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Old Sunday 5th March 2017, 12:56   #1
adhoc
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Victory pocket models updated!

The two Zeiss Victory pocket models, in 8x and 10x, have been updated.

The 8x is also now 25 mm in obj. diam., up from 20 mm. The field of view is a very wide 7.4 deg., up from the already wide 6.8 deg. The weight, though, has gone up a lot, to 290 g from 225 g.

In the 10x model the FOV is widened to 6.0 deg., from 5.5 deg. The weight goes up to 290 g from 250 g.

Eye relief and close focus are improved in both models, and in both are 16.5 mm and 6.2 ft, respectively.

The styling is sleeker, while the off-center single hinge design is retained.

Zeiss's website shows the new models. No new technical descriptions are provided (just a lot of the usual "Be sure not to miss a single bird..." kind of text).

Last edited by adhoc : Sunday 5th March 2017 at 13:01. Reason: Changed "data" to "descriptions".
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Old Sunday 5th March 2017, 13:14   #2
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FOV for the 8x goes from 118m to 130m at 1,000m which is pretty good.

The weight increase comes with bigger objectives and since the FOV is so much bigger presumably a bigger optical train all the way through. Zeiss also say that they have FL lenses which I don't think the old Victory Pockets had so we should expect decent control of CA.

Personally I like the assymetric design as I have never really been comfortable with double hinges.

Lee

Last edited by Troubador : Sunday 5th March 2017 at 17:09.
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Old Sunday 5th March 2017, 15:23   #3
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If they improve them any more they will catch up to their Terra model....
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Old Sunday 5th March 2017, 16:09   #4
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Thanks for the info, adhoc !
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 01:54   #5
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You're welcome--be sure not to miss a single bird! ;-) My excitement however soon disappeared when I realized that 290 g is too heavy for me in a pocket binocular as around 235 g is the limit for an 8x. I like one of very good optical quality, possess a Hawke Sapphire 8x25, and it fits all the criteria, but would like one which is still better, and have been thinking of the just-replaced Victory 8x20 or the Leica Ultravid 8x20. The Hawke is also 25 mm and hence provides a 3.1 mm exit pupil, as against the 2.5 mm of an 8x20, at a vastly lower price than the heavier new Zeiss. I forgot to say that the new Victory 8x is also longer than the old, now just as long as the 10x. I shall be on the prowl for a Victory 8x20 at a vastly lowered price!

Last edited by adhoc : Monday 6th March 2017 at 02:52. Reason: Corrected arithmetic!
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 02:47   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Troubador View Post
...Zeiss also say that they have FL lenses which I don't think the old Victory Pockets had...
Sorry, I missed that, important! [So there is something in the text after all ;-)]
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 06:34   #7
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Tks adhoc!
So let's see - I still think this may be an important update.
Swaro had their last update on the Pocket a few years ago, and Leica's Ultravid 8x20 is the "oldest" of the three (it often used to be the best rated).
The change form 20mm to 25mm is significant in my view - with a 3mm exit pupil, things start to "make sense" in the field, esp. on overcast days and in the woods, and in the last year or two, I only took the 8x25 (Terra) with me and left the 8x20s at home.
The expanded FOV and eye relief in the Victory look also like a step forward.
But as you say, the new Victory is heavier than the old, so I will have to see how it feels.
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 10:21   #8
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Looks like a very nice update.

https://www.zeiss.se/sports-optics/e...cket-8x25.html

Ocular lenses look pretty large:

https://www.zeiss.de/sports-optics/d...02-350x350.png
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 15:38   #9
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Vespobuteo, post 8,
Jan van Daalen just informed that the new Victory pockets are fully made in Japan, so the original Zeiss innovations slowly disappear and only a few real innovators will remain.
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 15:53   #10
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They say Made in Japan on the inside of the hinge (I tried them at IWA). 25mm objective, 130m FOV, sub 2m close focus, dioptre adjustment on the far end of the central hinge... now where have I seen those specs before (albeit without FL lenses) :-)

According to the leaflet I picked up in Nuremberg SRPs are €715 and €745.

