Why so many "ID this bird" posts? (1 Viewer)

I dont mean to be rude, but i feel that birdforum members are not taking
efforts to ID their birds on their own, but just are posting pics here for ID.

Many of them are IDable with ease if one has a bird guide.

I urge members to procure a bird guide & start IDing birds on your own, rather than depend of such a forum for every other bird, be it trivial or not.

best regards,
Job

Although I see your point, I would counter by saying that not all IDs are obvious to everyone, common birds in Arizona are not necessarily common birds in India. And remember that it's not just the thread starter who might be interested in the answer. For ever poster there's usually 10 to 20 viewers, any of which might be curious.

If there's not a bandwidth issue (and I don't know that there isn't, although I suspect not), what difference does it make?

Before we get yet another thread going on the same subject, Job you might want to read this one:

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=28889

Hi Katy

I tried to access the thread you gave, but message is coming up, "I dont have permission to access this page", any ideas

Tom

hi,

Same here form me.
No acces......

Berthil

tom tams said:

Hi Katy

I tried to access the thread you gave, but message is coming up, "I dont have permission to access this page", any ideas

Tom

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Probably because it's in Ruffled Feathers, wouldn't go there if I were you!
Perhaps it should be moved into the main Forum.

Hi all

You need to be a member of Ruffled feathers to see it. Joining is easy (though can't remember personally how I did it).

It is an open forum where people get stuff off their chests, so beware!!!!

There's also plenty of funny stuff on there.

Sean

but just are posting pics here for ID.

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I dont mean to be rude but I wonder why someone would criticise others for using a bird ID forum, I enjoy reading it.

as a newish member here I have to say it's great to see people helping, even ones that many would consider very common birds, but there are obviously birders of different levels.

if only more forums were like this one.....

*scratches head*

I don't wish to be rude either, but what harm does it do? If someone really doesn't like them, don't read them.

I agree to Richards comments as newbie birder i sometimes struggle to identify birds even though i have several reference books.
to make matters worse in my local park there is flock of gulls and most appear to be common gulls but recently a few changes have ocurred one particular gull has a fully developed brown/black hood on checking the books this is a blackheaded gull but hold on a mo it should not have a fully developed hood in winter according to the books. i have decided it is a blackheaded gull on the shape of the hood nothing else fits and accept stange things do happen. Several other of the gulls are now also displaying winter plumage of the blackheaded gull
The latest visitor to the garden a reed bunting, how do i know because i had seen one, at a reserve recenty a fellow birder pointed this out to me. in all probability i should not have a reed bunting in the garden but due to extensive work on the M60 motorway which is near the river Mersey many birds have been displaced and are visiting the locality. So on checking this reed bunting in the books it would have told me that it should not have been seen my garden. not a BF member who helped me identify a bird but a fellow birder.

i'm very grateful to anyone who will help me correctly identify a bird, sure i will use the reference books but sometimes it can be difficult and welcome any help from BF users to help me identify a bird.

cheers geoff

again
the guy is just tryong to encourage people to do some work, put some effort in, educate themsleves etc...

some of the things that are put up for id are a bit silly - a basic field guide would render them idable in the time it takes to write a post to Bird Forum

having said that it doesn't bother me and i do answer them for my own fun. Not sure what the poster of the original request gets out of it...?

This ID section is the only place I go to on this site pretty much...it helps a lot. Bird guides aren't always that accurate after all.

Birdforum is used by a wide range of people, some of whom ask i.d. questions. After all, isn't this on of the the purposes of a "Bird Forum"?

Regards

Why so many "ID this bird" posts?

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Simple answer . . . because they're popular!

For what it is worth, don't forget that probably, most times, it is that one bird that hooks a non-bird aficionado into the world of birding and I don't particularly like the fact that threads like this and the one previous would cause a new member or any member to hesitate in asking for some help. If they are truly hooked, it will only be a matter of time before they outfit themselves with more guides than is necessary.

Lastly, if the amount of I.D. threads are distressing to anyone, then don't review them.

It doesn't worry me as I quite enjoy contributing. However, I think that the enquirers could sometimes help themselves a bit more. A note like "I think this is an **** but I'm not sure -what do you think?" at least shows that they've had a stab at working it out. No one here is going to mind if they've got it wrong.

