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Old Thursday 10th February 2011, 16:38   #1
Tero
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Nikon ProStaff 7

seem to be 200 dollar Nikons, phase coated
http://www.binoculars.com/binoculars...4295084483.cfm

8x and 10x, camo for hunters.
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Old Thursday 10th February 2011, 16:40   #2
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Tero:

Are you recommending these? How are they. Need more info.

Jerry
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Old Thursday 10th February 2011, 19:48   #3
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No, I have no idea, it just looks like between Trailblazer and Monarch.
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Old Thursday 10th February 2011, 20:08   #4
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These are on Nikons hunting website - the 8X is almost 7 inches long and only a 13.1 ft close focus - not very impressive.
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Old Thursday 10th February 2011, 21:17   #5
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The bridge is similar to the one on the new EDG II. Hmmm? Overall appearance shows a strong familial resemblance between them.

Is this ultimately the new look for all of Nikon's standard size roof prisms? First the top ones, then the bottom ones and maybe then the ones in the middle.

Bob

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Old Thursday 10th February 2011, 22:54   #6
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I kind of like the looks, like my first serious binoculars.
http://www.nikonhunting.com/products...ff_7/8x42/7537

standard 315ft fov for 10x42

If these are any good, who needs 10x Monarchs?

8x42 fov is only 330 ft.
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Old Friday 11th February 2011, 00:01   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
I kind of like the looks, like my first serious binoculars.
http://www.nikonhunting.com/products...ff_7/8x42/7537

standard 315ft fov for 10x42

If these are any good, who needs 10x Monarchs?

8x42 fov is only 330 ft.
Tero:

Nice to see Nikon bring forward some new roofs. Checking the specs. these
seem to offer alum. prism. coatings while the Monarch has di-electric, which
one do you think will be brighter, I believe silver is in between those. Also FOV is something most have found does vary among optics.

It looks like these do not replace the Monarch, but now fit in the entry level, then Monarch, then the rest, and there are steps in between.

Jerry
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Old Friday 11th February 2011, 00:11   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
I kind of like the looks, like my first serious binoculars.
http://www.nikonhunting.com/products...ff_7/8x42/7537

standard 315ft fov for 10x42

If these are any good, who needs 10x Monarchs?

8x42 fov is only 330 ft.
Tero:

Back again, I do need to respond to your wanting your first serious binoculars.
I don't know if you have tried the Nikon SE 8x32, but I know I've seen you comment on many others in the lower tiers, and often disappointed.

You do need a pair of these, they seem to be as good or better than any of
the Nikons, including the EDG. Not waterproof, not as eyeglass friendly, but
the view is pristine, nothing new here, have you tried them?

There is not a better value in binocular optics today.

Jerry
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Old Friday 11th February 2011, 00:42   #9
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Yeah, I keep hearing about them. But I got the roof prism disease with my first Nikons in 2006. It's hard to get rid of. I do like the size of the 8x32 though.

I don't actually need anything, but this winter has slowed my birding quite a bit. I did get four lifers in december, from a bird feeder and a river.
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Old Friday 11th February 2011, 19:05   #10
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Great discussion everyone! Jerry is absolutely right about the placement of the ProStaff 7 within the different Nikon lines. As you all know one of our strengths is quality optics at multiple different price points. This helps reach more birders and helps bring options to beginning birders/outdoors people.

The body style is extremely similar to the EDG II. This was the first thought I had as well. I had the chance to view them briefly at SHOT show in Vegas. I was really impressed with the optics especially in that $200 price point. Lightweight and easy to handle as far as I am concerned.

Nikon has shown me some charts in the past that differentiate the different coatings. While I am still learning everyday about the different coatings and techniques, the dielectric coatings are far brighter according to the charts.

One question I would love to find out is how those coatings are applied. I know the dielectric coatings are applied in a gas chamber to reach all of the tiny spots other machines can't. Does this go the same for silver and aluminum coatings? I assume not, but haven't heard otherwise. Have a great weekend everyone!

Best,
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Old Saturday 12th February 2011, 06:18   #11
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Silver and aluminum coatings are also applied by vapor deposition.