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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 16:41   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gijs van Ginkel View Post
Vespobuteo, post 8,
Jan van Daalen just informed that the new Victory pockets are fully made in Japan, so the original Zeiss innovations slowly disappear and only a few real innovators will remain.
Gijs van Ginkel
This is what I thought at first Gijs but the old Victory Pockets were already made in Hungary although at a Zeiss-owned factory. So you could say they were already 'out-sourced' from the homeland.

As for innovations you can find several patents on the internet that have been filed by Kamakura and in the meantime Zeiss has been inventive with SF, I am told Leica rangefinders are the best in the world and Swaro had an accident in the laboratory when someone dropped a binocular on top of a telescope.

Lee
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 16:51   #12
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Originally Posted by pete_gamby View Post

dioptre adjustment on the far end of the central hinge

Cheers, Pete
But Pete, the hinge isn't central.........

Lee
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 17:32   #13
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Copied from here and added the new Zeiss:

Best specs overall, I think.

290g 7.4 8x25 Zeiss Victory Pocket

315g 7.5 8x22 Kowa Genesis
330g 7.5 8x21 Opticron DBA Oasis

309g 6.8 8x25 Zeiss Terra ED
345g 6.8 8x25 Swarovski CL

235g 6.5 8x20 Leica Ultravid BL
270g 6.8 8x20 Nikon Premier/HG
241g 6.7 8x25 Hawke Sapphire ED
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 18:24   #14
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wonder if they will ship directly to distributers from Japan.... make a stop in Germany......
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Old Monday 6th March 2017, 20:20   #15
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Tried this pocket on the IWA and it is impressive!! Sort of looking through the CL 25.
The weight is a non issue for me because it makes this pocket much more stabilized and the view is brilliant. I'm told it's 100% Schott (FL) glass and.........
Still must get used to it. Top end binocular, one of the best in its class and made in........a Island in the Far East.

Jan
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 18:59   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jan van daalen View Post
Tried this pocket on the IWA and it is impressive!! Sort of looking through the CL 25.
The weight is a non issue for me because it makes this pocket much more stabilized and the view is brilliant. I'm told it's 100% Schott (FL) glass and.........
Still must get used to it. Top end binocular, one of the best in its class and made in........a Island in the Far East.

Jan
Jan

Any idea about the optical difference between the cl and the new zeiss?
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 19:37   #17
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I'm all for 8x25 format, esp. with wider FOV, but I am bothered that Swarovski and now Zeiss have _replaced_ their 8x20 (or best 8x20, if the crappy Zeiss 8x20 Conquest lives on) with 8x25. As a birder who usually uses and appreciates full-sized bins (Swarovski 8.5x42 EL SV), much preferring them to even the 8x32 format, I nevertheless have deep respect and appreciation for the tiny 8x20 format. I've used the Leica 8x20 Ultravid BL for many years now and can testify that it is _super_ capable. Really, there is very little that it cannot do in decent light, with superb optics and ergonomics. I'm also concerned about the future of the compact top-end 8x32 format. Swarovski has abandoned that niche, leaving only the old but still excellent Zeiss FL and latest incarnation of the minimal eye relief afflicted Leica Ultravid.

--AP
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 20:44   #18
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Jan

Any idea about the optical difference between the cl and the new zeiss?
I couldn't compare them (different halls) but from memory they are equal.
The main difference between those two is the asymetric hinge of the Zeiss which is a personal preference for the customer. Double or single hinge!

Jan
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Old Tuesday 7th March 2017, 23:48   #19
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I wonder if they are made in Hungary like the 8x20 Victory was?

Their larger eye cups also look more user friendly than the narrow rimmed eye cups on the older compact Victory 8x20 and 10x25.

Bob
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Old Wednesday 8th March 2017, 00:55   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexis Powell View Post
I'm all for 8x25 format, esp. with wider FOV, but I am bothered that Swarovski and now Zeiss have _replaced_ their 8x20 (or best 8x20, if the crappy Zeiss 8x20 Conquest lives on) with 8x25. As a birder who usually uses and appreciates full-sized bins (Swarovski 8.5x42 EL SV), much preferring them to even the 8x32 format, I nevertheless have deep respect and appreciation for the tiny 8x20 format. I've used the Leica 8x20 Ultravid BL for many years now and can testify that it is _super_ capable. Really, there is very little that it cannot do in decent light, with superb optics and ergonomics. I'm also concerned about the future of the compact top-end 8x32 format. Swarovski has abandoned that niche, leaving only the old but still excellent Zeiss FL and latest incarnation of the minimal eye relief afflicted Leica Ultravid.

