[kman]

Hello to all. I have been a lurker on the board for a few months now and want to thank all of you for the many helpful posts you have made on binos. I have been looking for a new pair after a trip to Wyoming this fall. My current binos are the Nikon Monarchs 10x42. My guide had a pair of Zeiss 8x42 Victory that finally drove home it was time for an upgrade.

Deep down inside I am a cheapskate and i am happy with 95% of the performance for 1/3 the cost. I just can't peel the cabbage for a pair of Swaros, Leicas, or high end Zeiss. So my search was on for a pair of binos that met my 95%/1/3 ratio. I wanted 8x32 for weight considerations as I do a fair amount of hiking and hunting in the mountains.

My initial budget was $500. I started searching on ebay and at Bass Pro Shops for binos. I saw Browning 8x32 (which are Bushnell Legends) for $129 on ebay!!! I was able to put my hands on a pair of Bushnell Legends at Bass Pro. They are really nice glass. Very comparable to the Nikon Monarchs in 8x36. The Nikons had a brighter view ( I am assuming due to their 4mm advantage in objective lenses) and sharpness was a dead heat. But for Half the cost the Brownings are a runaway winner!!!!

I then saw some posts on this forum for the Minox 8x32 BD BL Asph. They were in my price range ($510 retail). I also saw the Kowa 8x32's were reviewed here and they too were in my price range ($520 retail). After tons of shopping I landed at B&H Photo in New York City. Their web site is terrific and there are actually people you can talk to if you have questions!!!

The sales person told me to order both and then return the one I liked the least within 15 days and all I was on the hook for was return shipping. Very good deal. Now the deal gets even better!!! The Kowas were $339 and the Minox were $329!!!!

I ordered both and they arrived the day after Xmas...and the comparison was on!! I am not a bino expert but I do know the difference between great glass, good glass, OK glass, and junk. I am very tough on binos and I need to have armor and waterproofing. Specs on the two were alomst identical:7.5 deg view, waterproof, essentailly a lifetime warranty, twilight factor of 16,multi coated, etc.

Initial look and feel:

The Minox fit in my hands better and also have a silky smooth and precise focus wheel. They are also 65 grams lighter than the Kowas.
The Kowas are built like a tank!!!! The focus wheel is more "heavy" but it has a very precise feel to it.You could probably run over the Kowas with your car and they would still work. The Kowas have a "stepped" eye cup system which is very nice. You can adjust the eye relief with 3 distinct stops. The Minox are a more traditional "sliding mechanism". No clear winner just personal preference.

Optical performance:

This is where it gets really difficult to cite differences. I did close distance bird viewing (20-30 meters) and long distance across the lake (2-3 km) spotting on boats, signs, and houses. I also did extensive viewing on an art print inside my house at 10 meters.The first day it was overcast so it was hard to get a firm grasp on color rendering. But there was really no noticeable difference between the two. Focus and sharpness was no noticeable difference. Brightness was a toss up. Field of view was a tie as well. The only difference I could tell was that the Kowas seemed to have a little more "pop" to them when you first put them up to your eyes.

Days 2-6

The sun came out and the bird viewing at close range was great. Both binos did an amazing job on color rendering. These both made my Nikon Monarchs look dull and gray. I saw an amazing thing...a golden finch with a yellow head and an almost snow white body!!! It was with 4-5 more traditional golden finches and the difference was amazing!!! The white one has come back for 3 days in a row. Any way I digress. The Kowas seem to be able to render more of a shimmer on the cardinals and red finches sometimes but not all the time. It could be possible that the sunlight was hitting the feathers just right. Close in viewing these binos are a toss up. I could not really pick an outright winner.

I found a great test subject. There were some decorative snowflakes hanging on a porch across our cove 550 meters away. They were detailed and had a subtle color to them. In the bright sunlight the Minox had a tiny,tiny,tiny focus and sharpness advantage. They also had a very very slight advantage in a larger sweet spot. Could be due to the asph. lenses???? Color rendering on both binos was very very close. I really could not tell a discernable difference in color. There was also no difference that I could tell in the usable field of view. Both were miles ahead of my Monarchs.

I went down to Bass Pro with the Minox and compared them side by side with a pair of Swaro 8x30 SLC. I looked at objects all across the store from 20-120 meters. It took about 20 minutes of very hard looking and critiquing before I could really declare the Swaros the winner. Brightness was equal. Color rendering was equal. Sharpness and focus the Swaros had a tiny,tiny edge. The Minox and the Kowas both offer a legitimate 97% of performance to the top end binos for literally 1/3 the cost....amazing.

The Winner:

It is impossible for me to declare an outright winner. Optically these two binos are as close as one could imagine. Long range viewing and sharpness going ever so slightly to the Minox. Feel and comfort for me the Minox was better but that is strictly personal. The Kowas look tougher and my guess is that if you are going to put your binos through he!! these may be your best bet.

Both of these binos are super values. And for only $50 more than the Nikon Monarchs they both destroy the Monarchs in every catagory (brightness, color, sharpness, field of view, wow factor, you name it).

I could live with either one but in the end I am going to keep the Minox. The final deciding factor for me was my percieved very small edge in long range sharpness, the lighter weight, and the feel in my hand.

Interestingly enough the Minox are made in China. The Kowas made in Japan.

I hope this helps. In summary if you are looking for $300 binos you will absolutely not do any better than these two. Considering they both retail for over $500 US you literally can steal them from B&H Photo and you can try them out yourself for two weeks with only return shipping as your out of pocket cost.

Thanks again to all the birders who took the time to post up their experiences and expertise on binos. Your help enabled me to make a really solid decision on my bino purchase.

