a new reserve, actually called "Reserva de Desenvolvimento Sustentável Uacari", made specially to preserve the two rare Uacari monkeys that occur there.

Its size is of 611 hectars, at the municipality of Carauari, Amazonas, at the Juruá River. Together with other neighbor reserves, it protects around 4.5 million hectars of forest.
 
Rasmus wrote: "Similarly with the wren mentioned in post #54, where it would be pretty difficult to exclude an abnormal Black-throated based on the brief description - if its voice was recorded and it was different from Black-throated and other possibilities in the region, then it's a completely different matter. Otherwise, repeated views or a sample (for genetic check) are the only way to exclude an abnormal individual of an already known species. After all, we're in a region where even something as basic as the juvenile plumage of numerous species still hasn't been described. Add to that the possibilities of previously undocumented (or simply poorly known) morphs or variants".

Just to make things a little clearer. Tom & I have not claimed a new species! Black-throated Wren is indeed the closest to the bird we saw, and an "abnormal" plumage of that species is an option. This would be a considerable range extension, so if it was a Black-throated then plumage differences with birds in the known range would not be surprising. Tom made a recording of its call (but it didn't sing). We have field notes & a detailed description of the bird, so the brief mention on Tom's site is not the full record, rather something Tom put out to encourage others to keep an eye out should they visit this remarkable and little-known area (the largest remaining forest in Central America & sadly one that is neglected by birders who perhaps are unaware of its potential due to the lack of recorded endemics).

Cheers

John
 
Hi all

I just happened to bump into this thread, while doing a search on google. I have skimmed the content, but no time right now to check details. As my name and my web-page www.birdingperu.com has been mentioned a few times and this topic hits a very dear interest of mine. I have on the birding Peru web-page I call Expedition Birding, http://birdingperu.com/forums/expeditionbirding/ which consists of a point system data base with all range-restricted species, threatened species, recently described species and species that are yet not described. Grapewine splits that will result in a range restricted species or get asigned a higher threat status are also included. One can record sightings on this page.
How to use the page in detail and its objective can be found here:
http://birdingperu.com/forums/expeditionbirding/exp_intro.asp

I'd like to invite all contributors of this current thread to become editors to the expedition birding database. I have been swomped the last couple of years to do updates. We are missing the last BirdLife updates on threat status, and I have also lagged behind in included newly described species and more undescribed species. This discussion here has helped quite a bit.

Send me a mail to [email protected] if you like to become editor of this concept. BY next week, I shall be able to give editor passes to up to 5-6 people and also create a page where updates can be described, so that everyone can see what has been done recently.

There is also a discussion group (a bit dormant, but still quite a few people on it) that you may want to sign up to:
[email protected]

In a near future we shall add the expedition birding concept also to the Peru Data Base on www.birdingperu.com

The latter data base has recieved some support from BirdLife International and RSPB to become part of the world bird intiative. It is hoped that also Expedition Birding shall recieve recognition from BirdLife and that records of threatened birds uploaded to the data base shall be available immediately also to Birdlife's database.

Saludos

Gunnar Engblom
Peru

PS: Later I shall comment some details on this thread.
 
Longbill

In HBW 13 in the Melanocharitidae account, it is said that a new taxon belonging to this family seems likely to have recently been discovered.

A specimen from the Eastern Highlands of New Guinea has been kept in a jar with Toxorhamphus & Oedistoma specimen since 1985 and remained unnoticed until a molecular analysis was carried out and clearly showed that this specimen was different.

Any insight ?
 
I don't know about that specimen but I do know about other seemingly undescribed members of that family. They probably all belong to the Obscure Berrypecker (Melanocharis arfakiana). Birds have been seen in Ok Tedi/Tabubil, and others, different from the former, on the Huon Peninsula.
My copy of HBW 13 is still on its way. Can you tell me if Zosterops gibbsi is included ? This must be a wonderful volume right ?
 
... and others, different from the former, on the Huon Peninsula.

Phil Gregory states that the birds (Melanocharis arfakiana) in the southern part of the Huon Peninsula exibit better-marked pale eyering than those in the rest of range, but he does not know whether this character has any taxonomic significance.
 
A undescribed rail was believed to exist on New Britain (Bismarck Archipelago) for some time, though this was noting more than a ground-dove.

More details in : Dutson, G. & T. Palliser. 2007. The mystery New Britain Rail: a Bronze Ground Dove. Muruk 8(3), 142-143.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top