[brownpelican1]

Originally Posted by NDhunter

Tom:

Too bad for you, it sounds like this was not a "white room" manufacturing
plant, with some quality control, of atmosphere, and little regard for much.

It sounds more like a Chinese barber shop, where anything goes.

"Just Good Enough".

Is that the binocular, that you want to take on a day long birding trip ?.

Jerry

My wife and I spent the day at the Jersey Shore yesterday and we took along the Dakota Elite 7x28 and the Pro Optic 8x42 as our only optics. We had a great time observing the terns, especially a Royal Tern that entertained us for at least an hour. We were passing the two glasses back and forth, commenting on the Royal's particular field marks and we felt that these two "Chinese barber shop" bins were more then "Just Good Enough". For the two of us these bins were plenty for "a day long birding trip".
I called Wolf Camera regarding my DOA 8x32 Dakota Elite's and they are sending a replacement pair. Very nice folks to deal with.
Tom

[FrankD]

Originally Posted by brownpelican1

My wife and I spent the day at the Jersey Shore yesterday and we took along the Dakota Elite 7x28 and the Pro Optic 8x42 as our only optics. We had a great time observing the terns, especially a Royal Tern that entertained us for at least an hour. We were passing the two glasses back and forth, commenting on the Royal's particular field marks and we felt that these two "Chinese barber shop" bins were more then "Just Good Enough". For the two of us these bins were plenty for "a day long birding trip".
I called Wolf Camera regarding my DOA 8x32 Dakota Elite's and they are sending a replacement pair. Very nice folks to deal with.
Tom

Glad to hear that you had a good time at the beach Tom. Just out of curiousity, where did you go? We are taking the kids to Sandy Hook one day next week. :-)

I will take the same two bins (my kids love the 7x28 as does the significant other because of its size and handling) along with the 8x32. Shorebirds aren't my cup of tea when it comes to birding but it is fun to see such a variety in one area.

[brownpelican1]

Originally Posted by FrankD

Glad to hear that you had a good time at the beach Tom. Just out of curiousity, where did you go? We are taking the kids to Sandy Hook one day next week. :-)

I will take the same two bins (my kids love the 7x28 as does the significant other because of its size and handling) along with the 8x32. Shorebirds aren't my cup of tea when it comes to birding but it is fun to see such a variety in one area.

Frank,
We spent the day at Island Beach State Park.
Tom

[henry link]

Tom,

I agree that Jerry is coming down a little too hard on some dirt cheap binoculars. My expectations before I saw them were also quite low. I wouldn't have bothered if they hadn't been available in a store 10 minutes from my house. Well, my expectations were confounded. When I applied the very same tests I use for alpha binoculars the 8x32 held up pretty well. It's an optically decent binocular I could easily use in a pinch and not worry about missing much. Obviously this opinion only applies to samples that are not defective. How long it will last I have no idea.

Henry

[mooreorless]

Tom was that the real Jersey Shore or this one?:)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jersey_Shore,_Pennsylvania

Sorry I couldn't help myself.

Originally Posted by brownpelican1

My wife and I spent the day at the Jersey Shore yesterday and we took along the Dakota Elite 7x28 and the Pro Optic 8x42 as our only optics. We had a great time observing the terns, especially a Royal Tern that entertained us for at least an hour. We were passing the two glasses back and forth, commenting on the Royal's particular field marks and we felt that these two "Chinese barber shop" bins were more then "Just Good Enough". For the two of us these bins were plenty for "a day long birding trip".
I called Wolf Camera regarding my DOA 8x32 Dakota Elite's and they are sending a replacement pair. Very nice folks to deal with.
Tom

[brownpelican1]

Originally Posted by mooreorless

Tom was that the real Jersey Shore or this one?:)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jersey_Shore,_Pennsylvania

Sorry I couldn't help myself.

Steve,
Here's a few pix of the Jersey Shore we were at. Notice the many strange birds!
http://www.google.com/search?q=jerse...w=1440&bih=737

[Bob A (SD)]

Ewwwwww :( This could be the subject of a WHOLE new thread. Strange birds indeed! Might need to have the CDC check for any avarian borne illnesses.

[lilcrazy2]

Originally Posted by Kammerdiner

Good old cheap fun, except planet Earth is taking a terminal beating for it.

