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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 17:14   #51
Troubador
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Originally Posted by henry link View Post
Thought I remembered seeing an earlier effort at a binoviewer/spotting scope. A little Googling turned up this from 2008.

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...potting-scope/
Nice find Henry, thanks for posting

Lee
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 17:34   #52
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Help me out here Henry. I remember reading a bit about binoviewers some years ago but whatever I gained from those readings is now lost. I know there are a few binoviewers available in the astronomy market. Why again won't they work on some spotting scopes? I am sure for many it is a connection issue but for the others I seem to remember something about not being able to reach infinity focus or something similar?
Reaching infinity focus is the main problem. The light path through the binoviewer prisms adds substantial back focus. See the manual for the Baader Maxbright binoviewer here:

http://www.baader-planetarium.com/en...lar_viewer.pdf

At best a spotter might be able to handle 20mm of back focus. Even with the 2.6x Glasspath Compensator the Baader adds 44mm of back focus

Last edited by henry link : Monday 6th March 2017 at 17:37.
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 17:42   #53
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Henry beat me to it Frank.

We saw a prototype Long Perng binoviewer at Photokina that they claimed adds no back focus but we're still waiting on a sample to test it with the Vixen scopes that we sell.

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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 18:03   #54
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Thank you both.

On a related note, I was just sent the following photos which were provided by Swarovski Optik as part of a press pack sent out after the launch event. Copyright Swarovski Optik.
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 18:08   #55
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Originally Posted by henry link View Post
Thought I remembered seeing an earlier effort at a binoviewer/spotting scope. A little Googling turned up this from 2008.

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...potting-scope/
Yep in UK Monk Optics had 'em from 2003 or maybe even earlier :
http://www.birdforum.net/showpost.ph...7&postcount=54
Also Birdnet. Seems that implementation just didn't catch on. I expect for the price, size, weight etc an ED glass scope appealed to more folk.
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 18:09   #56
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Hi Arran,

The primeur, mmmm...

This made me ask Swarovski on the IWA if this was correct since the offical Primeur is in England.
Don't know if you (still) work for Sights of Nature, but reality learned me that the Belgium Swarovski rep is showing all the Swarovski dealers in Belgium the BTX and on the 25th of March it will be shown to the shop in Brugge, so you may call this the primeur on BF for the Kite store in Brugge

Seen and tested the BTX on the IWA yesterday and I can only confirm what the posted links from those who were present at the Press launch in Schaffhausen in February are telling us.
It is brilliant, razor sharp from edge to edge and I can't see any light loss.
The extender works great on both the BTX as on the ATX.

Jan
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Sorry to say I have never worked for sights of Nature!!
Nor I have advantage promoting them
I only put on the forum what I hear from different sources

I look forward seeing the BTX though
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 18:09   #57
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Thanks, Frank,

Quite a bit of glass there.

Kimmo
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 18:12   #58
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Hi Gunther

Will Swarovski make a stay-on case available for this?

Lee
Hi Lee

Not confirmed yet I think
I think I have seen one on the net
Grtz
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 18:37   #59
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Transmission is stated for both the ATX and ATS scopes, but not for the BTX.
Any thoughts why? Less than 50%....does not sound good..??

Last edited by Vespobuteo : Monday 6th March 2017 at 18:46.
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 18:42   #60
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Thank you both.

On a related note, I was just sent the following photos which were provided by Swarovski Optik as part of a press pack sent out after the launch event. Copyright Swarovski Optik.
Thanks for posting the photos Frank.

If I'm interpreting the appearance of the prisms correctly the long first prism looks like a 45 Amici roof prism for image erection, followed by the beamsplitter, which diverts half the beam to the left eyepiece through a diagonal prism and a simple glass cube (for keeping the glasspath equal between right and left). The right side appears to be two diagonal prisms with the second one movable in a lateral direction to change IPD.

The most interesting thing to me is the apparent use of an Amici prism. If that's what it is (I don't know what else could be that shape) this is the first time I've seen one used in a spotting scope.

Henry
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 19:20   #61
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Jan
Sorry to say I have never worked for sights of Nature!!
Nor I have advantage promoting them
I only put on the forum what I hear from different sources

I look forward seeing the BTX though
The Dutch Swarovski rep is planned for visiting our shop coming Thursday but I can't call that a primeur

The way you posted it like you did made it look otherwise.