As are phase coatings and dielectric coatings (the latter two are essentially the same stuff just applied in different set of multilayers with different thickness for the two different purposes) and the AR coatings (more metal oxides vapor deposited).
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Old Sunday 13th February 2011, 05:18   #12
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From looking at the new Prostaff 7, which are more than an inch longer than the Monarchs, and have more "barrel" to wrap my fingers around, I would probably like the ergonomics better than the Monarchs, but I wouldn't buy them because of their lesser prism coatings, which takes us back a two decades to aluminum.

Being that the Prostaff 7 has the same specs as the Monarchs and mimics the shape of the upscale EDG II, it puzzles me that Nikon didn't redesign the Monarch with this body style instead of bringing out a new entry level of roof with better ergonomics but lesser optics!

A newly designed EDG and Monarch would have been something to talk about!

My unsolicited (and free) advice:

Drop the Trailblazer. Except for neophyte birders and hunters willing to buy plastic packaged sporting good store bins, I can't see the point of these in a day where Chinese p-coated roofs are so cheap.

I also can't see the point of the Monarch X design, with it's obstructed "open bridge". I would redesign the Monarch X, keeping the sharp optics, good edges, and dielectric coatings, but house the optics in a modified Prostaff 7 body (to accommodate the larger objectives).

The X2 would compete nicely against the Leupold 8.5x45 Northfolk for around the same price.

I would add ED glass to the Premier series. Too much CA for that price point. I'd also add gel pad thumb indents like on the EDG to make them easier to hold.

The Premier ED would compete against the SLC-HD but more competitively because of their lower price.

Leave the SE series as it is except keep upgrading subsequent production runs with more advanced coatings like you have been doing. But please gives us a better strap! Even the Nikon standard strap (NIK-6118 38 mm) is more comfortable, and I use it on my SEs.

Some suggest adding twist-up eyecups to the SE. I think that's a bad idea because if they were fit over the oversized prism housing, wider than the width of the current rubber fold down eyecups, they would be humongous and too uncomfortable for users with deep set eyes.

ED glass would be a nice addition, particularly on the 10x42 and 12x50 models (I sold the 12x50s because the CA was too distracting for watching birds of prey). However, if the ED glass drives up the price more than $200, it probably wouldn't be worth it.

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Old Sunday 13th February 2011, 13:15   #13
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Yes, I should really look at the new Monarchs as well. My pair had the eye cups that would not stay out so I eventually put rubber bands to hold them out. The current Monarch is probably decent even if not ED.
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Old Sunday 13th February 2011, 17:29   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
seem to be 200 dollar Nikons, phase coated
http://www.binoculars.com/binoculars...4295084483.cfm
Nice to see on this site's spec page that the binoculars don't weigh anything.

I'll pass... *sigh* I can live with the not-so-close focus, but another narrow 330' field? No thanks.
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Old Sunday 13th February 2011, 23:26   #15
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Well..........wide field eyepieces would increase their costs somewhat and then there would be edge problems to complain about I guess. Life ain't fair!
Bob
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Old Monday 14th February 2011, 00:03   #16
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Well..........wide field eyepieces would increase their costs somewhat and then there would be edge problems to complain about I guess. Life ain't fair!
Bob
Well, Bob, it just goes to show you, it's always something! If it's not one thing, it's another! :-)

R.I.P. Gilda Radner
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Old Sunday 20th February 2011, 03:13   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brocknroller View Post
From looking at the new Prostaff 7, which are more than an inch longer than the Monarchs, and have more "barrel" to wrap my fingers around, I would probably like the ergonomics better than the Monarchs, but I wouldn't buy them because of their lesser prism coatings, which takes us back a two decades to aluminum.

Being that the Prostaff 7 has the same specs as the Monarchs and mimics the shape of the upscale EDG II, it puzzles me that Nikon didn't redesign the Monarch with this body style instead of bringing out a new entry level of roof with better ergonomics but lesser optics!

A newly designed EDG and Monarch would have been something to talk about!

My unsolicited (and free) advice:

Drop the Trailblazer. Except for neophyte birders and hunters willing to buy plastic packaged sporting good store bins, I can't see the point of these in a day where Chinese p-coated roofs are so cheap.

I also can't see the point of the Monarch X design, with it's obstructed "open bridge". I would redesign the Monarch X, keeping the sharp optics, good edges, and dielectric coatings, but house the optics in a modified Prostaff 7 body (to accommodate the larger objectives).