Have "fun" with that,

Mark

Guess I don't fully understand your point on how these 7x28's are giving a terminal beating to planet earth??? Zooooom. Would you care to elaborate?

Tom

[Kammerdiner]

Originally Posted by lilcrazy2

Guess I don't fully understand your point on how these 7x28's are giving a terminal beating to planet earth??? Zooooom. Would you care to elaborate?

Tom

It's obviously not just the Dakotas; it's all the scattershot junk the Chinese (and others) produce without regard to energy, the environment, labor--in short, the future. Or in this case, evidentally, even without regard for the quality of the end result. What happens to all those crud Dakota units? Landfill I guess. I sure as heck don't want them. Neither does Wolf. Neither does the manufacturer.

It's also about us consumers (myself included, though I've been working on it) who get caught up in buying all this junk without regard for the future. We have to remember that the cost of almost everything is, in fact, paid by the planet.

Unfortunately, the "global economy" is rapidly becoming a "global bonfire." I'm just tired of squirting lighter fluid on it.

Sorry to elaborate. Carry on.

Mark

[ceasar]

How many kids do you have Mark?

I have two; still in college. I worry about prospects for them but I'm not nearly as gloomy about those prospects as you are.

Bob

[Kammerdiner]

Originally Posted by ceasar

How many kids do you have Mark?

I have two; still in college. I worry about prospects for them but I'm not nearly as gloomy about those prospects as you are.

Bob

Yeah, I'm a lifelong skeptic and sometime pessimist. I'm working on it.

I have one kid, on his own and doing well. He's also more of an optimist so we balance out.

Mark

[mooreorless]

Mark you and Brock would get along ok in person. :) No kidding.

[brocknroller]

Originally Posted by mooreorless

Mark you and Brock would get along ok in person. :) No kidding.

I have absolutely no idea why you would say that.


ECOMAN

[mooreorless]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skepticism

Same side politically, as are a lot more people on here

[Highway Dog]

After receiving the 7x28, I have tested it briefly. I find it functions very nicely. It is small, of course. It takes a conscious effort to line up the binoculars to my eyes. The eye relief is very good, about 3/4 of an inch. It is easy to let the my eyes to move out of the viewing area. --Then the view goes dark.

The view is good. I have not looked for the degree of chromatic aberration. The good focus area is large in the view. The entire view is good, does not seem excessively narrow to me. Just now I could not find a webpage that gives the specifications on this binoculars.

The only thing I personally complain about is that the field stop is not in good focus. I see the edge of view in a fuzzy black border. When I close one eye, I see the edge slightly better focus, but not sharp. I realize that with both eyes open, the view from both eyes is added so that the fuzzy edge is more evident.

The close focus is about 9-10 feet, with a strong two field of views that only overlap in the center 1/3rd or even 1/4th section.

To conclude, I find it good, as good as what you guys has reported.
There is such good marketing descriptors on the ebay ad and other places, that it better than it should be. --So far I do not find any false advertising from my informal impressions.

Rob.

[henry link]

I noticed the fuzzy field stop in the 7x28. There are a few possible explanations for that.

There may be no proper field stop at all.

The stop may be installed in the wrong place so that it doesn't coincide with the focal plane of the eyepiece.

There may be a properly positioned field stop, but some aperture just ahead of it, like the back of the prism housing, is undersized so that it becomes the de-facto field stop, out of focus because it's not in the right place.

The eyepiece focal plane may fall inside the prism where a stop can't be placed.

[FrankD]

Glad to hear that you are happy with the 7x28 Rob. As I mentioned previously, I have a hard time finding anything wrong with it for the price.

Henry,

Thank you for providing that info. I sincerely wish I had a more thorough understanding of binocular design. I might be able to get a better grasp of some of the issues I find on any given model if I understood a tenth of what you do.

On another note, I did order one of the Pentax 8x40 PCF WP II porros from Wolfe's camera. They have had several of them listed on Ebay. It came a few days ago. Almost immediately upon using it I noticed a lack of sharpness and/or a difficulty in focusing to a sharp image. There appears to be some type of optical defect in one of the barrels. Interestingly enough it only seems to be a small area of the image. Sadly though it is close to the center of the field of view. I contacted the retailer and asked about an exchange. Since I paid a little over $60 I just decided to order two more of the 8x32 Dakota Elites instead. They graciously agreed. I find that I use the little 8x32 much more than I expected. Its exceptionally compact size coupled with its solid optical performance make it very good as a go anywhere, do almost anything type of binocular. No, I don't plan on taking it hawkwatching tomorrow (I prefer a larger exit pupil and objective diameter for that particular activity) but I have been using it for almost anything else.