@Henry
Spot on!
At least that's what I've understood of what I've been told yesterday but it would take me three pages to decribe what you just did in one sentence

Jan

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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 08:22   #62
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Jan

What I meant by primeur is that for the first time , normal birdwatchers can admire the BTX at the shop of sights of nature in the Benelux
When the sales rep from Swarovski comes, will Dutch birdwatchers be able to see the BTX and test them ?
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 10:35   #63
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Lee, Yes a stay-on case will be available. It will run U.S. $199 for the eyepiece.
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 14:59   #64
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Jan

What I meant by primeur is that for the first time , normal birdwatchers can admire the BTX at the shop of sights of nature in the Benelux
When the sales rep from Swarovski comes, will Dutch birdwatchers be able to see the BTX and test them ?
If they would stumble in at the same time he does, they could. If they would stumble in at any other store the rep visits, they could have the same experience.
The official launch/deliverydate is first week of May 2017


Jan
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 18:12   #65
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Lee, Yes a stay-on case will be available. It will run U.S. $199 for the eyepiece.
Thanks PP

Lee
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 18:12   #66
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Hi Lee

Not confirmed yet I think
I think I have seen one on the net
Grtz
Thanks

Lee
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 21:07   #67
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Hi Gunther

Will Swarovski make a stay-on case available for this?

Lee
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 21:55   #68
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First mention of a (apparent/possible) 3D effect...

"But it’s far more than simply a lack of squinting at play here, because that second eye, until now an obstacle to the scoping experience, becomes an active participant. So right off the bat, the image appears more three dimensional. Moreover, you’re at some level doubling your optical processing power, hitching two horses to your cart instead of just one. The resulting difference is dramatic, for me unexpectedly so."

http://blog.aba.org/2017/03/new-and-...xperience.html

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Old Wednesday 8th March 2017, 13:27   #69
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First mention of a (apparent/possible) 3D effect...

"But its far more than simply a lack of squinting at play here, because that second eye, until now an obstacle to the scoping experience, becomes an active participant. So right off the bat, the image appears more three dimensional."


Lee
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Old Wednesday 8th March 2017, 18:52   #70
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If this takes off I wonder whether Kowa etc will follow suit, or if we'll see lower-end models incorporating the feature?
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Old Wednesday 8th March 2017, 21:40   #71
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If this takes off I wonder whether Kowa etc will follow suit, or if we'll see lower-end models incorporating the feature?
A binoviewer on the 883 would be an even uglier beast than the BTX.
But it will be interesting to see what competition will do.
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Old Wednesday 8th March 2017, 23:31   #72
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If this takes off I wonder whether Kowa etc will follow suit, or if we'll see lower-end models incorporating the feature?
The device is too expensive for the mass market.
However, Swaro will be able to decide whether to offer such devices more broadly based on real market data. Presumably Swaro will have enough design patents to make the going challenging for would be competitive offerings.
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Old Thursday 9th March 2017, 02:23   #73
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I suspect the reason Swaro have been able to do this is because of their ATX design with separate objective and separate prism housing.

It would be a big step for a manufacturer to replicate on more traditional scopes where you're only changing out the eyepiece rather than prism housing as well....

First step for competitor would likely be replicating Swaro's *TX design concept in general and breaking the scope in half with a separate objective barrel and a separate prism/eyepiece housing..

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Old Thursday 9th March 2017, 03:31   #74
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I suspect the reason Swaro have been able to do this is because of their ATX design with separate objective and separate prism housing.

It would be a big step for a manufacturer to replicate on more traditional scopes where you're only changing out the eyepiece rather than prism housing as well....

First step for competitor would likely be replicating Swaro's *TX design concept in general and breaking the scope in half with a separate objective barrel and a separate prism/eyepiece housing..

cheers
Jeelan

Spot on, Swaro's modular design is a huge plus here.
Still, there are surely alternative approaches. At the extreme, replace the eye pieces with a cell phone screen. That would allow easy viewing, fully adequate resolution and improved brightness, at lower cost. Only downside is the scope becomes another gadget that eats batteries.
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Old Thursday 9th March 2017, 05:13   #75
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Just as a point of interest - regarding the eyestrain that is experienced when using a scope for extended periods. Surely this is largely down to the effort of keeping the other eye closed rather than strain on the eye in use? Many years ago I had to wear an eye patch for several days after an injury - whilst not an experience I would like to repeat I don't remember that my "good" eye got tired.

I've used an eyepatch while seawatching and apart from the constant stream of pirate gags from my mates found that it largely eliminated discomfort.

Obviously using both eyes is more natural and there's no 3D effect using an eye patch, but an eyepatch that allows the covered eye to remain fully open should eliminate most (if not all) of the eyestrain? Not to mention the huge strain on the wallet

Ahaar

Phil

Last edited by Torchepot : Thursday 9th March 2017 at 05:18.
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