[Skimmer15]

Hello,

I’m an American who is planning his first birding trip to Britain in April/May of 2010. At this point, I am just trying to work out a preliminary itinerary. I have been to Britain a number of times, but not since I have taken up birding, so everything would be new to me. My goal would be to see as many species as I could on the trip, while sightseeing at the same time.

I would appreciate any input on birding locations that I should be sure to include in my plans. Can anyone offer a list of “must-see” sites around Britain? The more opinions and lists, the better. I have the book Where To Watch Birds Britain by Harrap and Redman, and it will be a great help to me, but I need a shorter list of the places I should be sure not to miss. The list could consist of specific locations or general areas (counties?) – I just need to make general plans at this point. I expect to spend about six weeks on the trip, covering England, Wales, and Scotland. I can work out the exact route – I just need to know which places I should be sure to visit.

I would be traveling alone and would have a rented car. I would expect to stay in B&B's and self-catering places, stopping for two or three nights at a time, with maybe some one-night stops along the way.

I would also be interested in any advice about timing. I was thinking of April and May, for personal reasons, but would I be better off at the beginning of that time period, or at the end? I could start in late March or extend into early June, if either of those would be better for the birds (and weather?). I’ll put it this way – what six weeks would be best, between late March and early June?

Thanks very much for any help, either here or by email. As the time gets closer and my plans form, I expect I will post in the appropriate County forums, but first I need to decide on a general itinerary.

Thanks very much in advance,
Barry Brugman

[david kelly]

Barry

April and May are probably two of the best months to visit Britain. There are many must sees and must hears and I am sure you will receive many replies recommending many supreb places south of border and in the north of Scotland. Here in my little corner of the country, East Lothian, we have one particularly sepctacular site. The Northern Gannet colony on the Bass Rock which together with the other seabirds on nearby islands makes for a pretty spectacular sight for any birder. Check out www.seabird.org or http://www.the-soc.org.uk/soc-home.htm.

Cheers

David

[davercox]

Barry

I hope other people will be along to help you here shortly, but to give you a start I will you must include Speyside (near Aviemore): both the pine forests of Abernethy/Rothiemurchus and the adjacent Cairngorm mountains; also take in Loch Insh and Loch Garten RSPB.
Shetland is worth very serious consideration but it is quite a trek.
The other area you should allow a good bit of time for is Norfolk (both the north coast and the Breckland area it shares with Suffolk). And Minsmere in Suffolk itself is a very reliable place for a good number of species.
Re timing, I would say 'the whole of the six weeks from late March to early June' but if you have to cut any time then cut it from March.

[halftwo]

Hi Barry,

Sounds like a great trip in the planning.

Just to give you one piece from my part of the world.

I'm a member of the BirdingPal network - check it out if you like. But in any case I would be happy to take you out for a trip for a whole day.

I would recommend that a day along the north Wales coast, in early May preferably, would give you the chance of upland birds and seabird colonies (Wood warbler, Redstart, Pied flycatcher, Dipper, Cuckoo, Tree pipit, etc. and Chough, Razorbill, Guillemot, Black guillemot, Raven, Puffin, terns etc.).
This also could combine drive-past or visits to any of the castles along the way (Conwy, Caernarfon, Harlech, Beaumaris, etc.) as well as some spectacular scenery the area is noted for.

Others will, I'm sure add much more and suggest other things, so just one further point.
In spring I would recommend you start in the south and work your way north.
Mid April on the south coast will mean most of the spring arrivals will be there, but May in north Scotland can still be waiting for some summer migrants.
If you have six weeks I would include all of May - and maybe first week of June for Scotland - you certainly won't miss anything by missing out the earlier weeks, plus the weather could well be better.