[FrankD]

I wanted to add some comments to this thread as I just did a bit of a comparison between the 8x32 Elite and the newly acquired 8x28 Bushnell Excursion. I just purchased the Excursions from Ebay for the very reasonable price of $69.99 shipped. Link to the current auction for these is on the Binocular Bargains thread.

I chose to compare these two models because of their similarity in magnification but more importantly because of their similarity in physical size. Yes, the Elites weigh a couple of ounces more but other than that the two are extremely similar in length and width. The Elites are actually an eighth of an inch shorter. Build quality (diopter function, central hinge tension, eyecup function, focusing speed and control) are similar and very good in my opinion.

Optically they are also very similar. The Excursions actually have slightly less field curvature but neither is excessive in my opinion. The sweet spot on both is very good with the nod going to the Excursions by a small amount. Apparent sharpness and apparent brightness favor the Elites as one would expect with the larger diameter objective. Apparent sharpness is a bit closer between the two models in comparison to the apparent brightness. Both are more alike than not in these two areas. The Elite displays a slightly more neutral color representation with the Excursions appearing slightly warm in comparison.

I am definitely satisfied with these two binoculars functioning as "compacts" in comparison the full-size 42 mm roofs in my selection.

[FrankD]

Just as a note for this thread. It would seem the Dakota Elite 8x32s are the same bin as the Promaster Infinity Elite 8x32s. Pictures are identical and the specs all match up. Several discussions on birdforum have focused on the Promaster 8x32s in the past. Their weak point, as well as the Dakotas, seems to be handling of stray light because of a lack of sufficient internal baffling. Everything else seems positive from what I read.

[qotsarock]

Thanks for FrankD for suggesting these binos. I bought a pair and have been very happy with them so far. They made a nice pair for travel. I just took them to Iceland and Europe. No worries about losing them or exposing them to wear.

[FowlFan]

I am tempted to get a pair of the 7x28 as I see they are still available. I can't decide if the size would be enough smaller than my 8x32 Bushnell Legend to make them worth it though. Anyone have a picture of these next to an 8x32 for size comparison? Also wondering if anyone has compared these to something like the 8x28 Vortex Fury? Maybe for the price they are worth a gamble.

[FrankD]

Fowlfan,

I have both the 8x32 and the 7x28 Elite as well as the 8x28 Bushnell Excursion. I think I posted a picture of a size comparison between the Excursion and the 8x32 Elite in either this thread or the Binocular Bargains thread. The 8x32 Elite is actually notably shorter than the 7x28 model and actually the 8x28 Excursion as well. It is a bit fatter though than either model but fits my hands exceptionally well. If you are looking for the most compact then the 8x32 is the way to go. I know they are not currently available from Ritz/Wolf camera but they should be getting another shipment in soon. The 7x28 is lighter but the image quality is not quite as good as the 8x32. The most notable differences are the edge performance and the brightness levels. Both favor the 8x32.

On the other hand, if image quality is your first priority, followed by price and size then I would suggest the 8x28 Excursions over the 7x28 Elites. Out of any of the sub-32 inch binoculars I have tried they offer the best price/performance ratio. The image is exceptionally wide for a "compact" binocular at over 400 feet plus the eye relief is more than adequate. The size of the sweet spot and the overall comfort level of the image is exceptionally high for a binocular of this size and this price point. It was actually quite surprising the first time I placed these bins up to my eyes.

Probably the only "negative" they have from an optical standpoint is their color bias. The image does appear a bit "red/purple" in comparison to some of the other bins I own. This is only noticeable in direct comparison to these other bins and not really something that I notice when using them solely.

The least expensive price I have seen for the Excursions is $70 via the usual auction website. The gentleman that sells them lives in Canada so expect about a 1.5-2 week wait time once they have shipped.

Hope this helps.

[FowlFan]

Well for the price the 7x28 were just too tempting so... I pulled the trigger... hopefully I will get a decent pair. I saw someone just ahead of me purchased 7 pairs.

[FrankD]

I look forward to hearing your comments once you receive them. For $20 plus shipping they are hard to say no to.