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Old Wednesday 16th August 2017, 20:07   #26
Troubador
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Found another

Lee
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Old Wednesday 16th August 2017, 22:24   #27
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Originally Posted by Vespobuteo View Post
The scope looks quite long, perhaps means better CA control at the edges than some others.
Hi,

would be nice, but I think it's rather that Mme Zeiss is fairly small... looks like the scope is about twice as long as the SF (which looks enormous on her) if we disregard the extended dewcap... so that would make 350mm and change...

Joachim
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 07:28   #28
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The scope looks quite long, perhaps means better CA control at the edges than some others.
Don't forget the sliding sun hood. this makes the scope look longer.

Lee
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 07:30   #29
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Hi,

would be nice, but I think it's rather that Mme Zeiss is fairly small... looks like the scope is about twice as long as the SF (which looks enormous on her) if we disregard the extended dewcap... so that would make 350mm and change...

Joachim
I estimate 420mm about same as ATX

Lee
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 09:37   #30
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I estimate 420mm about same as ATX

Lee
In the first photo it looks longer (compare with the iphone?). My guess is 450+ mm for the body only.
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 10:28   #31
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In the first photo it looks longer (compare with the iphone?). My guess is 450+ mm for the body only.
Don't let us be like some men: arguing over 1" or 30mm in length.......

Lee
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 11:11   #32
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Lee,

Agree with you about arguing, but speculation is always fun. The first photo you attached is pretty directly from the side, which allows a measurement of both the total length of the scope (L) and the outside diameter of the objective end (D). Their ratio allows calculating the overall length once D is assigned a reasonable value based on some educated guessing. My first guess is based on measuring D on my ATX 95 (110 mm), and this would give an overall length for the Zeiss of 49.5 cm. If the Zeiss would have slimmer bodywork and armoring, it could perhaps have a D of 105 mm which gives L as 47.3 cm. D = 100 is stretching it for a 95 mm clear aperture in an armored body, but if that were possible it would give L = 45 cm.

ATX with lens caps on comes to ca 43 cm and with the EXT 1,7 attached, ca 48 cm.

So the Zeiss seems to be a little longer, but really only about 2-3 cm. This makes no difference one way or another in practice.

What will make or break this new scope is how free of aberrations the image will be, both in the cherry specimen and in the average to below average specimen. There will always be visible quality differences, but keeping them small enough is key.

Kimmo
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 11:42   #33
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Maybe I am missing something but don't I still see a ribbed knob on the eyepiece for zoom adjustment. If so then the two helicals could be course and fine focus...at least in that list pic above. I didn't look at the others yet.
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 11:57   #34
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Maybe I am missing something but don't I still see a ribbed knob on the eyepiece for zoom adjustment. If so then the two helicals could be course and fine focus...at least in that list pic above. I didn't look at the others yet.
I lean toward that it's not fine/course focus. But I won't eat any hats...

The older fixed 30x EP from Zeiss is also ribbed and the new victory EP looks very short, compared to the old 20-75x zoom.

Not sure about patent infringement on the ATX though...
but I guess Swarovski buy their glass from Zeiss...so they won't try anything...
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 12:08   #35
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Lee,

Agree with you about arguing, but speculation is always fun. The first photo you attached is pretty directly from the side, which allows a measurement of both the total length of the scope (L) and the outside diameter of the objective end (D). Their ratio allows calculating the overall length once D is assigned a reasonable value based on some educated guessing. My first guess is based on measuring D on my ATX 95 (110 mm), and this would give an overall length for the Zeiss of 49.5 cm. If the Zeiss would have slimmer bodywork and armoring, it could perhaps have a D of 105 mm which gives L as 47.3 cm. D = 100 is stretching it for a 95 mm clear aperture in an armored body, but if that were possible it would give L = 45 cm.

ATX with lens caps on comes to ca 43 cm and with the EXT 1,7 attached, ca 48 cm.

So the Zeiss seems to be a little longer, but really only about 2-3 cm. This makes no difference one way or another in practice.

What will make or break this new scope is how free of aberrations the image will be, both in the cherry specimen and in the average to below average specimen. There will always be visible quality differences, but keeping them small enough is key.

Kimmo
Hi Kimmo

Speculation is welcome! Zeiss will need to compete not only with Swaro ATX but also Kowa 883.

If as seems possible from lack of zoom ring on eyepiece then objective lens zooming may bring unique optical benefits so the battle may not be simply about control of aberrations.

Lee
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 12:11   #36
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Maybe I am missing something but don't I still see a ribbed knob on the eyepiece for zoom adjustment. If so then the two helicals could be course and fine focus...at least in that list pic above. I didn't look at the others yet.
Frank

I may be wrong but I associate ribbing at the base of an eyepiece with being able to grip it securely during mount/dismount.

Not long now to find out one way or the other...

