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Old Sunday 22nd April 2012, 00:34   #1
looksharp65
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Zeiss 7x42 BGAT*P* or Zen-Ray ED3 7x43?

Guess the title says it all.
Suppose I can get them at a similar price. The Zeiss is used and the seller claims it's about 10 years old. The Zen-Ray is new.

Reviewers have compared the FL to the BGAT*P* and the FL to the Zen-Ray.
Let's assume the 7x42 FL is the top 7x42 ever made, but these two models are not at all far behind.
I do know that with the older Zeiss I give up close focus, and to some extent waterproofing.

But what about the view? I realize the old Zeiss may have some color bias, but I expect it to be a lot more neutral than my 10x40 BGAT which is decidedly warm.
What about other considerations?

//L
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Old Sunday 22nd April 2012, 05:16   #2
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Similar price!!! The B/GA.... usually runs $1,000 or more. Stop thinking about it and buy it! Provided, of course, it's in VG condition. If you would rather have the ZR, let me know if the seller is interested in trading the Zeiss for some premium porros.

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Old Sunday 22nd April 2012, 07:24   #3
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Here, I'm not after value or resale value, I'm after an awesome 7x42 which would probably be my last optics purchase (yes I know you all ROFL ).

This simply means: Which is the better bin?


Edit: The seller removed the ad so I suppose it's sold. Although a 7x42 BGAT*P would have been a nice addition to my collection, it was frankly the price that attracted me the most.
And should I have $1000 to spend on another one, I'd probably rather choose a Meostar 7x42.
The Zen-Ray ED3, however, should provide all and anything I'd ever need. My question still remains: Which of them is the optically better bin?


//L
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Old Sunday 22nd April 2012, 20:32   #4
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LS,

Although I own a 7x42 BGAT*P in great condition, and it's optics are very impressive, the advent of wide-field, long eye-relief, HD designs at reasonably low-cost no longer makes it the ultimate glass.

In my case, leaving the "reasonably low-cost" aspect aside, I found the 8x42 SLC HD to be my final optic. The reason I can say this with confidence is that I had no problem packing most of the others away for sale. The 7x42 BGAT*P was one of the few exceptions because it's so darned nice.

So, I hope you find your personal grail.
Ed
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Old Sunday 22nd April 2012, 22:20   #5
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I know which one I'd have, but the choice wouldn't be about "which is the better view?" (whatever that means). It would be all about which one round my neck makes ME feel good (never mind what anyone else thinks). A Zeiss 7x42 BGAT*P simply is the Holy Grail. Its quality of construction and optical prowess are all I desire and probably more than I'll ever need. It's not flashy, it's quietly competent and elegant, and it epitomises Zeiss at its very best. For me, it's the E-type Jaguar of the binocular world, in a class of its own...
P.S. And I wouldn't mind if wearing it made me look like a tank commander!

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Old Sunday 22nd April 2012, 22:34   #6
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LS,

well, that's a dragon's head of a different color. if you're adding to your criteria which bin would last you until you go off to Valhalla, then the Zeiss is the clear winner.

Not that the ED3 isn't a worthy contender, but let's face it, an ED4 is probably already on the drawing boards, and that will likely be better optically than the ED3, which is better than the ED2, which is better than the original ED.

but to be buried with a classic bin as part of your regalia is a noble way for a Norseman to go.

will an 8x bin with ED glass beat the 7x42 in some ways? of course. but if you take newfie's holistic view approach, perhaps not.

i haven't compared the two, so i couldn't give you a blow by blow, but your mention of the 7x42 Meopta suggests you would be happier with a 7x42 roof, as will the lucky dog who beat you to the Zeiss while you were musing about if it were optically better than a Chinese ED bin. :-)

Read Ron's thread on the 12x50 BN. "Optically better" (new coatings and more advanced glass almost always improve the view), but "optically satisfying" is just as important to consider when you make a lifetime purchase, because whatever you chose is probably going to be beat by next year's model.

looking through the all knowing eye of eternity requires a longer focus (and in the case of the Zeiss B/GA, longer close focus :-) than looking at the latest fashion statements from Asia and Europe.

speaking of which, also consider the 7x42 EDG I. They can be had for as low as $1,299 now. if my closet weren't chock full of premium and classic porros, i might jump on one myself.

the focus knob and/or the diopter ring might go kablooie, but Nikon will replace it with an EII if that happens, and then an EIII when the EII fails and so on. Same with ZR.

Here's a way to make up your mind, rather than wait for the one person who's tried both, whose opinion might not match your anyway.

Think about the various choices before you. Close your eyes. Which bin do you see? Buy that one. As Siggidy Cricket used to say, "let your pre-conscious be your guide".

Hägar
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Old Sunday 22nd April 2012, 23:59   #7
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The 7x42 BGAT*P may represent some kind of peak in the history of binocular's development, but that doesn't imply that evolution has ceased.
With regard to ease of view, field cachet and mechanical durability, it's probably occupying the throne inside the Binocular's Hall of Fame.

But let's face hard facts.
Two totally separate (though not necessarily contrarious) aspects of development were added to the delicious Zeiss meal, namely a more cost-effective production method and the making of a fully modern, premium roof prism binocular. The result was of course the Victory 7x42 FL.
Although the lateral astigmatism of the FL has been questioned, I'm under the impression nobody denies it is a superior product, though not necessarily of greater value than the Dialyt.

James, I fully understand your analogy with the Jaguar E-type. The Dialyt does indeed correspond to the slightly dated luxury item for those who prefer style rather than perfection.
On the other hand, carrying one of these can wrongfully suggest the owner is an infinitely experienced birding expert.
Newer binoculars could mirror how much money the owner is prepared to spend on his hobby, and some confuse this with how devoted he or she is to their hobby.
But a moderately skilled, but prosperous birder would without hesitation be more inclined to choose alpha equipment. Thus, the expense that others can watch does not bear a linear correlation to the degree of devotion.
Factors like private economy/ability to raise funds come into play.

While speaking about cars, I remember my astonishment when stepping into my uncle's Mercedes and closing the door in 1975. The sound was so different from anything I had heard before, something like a silent "Whoopp" compared to the Volvos, Opels, Saabs and Volkswagens of those days that made a complex, sharp and loud metallic noise followed by the ringing vibrations of the side glass window. Those days, Toyota and Datsun were considered no more than garbage. Recently, when I stepped into a small Korean car of the Kia brand and closed the door I recognized that Mercedes sound from 35 years earlier.
The Kia is faster, has better acceleration, consumes only 40% of the fuel and has loads of built-in security like multiple airbags and so on.

When deciding upon which binocular is the better, I wouldn't be too surprised if it's the Zen-Ray. Provided the quality control is fine I'm sure the view is more than satisfying, and very close to binoculars of double the price or more. Considering that I'm after a tool that could be replaced if knocked and not an item to boast with, I guess I prefer the Zen-Ray.
That said, if the opportunity came up again, I'd buy the Dialyt at $450.
Not at $1000 - no way.


//L
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Old Monday 23rd April 2012, 00:06   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brocknroller View Post
but to be buried with a classic bin as part of your regalia is a noble way for a Norseman to go.
Hmm, guess I'll have to get myself a pair of night vision binoculars. And a set of spare batteries
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