[stevieb]

She got caught up in the hedge. Just as well I was there to help her out. Beautiful bird though!

Notice I wore heavy duty garden gloves!!

Steve

[razorsharp]

Excellent mate, good thing you were there to help her out, you can't get much closer to a sprawk than that!

[ChrisKten]

It's great if you was able to help, though I must admit I wouldn't have taken a picture.

[Apodemus]

I would.

[stevieb]

Originally Posted by ChrisKten

It's great if you was able to help, though I must admit I wouldn't have taken a picture.

My camera totin' missus was already in the garden.

The Sprawk was stressed when trapped in the hedge but calmed down immediately once freed.

I only had her in the hand for a moment at most.

Who, in all honesty, wouldn't have taken photos if the same opportunity arose?

She flew away strongly and will no doubt return to terrorise the birds around my feeder in the near future!

[ChrisKten]

Originally Posted by stevieb

[...]
Who, in all honesty, wouldn't have taken photos if the same opportunity arose?

Well, me, for one; but in fairness I should explain myself:


Firstly, my experience with birds is confined to my garden, I'm not even a learner, let alone an expert. So my reaction to this may be wrong, in fact judging by the fact I'm the only one that said they wouldn't have taken a picture, I probably am wrong.

However, my garden has many birds visiting, including SparrowHawks (search my posts if you are interested). I have had to help many birds over the last few years. Many were hobbled by discarded string, some caught up in string they brought with them that got caught on a twig, and some that were sick (but never any Sparrowhawks). All these birds had one thing in common (apart from the seriously ill ones), they were absolutely terrified when captured. They look at you convinced they will be eaten. When you release them they think they've escaped death, they have no understanding of being helped.

So whenever I've helped a bird I've either released it instantly, or got it in a box straight away. I've never even thought of taking or posing for a picture.

As I said above, it appears I'm alone in feeling this way. But I never said that you shouldn't have taken a picture, I just said that I wouldn't have.

[razorsharp]

I know the feeling ChrisKten. There was a Redpoll caught in the clothes on the washing line and I went out to release it, the look of what seeemed like fear in the bird was something else, I released it in seconds and it flew away chirping.

I don't think it has a lasting effect on the birds, after all thousands of birds are ringed every year, and fly hundreds of miles unhampered by the situation. I suppose we can't say for sure though.

I have to admit, I would have taken some quick snaps of the Sprawk too.

[ChrisKten]

Originally Posted by razorsharp

I know the feeling ChrisKten. There was a Redpoll caught in the clothes on the washing line and I went out to release it, the look of what seeemed like fear in the bird was something else, I released it in seconds and it flew away chirping.

I don't think it has a lasting effect on the birds, after all thousands of birds are ringed every year, and fly hundreds of miles unhampered by the situation. I suppose we can't say for sure though.

I have to admit, I would have taken some quick snaps of the Sprawk too.

Yeah, I suppose it's just me. It might be because I've been lucky enough to see and video a few Sparrowhawks in my garden, so it might be a bit different for me.

It's like I'm happy to see Hawks wild, doing what they do naturally, but I don't feel comfortable seeing them in someone's hands.

But I don't want to become evangelical about it; I'm sure that all in this forum try their best to help Wildlife.

[Birdbrain]

So you must not agree with ringing then ?

[ChrisKten]

Originally Posted by Steve Lyon

So you must not agree with ringing then ?

I'm guessing that you are not serious, but I'll bite.

If ringing Birds helps the species by, amongst other things, monitoring populations, how could I not agree with it. Ringing is useful as an early indicator that a species is in trouble.

However, Ringing is carried out by individuals that are highly trained, and need to be licensed; they are not the average person trying to help a Bird in their garden.

Having said that, I still don't like to see birds being handled; nor do I like to see them in cages. It is important to note that I said "I don't like to see", not "It is an evil practice"

[Birdbrain]

Fair comment ! just thought id stick my beak in

I used to have a Parrot in a cage but i got the bird from someone i new and i made sure it was as young as poss, in fact it was a little pink blob, so to me it didn't know much about being in a cage or not.