--AP
Alexis:

I agree with some of your thoughts. But how much time do most active
watchers use these small pocket binoculars. It is not very much.

These are mostly just an exercise to keep up with others, and it is good Zeiss is updating the Victory.

I also like the Leica UV 8x20, and I find the Zeiss 8x25 Terra to be as good
as reviewed.

As far as a top-end 8x32, you need to use the Swarovski 8x32 SV. It seems
to be the best optic available in this size.

If you don't like the size, then move down and enjoy something smaller.

Jerry
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Old Wednesday 8th March 2017, 01:55   #21
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Quote:
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290g 7.4 8x25 Zeiss Victory Pocket
Hello,

A rather enviable FOV for a pocket binocular, about the same as the revered Nikon SE 8x32, and better than the Zeiss Terra 8x25 or that Austrian glass. It also has a useful close focus of less than two metres.

What did they give up? Perhaps edge sharpness?

Happy bird watching,
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Old Wednesday 8th March 2017, 04:56   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexis Powell View Post
I'm all for 8x25 format, esp. with wider FOV, but I am bothered that Swarovski and now Zeiss have _replaced_ their 8x20 (or best 8x20, if the crappy Zeiss 8x20 Conquest lives on) with 8x25. As a birder who usually uses and appreciates full-sized bins (Swarovski 8.5x42 EL SV), much preferring them to even the 8x32 format, I nevertheless have deep respect and appreciation for the tiny 8x20 format. I've used the Leica 8x20 Ultravid BL for many years now and can testify that it is _super_ capable. Really, there is very little that it cannot do in decent light, with superb optics and ergonomics. I'm also concerned about the future of the compact top-end 8x32 format. Swarovski has abandoned that niche, leaving only the old but still excellent Zeiss FL and latest incarnation of the minimal eye relief afflicted Leica Ultravid.
Alexis, I entirely agree with what you say about the little 8x20s, except that I would not entirely dismiss the tiny Conquest. Have you tried the Hawke Sapphire 8x25? It is as small and light, and amazingly good for its price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NDhunter View Post
...But how much time do most active watchers use these small pocket binoculars. It is not very much...
Jerry, may I respond though you address Alexis. We (I, and Alexis also I am sure) do, of course, realize that we do not represent what I have highlighted in your reply!
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Old Wednesday 8th March 2017, 14:15   #23
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Alexis, I entirely agree with what you say about the little 8x20s, except that I would not entirely dismiss the tiny Conquest. Have you tried the Hawke Sapphire 8x25? It is as small and light, and amazingly good for its price.

Jerry, may I respond though you address Alexis. We (I, and Alexis also I am sure) do, of course, realize that we do not represent what I have highlighted in your reply!
Jerry and adhoc,

Yes, I know 8x20 format is a hard sell and most don't spend enough to get one that is good enough, or don't take the time/trouble to learn to make the format "sing" in use. My main gripes with the 8x20 Conquest are poor strap attachment design (leading to abysmal hang), lack of positive hinge stops, awkward focus, and optics that aren't up to the standard of the best available (and you need all you can get in this format!). I haven't had a chance to try the Hawk 8x25 Sapphire. I have tried the Swarovski 8x32 EL SV, and it is nice to hold and look through, but it is big for an 8x32 (packs similarly to a Leica 8x42 Ultravid). I only use that format for functional spec (e.g. quick yet precise close focus ability of Zeiss 8x32 FL), or when travelling, in which case I'm looking for as small a package as possible. I find the EL SV unsatisfactory in those respects. Again, I welcome the 8x25 format, just don't want to see superb 8x20 choices go away. But if a bino company wants to market something "new", how about a super premium 7x21?

--AP
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Old Saturday 18th March 2017, 13:15   #24
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Finally Zeiss came out with a pocket FL , must be amazing. What next ? An swarovision pocket at 900-1000 euro price range ?
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Old Monday 20th March 2017, 08:01   #25
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this is crazy within 1.5 years of not been around , zeiss got new pocket models, leica has new noctivids, nikon with the new HG and new brands like maven and GPO with reasonable priced binos that perform well. I have been missing out alot
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