Happy planning,

H

[Big Yin]

That sounds like a tough task and I'm sure you'll get a good number of replies. I'll add my bit......
North Norflok is spectacular bird wise with visits to the likes of Titchwell, Cley, Great Ryburgh you should get the likes of Marsh, Hen and Montagu's Harriers, Bittern, Bearded Tit, Avocet, Water Rail, Nightingale, Green Woodpecker, Woodlark, Barn Owl, Little Owl and heaps more.
Lancashire/Cumbria with visits to Leighton Moss, Wharten Crag, Bassenthwaite should get you some of the woodland birds plus another opportunity to get the reedbed species. Peregrine up at the crags with Raven and Little Owl. Osprey at Bassenthwaite.
A jaunt around North Wales has been mentioned already.
A trip to the Northumberland Coast for lots of woodland birds, Waders, Terns, Gannet, Skuas etc and the wilder parts of Northumberland for the Black and Red Grouse, breeding Golden Plover, Ring Ouzel, Goshawk.
Scotland next! Loch Garten area should get Osprey, Crested Tit, Capercaillie, Black and Red Grouse, Slavonian Grebe, Goldeneye, Redstart, Red-Thhroated Diver (Loon to you), Ptarmigan, Snow Bunting, Dotterel etc
A trip to Mull will give you White-tailed Eagle, Golden Eagle, Corncrake(on Iona), Puffin(on Staffa), Manx Shearwater, Great Skua, Twite etc
All these locations will also give you stunning scenery, castles and other places of interest along the way. City centre vist can be rewarding too with the likes of Newcastle Quayside that has been regenerated and also has the furthest inland breeding colony of Kittiwakes.
Whatever you do it'll be a fantastic trip!!

[POP]

Barry may I suggest you look at Birding Blogs Google map.Still in its infancy but lots of information for you to tap into,and local knowledge will steer you to accommodation etc.Incidentally when you hire your car ask for an automatic,my personal experience in driving in the states is there are not many cars you drive on the clutch.

POP

[John Cantelo]

I think that you already have some good suggestions here - particularly the BirdPal connection. Mid/late-April through into May would be a prime time to visit the UK.

My itinerary would be something like
i) on arrival (presumably near London) head straight from London over to South Wales & Pembrokeshire (which I'd argue is logistically better than North Wales) for seabirds and Chough. Although if time is short most species can be seen equally well in Scotland - Chough might mean a bit of a detour.
ii) divert south to Dorset (Portland Bill etc) for migrants and over to Dorset/New Forest border for Dartford Warbler etc.
iii) head along the coast for Dungeness/east Kent for more migrants (although if time is short you coud head straight up to Norfolk).
iv) plough up to East Anglia for the Brecks & the North Norfolk coast
v) continue north up the east coast to take in Yorkshire
vi) then on north to 'do' Scotland (which others can talk about with an authority that this confirmed southerner lacks).

If you head my way then do let me know so I can give more detailed info/ take you birding,

[Hotspur]

Hi Barry, I guess you wont want long trips for birds that occur in the states so Osprey, Peregrine, Raven, Ptarmigan, Slav(Horned) Grebe, Red-throated and Arctic Loon are out unless seen incidently I guess. Red Grouse, whilst officially the same species as Willow Ptarmigan are very different and are worth a look. Fortunately they are quite common in upland areas of heather moorland. The best place for lots of stuff together id have said would be Speyside (chance of Capercaillie, Golden Eagle, Ring Ouzel, Black Grouse, Crested Tit, 3 species of Crossbill, Dotterel, Dipper, Redstart, Wood Warbler, Spot and Pied Flycatcher and much more). A visit to Mull would get both Eagles and the chance of other birds of prey (Hen Harrier). As for lowland birds Norfolk is your best bet for all together but the southwest is also worth a look. I guess its working out what scarcer birds you want to see, finding out whats feasible and finding out what you could see anywhere. Some birds are tricky to see despite being fairly widespread such as Hawfinch and Lesser spotted Woodpecker.

[Andrew Whitehouse]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Minsmere - probably the best place to see a wide variety of stuff and particularly good for things like warblers that would interest an American birder.

[Hotspur]

Originally Posted by davercox

And Minsmere in Suffolk itself is a very reliable place for a good number of species.

I suppose it needed a more ringing endorsement but i agree Andrew.

[Skimmer15]

Thanks very much for all the great advice, everyone. My planning is moving right along. Here is what I am currently thinking of:

4 nights in London on arrival. This would be more for sightseeing than for seeing any birds, but I might try to visit one or two sites near London, especially if I ended up connecting with a London birder.

