[birdman]

I AM A LISTER!!!

To list or not to list is quite often the question here on BF, with many arguments on both sides, but there will always be those who will and those who won't.

Perhaps, the demarcation might be further defined, those who do, those who don't, those who did and (I guess) those who won't.

So why do I list?

That's not as straightforward a thing to answer as it might be.

Perhaps I am at that stage in my birding "career" where listing is useful for me, and maybe there will come a time when it has "served it's purpose".

Listing, maybe, is always destined to be a pursuit that becomes less relevant as one's list becomes larger, and therefore becomes ultimately self-defeating. There are (in spite of many efforts to the contrary) only a finite number of species, and the majority of us will reach our own plateau well short of 10,000.

Of course, if you start a different list... well then it becomes self-perpetuating, and perhaps then it takes over. At least one member (Tim Allwood, I think - so stand up and be counted if it is you, Tim) is of the opinion that time spent listing is time that could otherwise be spent actually birding, and if your lists drive your birding, rather than your birding drives your lists, you lose out on what might be more fulfilling activities, just to get that extra "tick".

Even as a lister, I agree with this point of view. One should not be the slave of one's lists, surely?

But, on the whole, I think listing is A Good Thing - and perhaps even a necessary thing, for me at least.

Until I joined BF, I kept my "list" in my head. In fact it is only about a year or so ago that I finally got round to putting it down on paper.

At the same time, I began to make lists of the birds I identified whilst out birding, and therefore became much more active in my list-building.

I did this, because it seemed like a good idea at the time, but there was no "ulterior motive" as it were.

But, what has happened, and has happened as a direct consequence of becoming a lister, is that I am a better birder.

Not better than you, but better than I used to be.

THAT is why I'm a lister.

[helenol]

I dont' do lists. Having said that, my thread in My Local Patch is named Garden "observations" Makes me feel better anyhow.

Doesn't matter really I suppose, everyone to themselves, I say. The end of the day, whatever floats your boat.

[Larry Lade]

I am a "lister" and a "record keeper". I just like to know how many species of birds I have seen, in the world, individual countries (I have not been in that many, six I think), local patches, in my yard, etc.). I do this primarily for myself but do make this information available to others if they should request it. I like to record the birds I see whenever I go afield. For Missouri birds I enter the information into my "Missouri Notebook". For each bird that I have seen in Missouri I have a page divided into 365 blocks (one block for each day of the year). If I have seen a bird that day I enter the year and location seen in the respective block. Looking through the notebook I can get a good idea of when the birds are in Missouri, when I can expect the migrants to arrive and leave the state, etc. Of course, some species I have only seen a few times (a few only once). I can look at the book and see at what time of the year the birds are more likely to be seen. I understand that there are other ways for me to get this information, but it just personalizes it for me when I have entered the data myself. To some this activity may seen to be "over kill", but I enjoy doing it most of the time. Sometimes I do think that it would be nice just to go out and look for birds and not worry about recording everything I see. Perhaps there will come a time when I will do just that. To each his own!

[weather]

I list all the time. I found a neat little birding program for my palm pilot. I can name my list and the date. I start to write in the name of the bird and after about 3 letters, the computer starts to give you suggestions. Then you look at the small list of names, pick the right one and in it goes. If it happens to be a species not on any of your lists, including life list. It will ask if you would like to add the species to your life list. All you do is touch "yes", and off it goes to your life list....c'mon. How cool is this?

Anyway, I list because I send my sightings to Cornell Ornithology lab, where they say they use it to track trends of bird migration, breeding, etc. I like to think I'm a small part of that. I also like to go back and remember when and where I was on that day. I can also know what to expect at a certain location on a certain day.

Mike

[Edward woodwood]

Hi Birdman

when i started twitching/birding i listed. It encouraged me to get to grips with rarer (but not mega rare) stuff and learn id basics. After a while as i stopped adding stuff (about 350-380 mark) i got a bit bored and realised to add stuff entailed waiting for phone calls and driving long distances at weekends. I started reading and sketching more. As i have travelled overseas more my uk list has meant less and less to me and i dont know if its nearer 400 or 450. if i were to list all the birds i'd seen in the world (a trip to Peru can add 600!) it would mean taxonomic headaches and more time at a computer than reading, painting or watching birds etc......I know if i've seen a bird in the world somewhere or not but have no idea how many....and i like it like that!

[Dave B Smith]

I've jotted notes in the page borders of my field guides for years until last year when I gathered up all my old notes and did a proper list. For me, it has meant more discipline in my observations, and yes, a small thrill with a new "tick". It also gives me some motivation to get out and bird more. This year I've been getting out birding more than ever and part of the reason is I'm trying for my biggest year list. Anyway, it takes very little time for me (a days birding will typically have 40 to 60 species in just one or two locations and this takes all of 15 minutes to input) and does add to my enjoyment.

