Join for FREE
It only takes a minute!

Welcome to BirdForum.
BirdForum is the net's largest birding community, dedicated to wild birds and birding, and is absolutely FREE! You are most welcome to register for an account, which allows you to take part in lively discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 1 votes, 5.00 average.
Old Saturday 5th June 2004, 12:49   #1
KCFoggin
Super Moderator
 
KCFoggin's Avatar

 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Myrtle Beach SC "Smiling Faces, Beautiful Places"
Posts: 146,209
Calming the white down

I previously posted this in the gallery and, where I am happy with the shot overall as the sun was directly overhead, I was wondering if any of you have any ideas as to how to make the white in this shot less glaring. I tried selecting the area and using levels to a small extent but too much play made for an un-natural image. Curves weren't much better. Are there any tricks for whites like this?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	053104rhwoodie1a.bf.jpg
Views:	141
Size:	35.9 KB
ID:	9503  
__________________
KC a/k/a common KC

Karma - What you send out
Comes right back at ya
KCFoggin is online now  
Reply With Quote
BF Supporter 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014
Click here to Support BirdForum
Old Saturday 5th June 2004, 14:05   #2
tsiya
Registered User
 
tsiya's Avatar

 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: St. Augustine, Florida
Posts: 744
No data in the white spots

I don't think software can find anything in the burnt spots to work with, You may find some pattern to accentuate, but fine detail just usually isn't there.
__________________
http://www.pbase.com/tsiya

Bob
tsiya is offline  
Reply With Quote
BF Supporter 2009
Click here to Support BirdForum
Old Sunday 6th June 2004, 06:40   #3
Adey Baker
Member
 
Adey Baker's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Hinckley, Leics
Posts: 4,808
White is white and any toning down will tint it greyish - the bottom slider in levels will do it a bit but may flatten the contrast somewhat. try 'burning-in' with the burn tool (the clenched-fist symbol)
Adey Baker is offline  
Reply With Quote
BF Supporter 2005 2006 2007 2009
Click here to Support BirdForum
Old Sunday 6th June 2004, 17:48   #4
Jay Turberville
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Fountain Hills, AZ
Posts: 409
Quote:
Originally Posted by KCFoggin
I previously posted this in the gallery and, where I am happy with the shot overall as the sun was directly overhead, I was wondering if any of you have any ideas as to how to make the white in this shot less glaring. I tried selecting the area and using levels to a small extent but too much play made for an un-natural image. Curves weren't much better. Are there any tricks for whites like this?
There is no detail in the white area which is why it doesn't look right when you darken it. The rule of thumb with digital and slide photography is to expose for the highlights and let the shadows fall where they may. The best approach is to underexpose the original to preserve the detail in the white feathers. Then you use curves, levels etc. to bring the darker areas up to where you want, keeping the lighter areas pretty much as they were.

Here is a quick example of how I typically deal with this issue.
http://www.jayandwanda.com/digiscope/controlwhite.jpg

The first panel is the original unchanged exposure. Its dark. The EXIF data shows that I used a -0.7 EV adjustment. The relatively bright sky naturally caused the auto-exposure to make the image a bit darker than would have been optimal for the bird. The sky is too dark and murky since the camera probably tried to make it a middle gray value. But the flower looks nice. BTW, I expected this woodpecker to come to this flower. So I was prepared and had done test exposures ahead of time and verified the result in the camera's histogram.

The second panel shows the results when I make a duplicate layer in Photoshop and tweak curves for the bird and ignore what happens to the flower. The sky looks more normal. The bird and cactus look about right. But you can see that the flower's details get blown out - much like the white feathers in your picture.

The third panel shows the results when I add a layer mask to the second lightened layer and paint in a mask that lets the flowers from the original exposure show through.

There are other ways to accomplish this, but the principle to remember is that if your exposure does not maintain detail in an area of importance, no amount of post processing will revive the detail. With digital, this is often a problem with very bright areas of contrasty scenes. Sometimes, even exposure compensations are inadequate. In those cases only a double exposure can help - which isn't much help with a moving bird.

BTW, this image is from a little experiment I did to make a very high resolution image that also showed a lot of the bird's environment. I used 10 images taken through the scope with my CP5000 to construct a broad view image. Think of it as a digiscoped panorama. You can look at the 1/4 rez and 1/2 resolution images here.

http://www.jayandwanda.com/birds/woo...ilaWide_SM.jpg (350KB)

http://www.jayandwanda.com/birds/woo...s/GilaWide.jpg (1MB)
__________________
Jay Turberville
www.jayandwanda.com
Jay Turberville is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 6th June 2004, 18:27   #5
KCFoggin
Super Moderator
 
KCFoggin's Avatar

 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Myrtle Beach SC "Smiling Faces, Beautiful Places"
Posts: 146,209
Geez Jay, that very last shot shows the detail in the bird and flowers spectacularly. I've copied and pasted all this info in my notes and I thank you very much for taking the time to explain it in such detail. I know I am not using my imaging software to it's fullest. Hopefully in time I will learn it all. Thank you.
__________________
KC a/k/a common KC

Karma - What you send out
Comes right back at ya
KCFoggin is online now  
Reply With Quote
BF Supporter 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014
Click here to Support BirdForum
Old Sunday 6th June 2004, 19:22   #6
cspratt
Registered User
 
cspratt's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Victoria, B. C.
Posts: 415
"The third panel shows the results when I add a layer mask to the second lightened layer and paint in a mask that lets the flowers from the original exposure show through."

A few hints on how to do this would be really helpful. I've no idea how to "paint a mask".

Thanks,
__________________
Chris. Spratt
Victoria, BC., Canada B. C.
-----
"I choose my friends for their good looks, my acquaintances for their good characters, and my enemies for their intellects. A man cannot be too careful in the choice of his enemies." Oscar Wilde
cspratt is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 6th June 2004, 19:53   #7
Jay Turberville
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Fountain Hills, AZ
Posts: 409
Quote:
Originally Posted by cspratt
A few hints on how to do this would be really helpful. I've no idea how to "paint a mask".
Thanks,
I thought those were hints. A Google search on Photoshop Layer Mask will turn up a ton of info. The web is virtually overflowing with Photoshop tutorials. The top two are the most relevant.

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tu...blending.shtml
http://www.astropix.com/HTML/J_DIGIT/LAYMASK.HTM
http://www.myjanee.com/tuts/layermask/layermask.htm
http://www.bairarteditions.com/pages.../laymasks.html
__________________
Jay Turberville
www.jayandwanda.com
Jay Turberville is offline  
Reply With Quote
Advertisement
Reply


Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Any news of White Storks? Nancy Birds & Birding 35 Wednesday 28th April 2004 10:02
A Morning in North-West Norfolk Jasonbirder Your Birding Day 7 Sunday 25th April 2004 08:36
Scotland Tour - March 2004 Jasonbirder Vacational Trip Reports 5 Thursday 1st April 2004 17:24
red, white and black headed garden bird scotland nemphlar99 Bird Identification Q&A 6 Wednesday 11th February 2004 19:19
Great White Egret Grousemore Bird Identification Q&A 38 Thursday 11th September 2003 23:54

{googleads}

Fatbirder's Top 1000 Birding Websites

Search the net with ask.com
Help support BirdForum
Ask.com and get

Page generated in 0.20965695 seconds with 17 queries
All times are GMT. The time now is 00:18.