But when it was tame enough i changed the cage to a stand and Spike (the birds name) much preferred it.

But everyone to there own

[ChrisKten]

Did you know that Parrots can live for over 80 years? I think the oldest is/was over 100.

[Birdbrain]

Yes and he his 22 years old and still living with my dad lol

I moved and have had to leave him behind as it is not right to move him, and where i live now there is a cat a dog a rabbit and three mad boys LOL

[Richard W]

sat in on many ringing sessions since 2000 and am always surprised at how calm the majority of birds being handled are, although is fair to say some are louder & appear to be more distressed than others.

the male Sprawk caught chasing Fieldfares a few months ago was remarkably calm through the whole process which did surprise me, they really are stunning birds to see close up, nice photos stevieb, attached is one I took of the ringed bird, moments before release.

[fugl]

Wonderful photos--both sets. Those big wide-open eyes are really something.

As far as being caught and handled by humans is concerned, I would have thought that would be just another day in the life for most birds. Like many other small animals, the average bird must lead a very stressful existence, full of hairbreadth escapes from predators & emotional ups-and-downs of all sorts. Just an observation, by the way--I'm not suggesting that care shouldn't be taken to avoid stressing birds unnecessarily.

[ChrisKten]

OK then, so it looks like it's just me that doesn't like seeing birds handled. But that's OK, I'm sure there are other things we think alike on.

I will just say one thing that I'm surprised nobody has mentioned. If anyone reads this thread who has never handled a bird, especially a Hawk, please don't think you just need a pair of gardening gloves. As a general rule handling Raptors is for people that know what they are doing. If the gloves aren't strong enough you'll end up at the Hospital; if you squeeze too tightly you can break the Bird's bones (this applies to all birds). There's also the fact that you can't feel what's going on in your hands with thick gloves on.

On the other hand, if a bird is in distress, doing nothing can be even more of a risk.

EDIT: I'd better add that I've only handled Starlings, Pigeons, and Blackbirds, so I'm no expert.

[razorsharp]

I wonder if birds do feel stress and emotions. I, never really thought they had emotions. They must feel fear, it drives them to escape predators. Whether it has a lasting effect on the bird and how stressed it becomes is something I suppose nobody could really answer.

[ChrisKten]

Originally Posted by razorsharp

I wonder if birds do feel stress and emotions. I, never really thought they had emotions. They must feel fear, it drives them to escape predators. Whether it has a lasting effect on the bird and how stressed it becomes is something I suppose nobody could really answer.

I think it's accepted that birds feel stress, in fact it's called a "silent killer" in some circles when related to captive birds. Also putting a sick or injured bird in a dark quiet place to avoid stress is also advised.

I'm not sure about emotions, although I do often see what I interpret as emotions in birds and animals. Are happiness and sadness emotions? If a bird is well fed and content does it behave differently to a bird that's hungry and stressed? And if the bird does behave differently, can this be interpreted as emotions?

So I think birds have emotions, whether this can, or will, be proven is another matter.

[Pigeon_Pete]

Originally Posted by stevieb

She got caught up in the hedge. Just as well I was there to help her out. Beautiful bird though!

Notice I wore heavy duty garden gloves!!

Steve

Those eyes are amazing. I would probably have taken several close ups of them

I used to study racing pigeons eyes as a teenager, as it was thought then and probably still now that long distance winners (500 miles +) always had exceptional eye markings

[Adam W]

I like youre profile picture pete.

[Pigeon_Pete]

Originally Posted by Adam W

I like youre profile picture pete.

Yes indeed...........

I swapped my shotgun for a camcorder and camera last year...actually I sold my gun and bought the camcorder with the money.

I trialled my Labrador and pointers for many years and have spent thousands of hours looking at birds and wildlife in some lovely estates in Scotland. I have also walked literally thousands of miles over grouse moors in SW and central Scotland counting grouse with my pointers.

My first love was always birds....