I'd also like to know if any of you have ever seen a snow white bodied Golden Finch with a starkly yellow head.


Best of luck and Happy New Year

Kyle

[APSmith]

I posted a reply to your duplicate post in the "Others" sub-forum.

[mayoayo]

Hi there...I just bought the Minox VD 8x32,and sold it after a couple days of use,..They had indeed a very flat and nicely corrected,sharp field of view,and the focus mechanism was also great,..I just though the binoculars flared way too much,almost in all lights..How did the Kowa's stood in that field?...Also ,i am sure that the Minox,at least my unit,are made in Japan

[mayoayo]

Another annoying thing about the Minox(BD not VD!),was the smell ,..the rubber or plastic compound used in their armor was pretty noxious..This is actually pretty serious issue,when you think that you have the things next to your nose for extended periods of time(on and off ,mostly),it becomes very unpleasant,and perhaps even harmful(I know of at least a couple of persons with Chemical sensitivity that would get pretty sick at the mere smell).My Swift audubon(820)also developed a ,subtle , but bad, smell coming from the grease in the focuser.Not so intense,but also unpleasant.The Nikon LXL on the other hand are quite fragrant!!! it must be the ECO rubber used in the armor,but they really smell good!!!!!

[Tero]

Some confusion about Minox origins
http://www.birdforum.net/showthread....ina#post807455

[davem]

OK, quick run down for anyone who is wanting to know...

BV compacts - China
BV full size - China
BLs - China

Aspherics - Japan
HGs - Japan

Think that covers them all...

HTH

Dave.

[orbitaljump]

So the BDs are made in Japan?

And all BDs have Aspheric lenses in their eyepiece configs?

[ceasar]

According to the instruction book supplied with my Minox BD 10 x 32 BR asph. all of the binoculars in this series (BD BR) have aspheric lens technology. There are 8 listed. Note the designation is BD 10 x 32 BR Asph. and not BD 10 x 32 BL. It is alphabetically confusing. The BD BR series and the HG BR series are aspheric. The BV BR series and the BL BR series don't have it. I think the BR means "roof prism." There is nothing in the literature or on the binocular to indicate where the BD BR series is manufactured.
Bob

[Kevin Purcell]

Ceasar: I though the Minox were BD and then the BD asph was a later revision with updated eyepiece design? A bit like WP and the SP from Pentax (though with more similar enclosures, coating and armor).

And the rule of thumb with all Minox bins with BR as Cesar says it to ignore it. It's on all Minox roof prisms. Which is odd as there isn't a D in it (for Dach ...). If only their model names didn't start with B too.

[ceasar]

Originally Posted by Kevin Purcell

Ceasar: I though the Minox were BD and then the BD asph was a later revision with updated eyepiece design? A bit like WP and the SP from Pentax (though with more similar enclosures, coating and armor).......................................

That could be, but if so, it's before I got mine. I think the BD BR Asph. line is gone now too. It's hard keeping up with these changes.

Bob

[davem]

OK, quick update which may help?

IGNORE 'BR' it simply means 'roof prism'...

BD - original series of Minox binos - stands for 'Binocular Design' as the VW Design bureau had a hand in their external design.

BD Asph (Apsheric), an upgraded version with aspheric lenses in the eyepieces. Just for confusion ALL 10x52s had the Aspheric lenses regardless of whether they were actually called BD or BD Aspheric.

As for the current range, refer to my earlier post... and remember to IGNORE 'BR'

[chartwell99]

Originally Posted by davem

OK, quick update which may help?

IGNORE 'BR' it simply means 'roof prism'...

BD - original series of Minox binos - stands for 'Binocular Design' as the VW Design bureau had a hand in their external design.

BD Asph (Apsheric), an upgraded version with aspheric lenses in the eyepieces. Just for confusion ALL 10x52s had the Aspheric lenses regardless of whether they were actually called BD or BD Aspheric.

As for the current range, refer to my earlier post... and remember to IGNORE 'BR'

I hate to add to the confusion, but I bought recently (and much love) a Minox HG BR 8 x 33 Rangefinding binocular. What are the differences between my bin and the BD Asph glasses (does it have aspherical lens elements, VW Design input, other features, etc) ? Many thanks -I genuinely appreciate the info.

[ceasar]

Originally Posted by chartwell99

I hate to add to the confusion, but I bought recently (and much love) a Minox HG BR 8 x 33 Rangefinding binocular. What are the differences between my bin and the BD Asph glasses (does it have aspherical lens elements, VW Design input, other features, etc) ? Many thanks -I genuinely appreciate the info.

It has aspheric technology. See this link from Eagle Optics.

http://www.eagleoptics.com/index.asp?pid=4745

It looks like they also have new coatings.

Bob

[davem]

Originally Posted by chartwell99

I hate to add to the confusion, but I bought recently (and much love) a Minox HG BR 8 x 33 Rangefinding binocular. What are the differences between my bin and the BD Asph glasses (does it have aspherical lens elements, VW Design input, other features, etc) ? Many thanks -I genuinely appreciate the info.

Hope this will help you with everything.

This lists everything the HGs have in them. The 'Aspherics' are aluminium bodied and the only real similarity is that both the HGs and the 'Aspherics' (surprisingly!) have Aspheric lenses in the eyepieces.

[ceasar]

OK, the HG's have a magnesium body, the BD's have have an aluminum body and are heavier. The difference in weight between the HG 10 x 43 (22.9oz) and the BD 10 x 42(26.88oz) is 4 ounces. Something like the weight difference between the Leica Trinovids and the Ultravids but at about one grand less in price!
Bob