3 or 4 nights in the Devon/Dorset area - Yarner Wood, Prawle Point, Slapton Ley, maybe a stop or two at the Exe river mouth and/or Seaton, then a stop at Poole Harbour and maybe the New Forest. Perhaps a stop at the Portland Bill, if something good is there at the time.

2 or 3 nights in Kent, to hit Dungeness, Stodmarsh, and maybe Rye Harbour. I could really use help with a seawatch from Dungeness, as I am not experienced at all with sea birds.

7 nights in Suffolk/Norfolk - Minsmere, Walberswick, The Brecks, Hickling Broad, Cley, etc

1 or 2 nights near Hull for Spurn Head and maybe Flamborough Head

2 nights in Cheshire, where a birder I met online has offered to take me out for a couple of days to try to "mop up" the more common species that I haven't seen or been able to identify by then.

1 or 2 nights in North Wales, mostly along the north coast

1 or 2 nights near Leighton Moss in Lancashire, on the west coast

1 or 2 nights near Lindisfarne and the Farne Islands on the east coast

At that point, I would head up into Scotland. My Scottish plans are still pretty vague, and I don't have a route worked out yet, but here is what I was thinking:

A total of maybe as much as 12 or 13 days for Scotland, including:

1 or 2 nights in Edinburgh
3 or 4 nights in the Cairngorms and Speyside area (is that enough?)
A day at Loch Ruthven
Perhaps a visit to Deeside, for Glen Tanar and/or Glen Muick?
1 or 2 nights on Mull
2 nights on Skye and/or the Isle of Harris and Lewis - this would be as much for sightseeing and to visit places I remember from my first trip in 1971 as for birds

That would leave me an extra couple of days in Scotland. Any further suggestions, or should I spend longer some places? I don't think I am up for a trip to the Shetlands or the Orkneys.

If anyone has specific detailed advice for any of those areas, or if anyone along that route is interested in showing a visiting birder around, please let me know. It is still way too far in advance for any definite plans, but as the time gets closer, I plan to use the Birdingpal website to try to locate local birders, and I will post here in the appropriate county forums for specific advice. In the meantime, I am very open to any other ideas.

Thanks very much. This website is a wonderful resource and the people here are great!

Barry Brugman
USA
http://www.barry15.com

[POP]

Originally Posted by Skimmer15

Thanks very much for all the great advice, everyone. My planning is moving right along. Here is what I am currently thinking of:

4 nights in London on arrival. This would be more for sightseeing than for seeing any birds, but I might try to visit one or two sites near London, especially if I ended up connecting with a London birder.

3 or 4 nights in the Devon/Dorset area - Yarner Wood, Prawle Point, Slapton Ley, maybe a stop or two at the Exe river mouth and/or Seaton, then a stop at Poole Harbour and maybe the New Forest. Perhaps a stop at the Portland Bill, if something good is there at the time.

2 or 3 nights in Kent, to hit Dungeness, Stodmarsh, and maybe Rye Harbour. I could really use help with a seawatch from Dungeness, as I am not experienced at all with sea birds.

7 nights in Suffolk/Norfolk - Minsmere, Walberswick, The Brecks, Hickling Broad, Cley, etc

1 or 2 nights near Hull for Spurn Head and maybe Flamborough Head

2 nights in Cheshire, where a birder I met online has offered to take me out for a couple of days to try to "mop up" the more common species that I haven't seen or been able to identify by then.

1 or 2 nights in North Wales, mostly along the north coast

1 or 2 nights near Leighton Moss in Lancashire, on the west coast

1 or 2 nights near Lindisfarne and the Farne Islands on the east coast

At that point, I would head up into Scotland. My Scottish plans are still pretty vague, and I don't have a route worked out yet, but here is what I was thinking:

A total of maybe as much as 12 or 13 days for Scotland, including:

1 or 2 nights in Edinburgh
3 or 4 nights in the Cairngorms and Speyside area (is that enough?)
A day at Loch Ruthven
Perhaps a visit to Deeside, for Glen Tanar and/or Glen Muick?
1 or 2 nights on Mull
2 nights on Skye and/or the Isle of Harris and Lewis - this would be as much for sightseeing and to visit places I remember from my first trip in 1971 as for birds

That would leave me an extra couple of days in Scotland. Any further suggestions, or should I spend longer some places? I don't think I am up for a trip to the Shetlands or the Orkneys.