What gets to me more is the common (false) assumption that a photo is some sort of rosetta stone. It really would be very helpful if enquirers could comment about how faithfully or otherwise the colours in their pic compare to the actual bird. One of the best examples of the confusion this can cause was a thread that I think got lost in the great crash, asking about an American warbler. It was obviously a female/imm Yellow-rumped Warbler, but members called it all sorts of things, all because the photo had a very strong yellow cast. Once it was colour-corrected the identity became obvious. That was an extreme case, but by no means isolated. I'm always surprised at how often discussions of photos accept the colours at face value - even to the extent of pronouncing authoritatively on the precise degree of greyness in a gull's mantle when there are no other species in the shot for comparison.

PS Sorry for that - feeling a bit grumpy today! :flowers:

Tim100 said:

This ID section is the only place I go to on this site pretty much...it helps a lot. Bird guides aren't always that accurate after all.

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A very good point, and one that often gets me into numerous debates on this side of "the pond". Often times guides that are accurate in what they depict, may only show one drawing for a species, ignoring many of the various plumages that are possibly encountered in the field. Also, as mentors we will sometimes take one of these bright-eyed newbies, under our wing and (in an attempt to shelter them from any possible confusion) recommend the least comprehensive, worst guide out there from an ID standpoint because we believe it will be "easier" for these poor, confused birdlets to only have a couple choices. Even when we would never use said guide ourselves because it is far too incomplete!.... I think you see where I'm going here, so I won't continue.

At any rate, we sometimes create this need for asking for help by trying to shelter our proteges, and recommending inferior (by current market standards) guides as "beginner's tools". As such we need to understand and be helpful when these folks ask for help and shouldn't ever be critical because someone lacks our experience.... The only thing this begets, is turning people off to the hobby (obsession?!?...).

I will make this plea though, if you really want to help a beginning birder start them with a sound comprehensive guide even if it is daunting to look through. From my memories as a beginner (>20 years ago now), I was more frustrated after flipping through an entire guide and not being able to find ANYTHING that looked close to my bird than I was having to flip through more pages!

Lastly, I will say that in my 20 years, I received help from TONS of people, and personally feel it is my responsibility to "give back" to the community at large and offer assistance where ever I can, and encourage all out there to do the same.

For those taking notes at home I'll mention that I was a contributing author to the ABA Bird Finding Guides to Florida and Alaska, was a consultant on the 2 CD set "Bird Songs of Alaska", wrote a recent article on "Digiscoping Basics" for Birding Business Magazine, am completing a Raptor article for Wildbird at present, just picked up #309 for 2005 with a Chuck-will's Widow in the backyard this morning (even though I haven't hit that thread yet), and fully expect requests for assistance from all of the (how many is it now?...) 20,000 members, now that I've mede the offer. I will answer each in turn so you should expect a reply within 6-9 mos.

Good birding,

Jeff Bouton
Product Specialist Birding/Naturalist Markets, USA
Leica Sport Optics
Port Charlotte, FL

KCFoggin said:

For what it is worth, don't forget that probably, most times, it is that one bird that hooks a non-bird aficionado into the world of birding and I don't particularly like the fact that threads like this and the one previous would cause a new member or any member to hesitate in asking for some help. If they are truly hooked, it will only be a matter of time before they outfit themselves with more guides than is necessary.

Lastly, if the amount of I.D. threads are distressing to anyone, then don't review them.

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KC -

Is there really a point where you have more guides than necessary?!?... NOw you sound like my wife!

Best,

Jeff Bouton (way beyond hooked!)

In a lot of cases for new birders and older birders alike, you see a bird that you've never seen before. You don't have the first clue where to start looking in a bird book. I had this experience last year when a lovely bird showed up in my birch tree. I looked under finches, I looked under warblers.... couldn't find anything. After posting a shot on here, I was told it was a red-eyed vireo. Without asking for help, I would have had no clue.
I'm sure there all kinds of incidents like this but people don't expand on how hard they tried to figure it out so you'd never know. Last I heard, that wasn't a crime. Like others have said, it is a BIRD forum, after all. And someone else will always be interested if you're not.

What surprises me more is that people get the equipment and skills to photograph so early. This is before they can easily use a field guide, even.

You can learn birding all on your own, it just takes time. If you are not getting anywhere in two years, post all the pictures you like here. I have no problem with flickers and nuthatches and sparrows, never too many.