Lee
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 12:20   #37
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Don't let us be like some men: arguing over 1" or 30mm in length.......

Lee


speculating is fun, but not knowing is annoying, please bring on the leaks from the Zeiss head quarters, this is worse than torture...

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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 12:30   #38
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speculating is fun, but not knowing is annoying, please bring on the leaks from the Zeiss head quarters, this is worse than torture...
Yes, but when the torture stops it is soooooo nice
I won't be on-line at Bird Fair so won't be able to post, but I expect the main info will be available from tomorrow morning.

I will post impressions when I get back on Monday next week.

Lee
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 13:00   #39
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The two rings resemble the "dual speed" focuser on this Minox scope:

http://www.minox.com/index.php?id=md_88_w_overview&L=2
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 13:50   #40
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The two rings resemble the "dual speed" focuser on this Minox scope:

http://www.minox.com/index.php?id=md_88_w_overview&L=2
Nice find Henry. Pity Minox doesn't appear to be attending Bird Fair this year. However, Zeiss had split slow/fast focusers in the past then combined them into one, so splitting them again would be a step backwards.

So we have had one 'it looks like a Swarovski' and now one 'it looks like a Minox'. Any votes for any other brands?
Lee
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 15:37   #41
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In an on-line video previously sent to me by Zeiss and which I've unfortunately since deleted it was clearly stated that one of the rings is for focus and the other for zoom.
Peter
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 15:50   #42
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In an on-line video previously sent to me by Zeiss and which I've unfortunately since deleted it was clearly stated that one of the rings is for focus and the other for zoom.
Peter
Well Peter thanks for that insight although that info was embargoed until tomorrow. However I can't imagine Zeiss will be too put out by this since tomorrow is only hours away.

So there we have it folks, its an objective-system zoom not a zoom eyepiece.

Lee
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 15:57   #43
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Which leads to the next questions... with the EP be fixed or not and what is the field stop diameter and thus field of view...

Joachim
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 16:10   #44
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Which leads to the next questions... with the EP be fixed or not and what is the field stop diameter and thus field of view...

Joachim
Hi Jo

Is it possible to fix the EP while you zoom magnification? If asked, I would have said 'no'.

Lee
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 17:05   #45
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It seems that it's the 85mm "Victory Harpia" on the photos posted by Troub,
so I guess the 95mm version will be even longer...perhaps close to 2 feet...

"Harpia 85" is written on the body close to the EP-bayonet so I guess it can not be a ATX style construction,
but a more conventional body and eye-piece.

"Introducing the Harpy Eagle, digiscoped in the Darién, Panama using iPhone 6S and the new Zeiss Victory Harpia 85 mm"
More photos here:

https://www.facebook.com/naturetravelnet/

https://www.facebook.com/naturetrave...type=3&theater

https://www.facebook.com/naturetrave...type=3&theater

https://www.facebook.com/naturetrave...type=3&theater

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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 18:49   #46
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Hi Jo

Is it possible to fix the EP while you zoom magnification? If asked, I would have said 'no'.

Lee
Ok, let me rephrase this... will the EP be removable or not... giving different magnification ranges....

See http://www.pt-ducks.com/cr-telescopes.htm for how BF member David Rodrigues uses a modified Nikon digiscoping adapter as a zoom unit with wide angle astro EPs...

Something similar in a nice package would be a birders wet dream... 82 deg AFOV plus across the whoe zoom range...

Joachim
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 19:14   #47
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It is tomorrow in Australia.
Perhaps someone there knows.
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 19:48   #48
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Joachim,

Just looking at the pictures, it looks a lot like the eyepiece would be exchangeable. No reason why it wouldn't be. So if, as now has been leaked in post #41, the zoom function is integrated into the objective and not the eyepiece, it would mean that the subjective FOV of the eyepiece would remain constant throughout the zoom range - which would be nice - and that it would be a simple matter to offer a range of good WA eyepieces to give people a choice of which zoom range they prefer. What we have seen is 23-70x in the 95 mm scope, but in principle there could be a 30-90x or a 40-120x WA option. Lower limit could go lower as well, but at some point the prism size would start limiting the subjective FOV.

Kimmo
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 19:48   #49
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In an on-line video previously sent to me by Zeiss and which I've unfortunately since deleted it was clearly stated that one of the rings is for focus and the other for zoom.
Anyone here remember the ill-fated Zeiss Photoscope? Same principle - and excellent optics, I might add.

A shame the camera of that scope was outdated before it came onto the market.

Hermann

BTW, here's a link to the old Photoscope: https://www.zeiss.de/sports-optics/d...e-spektiv.html
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Old Thursday 17th August 2017, 23:47   #50
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[quote=Vespobuteo;3603940]It seems that it's the 85mm "Victory Harpia"

They named the scope after one of the Marx Brothers?..RADICAL..
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