If anyone has specific detailed advice for any of those areas, or if anyone along that route is interested in showing a visiting birder around, please let me know. It is still way too far in advance for any definite plans, but as the time gets closer, I plan to use the Birdingpal website to try to locate local birders, and I will post here in the appropriate county forums for specific advice. In the meantime, I am very open to any other ideas.

Thanks very much. This website is a wonderful resource and the people here are great!

Barry Brugman
USA
http://www.barry15.com

Barry do remember to stop and take a breather,looking at your itinerary I have had to go and pour myself a Large G andT.

POP

[Skimmer15]

Hello POP,

Thanks for the advice, it gave me a chuckle. I know it sounds like a lot of places, and it seems like a non-stop push, but I have done four Australia trips, and they have all been similar. The first was 4 weeks, the second was 5 weeks, and the last two have been 6 weeks each. You can see my Aussie itineraries on my website at http://www.barry15.com , then click on each trip to see the actual itinerary.

I probably help make up for all the places I visit by not really going flat out all day long. I am not an early riser, and in Austrlia it was dark by 6 PM. It will be interesting to see what I do in Britain, especially in the north, in May, when there is so much daylight. I had a lot more driving to do in Australia, too, since the distances are so great.

I'm no spring chicken, though, and getting older every year (like all of us). I'm sure I will take time to rest and recuperate along the way. If I miss some birding opportunities, then so be it. In Britain, I am sure I will have plenty of rainy days, too, and I am not dedicated enough to be out birding in the rain, so that will give me some break time, too. It does appear to be a pretty ambitious itinerary, though, when it is all listed out like that, doesn't it?

Barry Brugman
USA

[devilbirder]

See http://editthis.info/londonbirders its a brilliant site if you're a birder visiting London.
http://www.kentos.org.uk is a good site for Kent too.

[davercox]

Barry, it sounds like you want to visit Lewis/Harris anyway, but for me the Uists and Benbecula are unmissable if you're out that way; just magical places quite apart from the waders and Corncrakes (and often a good skua passage in mid-May). Maybe you could do the triangular trip from Uig on Skye, using Tarbert and Lochmaddy ferries ?

[bitterntwisted]

Barry,

That sounds like a superb trip. I'm jealous myself of a month like that birding the country non-stop. I would use birdingpal as suggested. You'd get more out of several of the locations with a little local knowledge, and if you're trying to maximise the number of species then local ears and knowledge will help you get less visible species like Grasshopper Warbler, Lesser Whitethroat, Water Rail etc. I'd personally be happy to take a day out with you anywhere from the Yorks coast to North Wales to Lancs and Cumbria. (The beauty of being in Leeds is that everywhere is about ninety minutes away.)

Graham

[Skimmer15]

David - thanks for the info on London birding.


Dave - I had just about reached that same conclusion, that if I am going to be on Harris, I ought to spend some time on the Uists as well. That is what I am looking at now, and I'm trying to decide whether two nights on the Uists is enough, or if I can squeeze out another one. The trip is already six weeks long, and I have to put some kind of limit on it, or I'll be there for months. I read some of the trip reports on the Outer Hebrides, here on BirdForum, and I am very excited about it. The trip is still a year away, but when the time gets closer, I'll try to get some more specific information on where to look for birds on the Uists and Benbecula, by posting in the appropriate forum. I imagine that there is a book I could buy, too.


Graham - Yes, I definitely plan to use birdingpal. I have used it to find local birders in Australia, and it is really a treat to be able to go out with local birders. It appears that there are a large number of British participants on birdingpal, and I plan to send out emails when the time gets closer. I'll respond by private message or email with respect to your kind offer to take me out.


Thanks again to all the great people here who so generously offer their help to others.


Barry Brugman
USA
http://www.barry15.com

[delia todd]

Hi Barry

There quite a bit of information on Opus too for Scotland.

I don't think you'll need a whole day for Loch Ruthven. We had a Bash in Strathspey in 2006 and here's what we got up to Reports start from post 77.

I fear you'll need more than one or two nights on Mull

D