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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 17:41   #26
Simon Taylor
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Duly signed, but the annoying thing is that my husband can't register his vote as he has no email address.
It sounds as though they go by email addresses rather than individual signatures!
I'll distribute it to our Friends of Red Kites and ask our chairman if we can put a link on our website!!
He could set one up through Hotmail or similar then ignore the account exists

Just a suggestion

Hmm, now there's a thought - i could set up 100,000 e-mail addresses, job done.......
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 17:43   #27
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I've signed it. Also put it on Twitter and Facebook so it should get more people signing.
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 17:46   #28
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I've signed it. Also put it on Twitter and Facebook so it should get more people signing.
I've resisted opening a facebook account to date as i hate the idea however i can see advantages where this sort of thing is concerned.

Maybe i'll re-think and open one up
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 17:49   #29
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I've resisted opening a facebook account to date as i hate the idea however i can see advantages where this sort of thing is concerned.

Maybe i'll re-think and open one up
I haven't got a facebook account either. It's the other half's Facebook account it's gone on
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 17:52   #30
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It's true the facebook and twitter response has been amazing, I hope its going to snowball but I guess nothing in life that matters is so easy so any ideas to further the cause will be greatly received.
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 18:08   #31
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Unhappy

Using the Feedback I have sent a note about this - I find it frequently and feel it is unfair.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Taylor View Post
He could set one up through Hotmail or similar then ignore the account exists

Just a suggestion

Hmm, now there's a thought - i could set up 100,000 e-mail addresses, job done.......
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 18:16   #32
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There is already a concept of “Vicarious Liability” in English common law, what is needed is for a test case to be brought in respect to raptor persecution and for that case to reach such a level where precedents can be set. The police wildlife crime units are not going to do that, they just want an easy prosecution of the junior gamekeeper that actually did the act. Some wildlife organisation needs to bring such as case and have the will and resources to follow it up the appeals chain.
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 18:28   #33
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I've resisted opening a facebook account to date as i hate the idea however i can see advantages where this sort of thing is concerned.

Maybe i'll re-think and open one up
it's already on face book, that is actually where chrissy, the originator, first publicised it, through her owl sanctuary page. though some genious managed to get chris packham to re tweet it on twitter, which has no doubt helped in the publicity department, it's definitely worth anyone who already has a facebook or twitter account sharing it on their page.

i have been posting it daily on the rspb love nature facebook page, and today i saw it get posted by about 4 other people also, all we can do is to keep pushing it, until we achieve the target.
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 18:41   #34
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it's already on face book, that is actually where chrissy, the originator, first publicised it, through her owl sanctuary page. though some genious managed to get chris packham to re tweet it on twitter, which has no doubt helped in the publicity department, it's definitely worth anyone who already has a facebook or twitter account sharing it on their page.

i have been posting it daily on the rspb love nature facebook page, and today i saw it get posted by about 4 other people also, all we can do is to keep pushing it, until we achieve the target.
I wouldn't claim to be a genius, but it was nice of Chris to give it a push, 2000 a week is going to be no easy feat but the support being shown in fantastic.
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 18:50   #35
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I wouldn't claim to be a genius, but it was nice of Chris to give it a push, 2000 a week is going to be no easy feat but the support being shown in fantastic.
i was actually about to do the same thing with chris, when i saw that it had already been done.

i knew that once he saw it chris would give it a push from the comments he has made before, he's a firm believer that vicarious liability laws are essential in england if persecution is to be stopped
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 19:07   #36
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sorted...........its on facebook now too...........

Me too.
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Old Tuesday 22nd November 2011, 23:10   #37
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This is a Civil Tort isn't it? Who is the damaged party and who recovers the damages?

Aren't there Criminal Laws in Great Britain that address these actions?

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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 06:38   #38
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No, it is not a tort, it is a criminal offence (or range of offences), for which currently the "servant" is prosecuted without causing any real deterrence to the relevant "master" (occupier of the land). As Mono said above, the concept of vicarious liability does exist in English law, but it is very hard to prove to judges' satisfaction. I am not sure this e-petition has its wording right, but the intention is clear enough.
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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 07:40   #39
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Not sure i agree with this precedent of vicarious liability.Easy to get round for a landowner,does a lot of damage to unions and protest groups and suchlike.
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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 07:55   #40
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Not sure i agree with this precedent of vicarious liability.Easy to get round for a landowner,does a lot of damage to unions and protest groups and suchlike.
Interesting....how is it easy, ie; what scenario could make it easy for a landowner to get around things if accused under vicarious liability?
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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 08:00   #41
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Interesting....how is it easy, ie; what scenario could make it easy for a landowner to get around things if accused under vicarious liability?
He/she'd make his employees self employed.
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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 08:25   #42
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I don't want this thread to become a debate as it will spoilt it but I will share my thoughts on the subject.

It's not an ideal solution (for a start you have to catch someone and prove them guilty of the crime which is far from easy) but it might be a step in the right direction, further steps could possibly be needed but in myl opinion there needs to be some responsibility for landowners/agents etc when these type of crimes are committed, both to discourage this type of crime but equally it would offer some protection to their employees.

I also think that gaining support for these issues helps send the message to those that are acting illegally, that their continued actions are actually likely to harm them in the long run
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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 08:33   #43
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I've signed.

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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 13:13   #44
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Nick knowles has re-tweeted, I know him through things an as he has nearly 30,000 followers maybe some might sign!

Keep spreading the word!
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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 13:18   #45
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Keep spreading the word!
Excellent, thanks and to use your quote. Keep spreading the word
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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 15:04   #46
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No, it is not a tort, it is a criminal offence (or range of offences), for which currently the "servant" is prosecuted without causing any real deterrence to the relevant "master" (occupier of the land). As Mono said above, the concept of vicarious liability does exist in English law, but it is very hard to prove to judges' satisfaction. I am not sure this e-petition has its wording right, but the intention is clear enough.

Sorry. I was asking about the concept of "Vicarious Liability." I know that the offenses are criminal. I was wondering why vicarious liability was needed if the land owners could be prosecuted as conspirators or as accessories before or after the fact?

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Old Wednesday 23rd November 2011, 15:10   #47
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I know the OP doesn't want a debate and I fully understand the urgent need for extra protection for supposedly protected animals but this is a petition calling for the introduction of a legal concept that already exists in English Law.

When it reaches its 100,000, the relevant committee is going to simply say this is calling for something that we have already... next please...

Sorry to seem to be putting a downer on things.
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Old Thursday 24th November 2011, 13:03   #48
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Signed.
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Old Thursday 24th November 2011, 20:57   #49
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Great job, I have signed and passed petition on to the local raptor study group
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Old Friday 25th November 2011, 14:46   #50
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Duly signed, but the annoying thing is that my husband can't register his vote as he has no email address.
It sounds as though they go by email addresses rather than individual signatures!
I'll distribute it to our Friends of Red Kites and ask our chairman if we can put a link on our website!!
You can set up more than 1 e-mail address with Virgin Media.
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