I just got back this evening from a weekend out in the boonies. Only 38 birds and not one life or year tick, but I had a great time! Even though I enjoy listing, it isn't just about the numbers.

[Nightranger]

I think all birdwatchers are listers to a degree even if we do not keep active lists in a physical form, we are certainly aware of what we have seen and what we have not. The real question is whether a lister is someone who actively chases new species or ticks or simply someone who notes new species as they see them. I started off as an avid lister at uni but never had the money to chase rarities across the country. However, I sometimes go out on local twitches but not to the extent of panicking if I can't make it (e.g., the Temminck's stint at Broom). The problem with listing as a pastime is that once the common species have been obtained, everything else is going to require an effort. I have not yet passed the 250 mark but that was conscious decision because I realised that getting new species was becoming harder. I only picked up nightjar a little over a week ago and there lies the rub. A nightjar or green woodpecker has the same value as a tick as does a double-crested cormorant (same as on a bird race). OK, I have nothing that is easy left to get (except perhaps woodlark or common crossbill) but plenty of local specialities like stone curlew and crested tit. I agree that listing improves a birdwatcher but the competitive edge is probably a little daunting to some people. The biggest misconception though is that you cannot be a good birder until you reach a certain figure and we must get away from that idea. It has to be about enjoyment at the end of the day and it is important that we all find our own level without derision (we get enough of that in the Press) whether it is blue tits in the garden or red-eyed vireo on Scilly.

[Steve Gross]

I'm a confirmed lister, and though I will admit to a certain amount of vanity when it comes to certain of my lists, I still find the process useful and motivating.

Listing helps me frame my birding year and encourages me to go to out of the way corners of Texas (a state with a bird list that will soon reach 625 species) and the US.

I've never been much of a casual sight-seer, and birding a new region of the state or country helps me to immerse myself. I recently participated in a Big Day in Idaho, and though I've been to that state many times, I learned a lot about types of habitats, how they relate to elevation changes, etc. that I would not have noticed in such a dramatic way. I'm a better birder for having had the experience.

I'm proud of the way I've added to my list, in that I've done most of the leg work and research myself, rather than relying on trip leaders to point birds out to me. I've volunteered to conduct bird surveys in order to add to my list, etc. In this way, I've helped to add to what is known about bird populations and distribution.

Listing can certainly become an end in itself, but I prefer to look at the new levels of understanding I've gained through the endeavor.

Birding only to have a big list is an empty enterprise; immersing yourself in the variety of habitats, behaviors, and seasonality of birds in order to better understand them, with a bigger list being one result, to me, is worth the effort.

Steve in Houston

[Rhion]

Originally Posted by Tim Allwood

Hi Birdman

......I know if i've seen a bird in the world somewhere or not but have no idea how many....and i like it like that!

I used to think that, but I've recently found I no longer remember whether I have seen some species or not, particularly with so many name changes in some parts of the world. Still it probably means I can get a "lifer" for the second time round with some of them.

[Edward woodwood]

very true Rhion - and if u can't remember having seen one before you definitely need to look at one again i suppose!

I do take a lot of fieldnotes and i keep triplists and i do write up notes too, just don't have a total number.

[Dave B Smith]

I recently came back from a trip to the mountains of Chiapas and thought I had 18 lifers. Well, after about 10 minutes putting my trip list into my database, I found that I had previously seen three of the birds 10 years ago in Costa Rica. I obviously needed to look at those three again!

[Edward woodwood]

How was Chiapas Dave?....and what was the pick of the lifers?

is it easy to travel there again?

[pauco]

I do keep 2 lists. 1 Garden- 1 local patch, and on both of these i keep recorded birds seen, weather conditions, and time of day. I do think somtimes we can get a bit lost in all of the list keeping, and forget what birding is all about, ie. oh look he's got a list of 200 i need to keep up why? i think everybody finds thier own level, and what suits them. But good luck to those that want to chase up and down the country for that extra tick, each to his-her own. Thats what makes our hobby so interesting, everybody has thier own way of enjoying it.
bert.

[Dave B Smith]

Tim,
Tough question on favorite of the new birds. I really liked the Orange-billed Nightingale Thrush, the Rufous-browed Peppershrike, the Lesser Roadrunner and the Black-headed Siskin.

The three that my list reminded me I had already seen were Rufous-collared Sparrow, Band-tailed Pigeon, and Yellow Grosbeak. Can't believe I didn't remember that one! (see how important a list becomes as you get older )

I have a Chiapas Trip Report that gives all the details and pictures of the Sumidero Canyon. This is a wonderful destination for birding. Folks were friendly, service good, hotels good, and birds were spectacular!

Getting to Chiapas is getting easier. There is a new route from Villahermosa that takes about 3 hours off the trip by road or you can fly into Tuxtla-Gutierrez. Check out my report.