The X2 would compete nicely against the Leupold 8.5x45 Northfolk for around the same price.

I would add ED glass to the Premier series. Too much CA for that price point. I'd also add gel pad thumb indents like on the EDG to make them easier to hold.

The Premier ED would compete against the SLC-HD but more competitively because of their lower price.

Leave the SE series as it is except keep upgrading subsequent production runs with more advanced coatings like you have been doing. But please gives us a better strap! Even the Nikon standard strap (NIK-6118 38 mm) is more comfortable, and I use it on my SEs.

Some suggest adding twist-up eyecups to the SE. I think that's a bad idea because if they were fit over the oversized prism housing, wider than the width of the current rubber fold down eyecups, they would be humongous and too uncomfortable for users with deep set eyes.

ED glass would be a nice addition, particularly on the 10x42 and 12x50 models (I sold the 12x50s because the CA was too distracting for watching birds of prey). However, if the ED glass drives up the price more than $200, it probably wouldn't be worth it.
Brock:

I think many of the things you mention here are very good recommendations to
Nikon.

I am thinking they should include you as a mentor, and advisor, on the semi-professional staff.

Whatever that means.

For the Nikon guys watching the purple colored "SHE" , ( Plum binocular, green bag, ) Monarch package was a large
waste, witness the large discounts, to clear them out, who in the world, thought of that.

Jerry

Last edited by NDhunter : Sunday 20th February 2011 at 03:16.
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Old Sunday 20th February 2011, 03:50   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brocknroller View Post
From looking at the new Prostaff 7, which are more than an inch longer than the Monarchs, and have more "barrel" to wrap my fingers around, I would probably like the ergonomics better than the Monarchs, but I wouldn't buy them because of their lesser prism coatings, which takes us back a two decades to aluminum.

Being that the Prostaff 7 has the same specs as the Monarchs and mimics the shape of the upscale EDG II, it puzzles me that Nikon didn't redesign the Monarch with this body style instead of bringing out a new entry level of roof with better ergonomics but lesser optics!

A newly designed EDG and Monarch would have been something to talk about!

My unsolicited (and free) advice:

Drop the Trailblazer. Except for neophyte birders and hunters willing to buy plastic packaged sporting good store bins, I can't see the point of these in a day where Chinese p-coated roofs are so cheap.

I also can't see the point of the Monarch X design, with it's obstructed "open bridge". I would redesign the Monarch X, keeping the sharp optics, good edges, and dielectric coatings, but house the optics in a modified Prostaff 7 body (to accommodate the larger objectives).

The X2 would compete nicely against the Leupold 8.5x45 Northfolk for around the same price.

I would add ED glass to the Premier series. Too much CA for that price point. I'd also add gel pad thumb indents like on the EDG to make them easier to hold.

The Premier ED would compete against the SLC-HD but more competitively because of their lower price.

Leave the SE series as it is except keep upgrading subsequent production runs with more advanced coatings like you have been doing. But please gives us a better strap! Even the Nikon standard strap (NIK-6118 38 mm) is more comfortable, and I use it on my SEs.

Some suggest adding twist-up eyecups to the SE. I think that's a bad idea because if they were fit over the oversized prism housing, wider than the width of the current rubber fold down eyecups, they would be humongous and too uncomfortable for users with deep set eyes.

ED glass would be a nice addition, particularly on the 10x42 and 12x50 models (I sold the 12x50s because the CA was too distracting for watching birds of prey). However, if the ED glass drives up the price more than $200, it probably wouldn't be worth it.
It looks like they have already made changes in the Monarch ATB already. See these now being sold at LL Bean. They have the new Prostaff 7 styling and same narrow FOV. Same new look is on other models too although the Trailblazers have a very long bridge. Even the Monarch X has the new look while keeping the center post. It looks like this is Nikons new look!

Looky here:

http://www.llbean.com/llb/shop/66771?feat=891-GN1

Bob

Last edited by ceasar : Sunday 20th February 2011 at 04:20. Reason: addendum
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Old Sunday 20th February 2011, 04:28   #19
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Brock:

I think many of the things you mention here are very good recommendations to
Nikon.

I am thinking they should include you as a mentor, and advisor, on the semi-professional staff.

Whatever that means.

For the Nikon guys watching the purple colored "SHE" , ( Plum binocular, green bag, ) Monarch package was a large
waste, witness the large discounts, to clear them out, who in the world, thought of that.

Jerry
Thanks, Jerry. I would very much like to be a Nikon Semi-Prostaffer, particularly if the job came with some Nikon "semi-pro" optics such as an 8x32 SE (550xxx), latest production run 10x42 SE, and a 10x35 EII (black body). Roofs are for "pros".

As far as who thought up the SHE bin, it would have to be she... or he....or she?

http://img.listal.com/image/1187174/500full.jpg

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Old Sunday 20th February 2011, 17:14   #20
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Bob
The Nikon Monarchs shown on your link to LL Bean look like the standard Monarch III with the dielectric coating indtroduced in 2010.

Brock
The SHE binos were a marketing tie in with Pam Zaitz who owns SHE Safari & SHE Outdoor Apparel, and is one of Nikons hunting pros. Her line of outdoor clothing is cut for women and rather pricey.

tom
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Old Sunday 20th February 2011, 20:38   #21
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Bob
The Nikon Monarchs shown on your link to LL Bean look like the standard Monarch III with the dielectric coating indtroduced in 2010.

Brock
The SHE binos were a marketing tie in with Pam Zaitz who owns SHE Safari & SHE Outdoor Apparel, and is one of Nikons hunting pros. Her line of outdoor clothing is cut for women and rather pricey.

tom
Tom,

Thanks for that information. And what a SHE she is!

Except for being a female big game hunter, which I would imagine is heavily male dominated, there is nothing gender ambiguous about her (don't open this link if your wife is looking over your shoulder, because you don't want her to see the reflection of your eyes bugging out on the computer screen):

http://www.outdoorenvy.com/pam_zaitz.html

I'm not sure if this is also SHE or a woman modeling her SHE safari clothes:

http://www.bowhunting.com/publisher/...l-availability

I didn't realized there was a market niche large enough to cater to fashionable women's hunting apparel. Thought they just wore small sized men's hunting outfits. That probably was the case before SHE came along.

Now I know the reason why hunting has fallen off in the US; guys are too busy hunting for women in SHE apparel to hunt game!

As far as why the SHE bins are purple, perhaps purple is the new pink. I will check with Elle Woods. :-)

Brock
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Old Sunday 20th February 2011, 20:48   #22
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LLBean currently has an unusual comprehensive 30% off on all items offer.
They carry the Nikon line, as well as Swarovski.
So if you have selected the glass you want, it might be a good time to wrap up a purchase.
Do note that this may be US/Canada only.
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Old Sunday 20th February 2011, 21:12   #23
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You need a coupon code for that

http://www.retailmenot.com/view/llbean.com

FREE SHIPPING and 30% OFF USING THESE TWO CODES: LL3039329 for FREE SHIPPING and JPA4393 for 30% OFF for a limited time (until 2/22)
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Old Wednesday 9th March 2011, 15:51   #24
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Bob, Your picture of the Monarch 8x42 ATB (L.L.Bean) confirms an initial impression that the 'dielectric' badge looks as if it's just a temporary sticker. If meant to be permanent, it would surely have been placed in a position opposite the Monarch badge (instead of a bit higher, as shown in the photo) and thus present a more 'balanced' appearance. This may seem rather trivial, even nit-picking, but I'd expect Nikon to be aware of such detail.
Brock, the 'gender ambiguity' you mention would be especially noticeable in the UK. Fox hunting is anathema to most people here, never mind 'big game' hunting, and the idea of women being involved in any kind of hunting is not only 'politically incorrect' but also socially unacceptable, so there'd be no market for 'fashionable women's hunting apparel'.
Incidentally, although in the USA "camo" bin's seem popular, in the UK there's hardly any demand for camouflaged binoculars, perhaps reflecting moral attitudes to hunting, quite apart from the vastly different scale of the terrain and wildlife...
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Old Tuesday 22nd March 2011, 13:04   #25
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Fit - before anything else

I looked online to the Prostaff line, but I just can't imagine using a 7 inch binos. I think is way too long. For me I only like 5.5 inches and below size, it feels much more steady in the hands and is more portable. I think a 6 inch binos is plenty long. My never ending shaking issues with an 8x is less pronounced in a 5.5 inch binos compared to a 6 inch binos. My motto for binos is "fit" (before anything else) so everybody is different.
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