Join for FREE
It only takes a minute!
Magnifying the passion for nature. Zeiss Victory Harpia 95. New!

Welcome to BirdForum.
BirdForum is the net's largest birding community, dedicated to wild birds and birding, and is absolutely FREE! You are most welcome to register for an account, which allows you to take part in lively discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old Saturday 9th September 2017, 06:55   #126
tommybj
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Zealand, Denmark
Posts: 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by jring View Post
Hi,

thanks for the info - to put this in perspective, what were the conditions?

Inside or outside? Through a window? Distance? Weather conditions?

At 75x seeing could spoil the view.

TIA,

Joachim
It was outside and in good condition, at about 50 meters. Tried Swarovski at the same time and it was pin sharp. So it must have been a bad unit.
tommybj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 10th September 2017, 16:31   #127
DRodrigues
Registered User

 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Coimbra
Posts: 461
Quote:
Originally Posted by tommybj View Post
... So it must have been a bad unit.
It doesn't make much sense using a not good unit as a demo in a bird fair. Would it be due to the dual-speed focus that didn't allow you to reach a perfect focus?
__________________
David
_____________________

http://www.pt-ducks.com
DRodrigues is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 10th September 2017, 19:36   #128
mayoayo
Registered User
 
mayoayo's Avatar

 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: El Garraf
Posts: 2,148
Magnifying the failure

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRodrigues View Post
It doesn't make much sense using a not good unit as a demo in a bird fair. Would it be due to the dual-speed focus that didn't allow you to reach a perfect focus?
No it doesnt..yet it seems to be a trend ,because Kowa also used substandard preproduction units of their Prominar 55 to send around to the reviewers ,that then pointed to them the low quality of their product ,so they can improve final product quality to the highest standards .
mayoayo is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 12th September 2017, 13:28   #129
tommybj
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Zealand, Denmark
Posts: 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRodrigues View Post
It doesn't make much sense using a not good unit as a demo in a bird fair. Would it be due to the dual-speed focus that didn't allow you to reach a perfect focus?
Although I didn't spend much time with, others were waiting, I did spend enough time trying to get a perfect focus and no matter what, it just didn't happen. I even tried a Opticron HR at the nearby tent and it was better. That's why I'm sure it must have been a bad unit, even though the Opticron is good, it can't be better than the Harpia.
tommybj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 12th September 2017, 23:01   #130
DRodrigues
Registered User

 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Coimbra
Posts: 461
So someone at Zeiss isn't doing is work right... A bad unit isn't admissible at a bird fare.
__________________
David
_____________________

http://www.pt-ducks.com
DRodrigues is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 29th September 2017, 20:45   #131
Steve O4B
VP of Sales, Optics4Birding.com
 
Steve O4B's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Aliso Viejo, CA
Posts: 104
We received consumer pricing on the Harpias this morning. 85mm body is $3299.99, 95mm body is $3749.99, eyepiece is $700. We're in the process of uploading specs and images. The products will be active on our site by Monday, 10/2.
__________________
Steve Sosensky, Optics4Birding.com
SoCA Bird Guides
Steve O4B is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 29th September 2017, 21:16   #132
Egrets Ivadafew
Registered User

 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Leicestershire
Posts: 128
Blog Entries: 2
Yeah, one of the Zeiss guys at the Birdfair reckoned on £4000. It's got to be sparkling perfection and nothing less at that price.
Egrets Ivadafew is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 29th September 2017, 21:29   #133
Egrets Ivadafew
Registered User

 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Leicestershire
Posts: 128
Blog Entries: 2
Oops! Just realised Steve is talking in dollars not pounds. I'll shut my big mouth (still a lot of readies though).
Egrets Ivadafew is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Monday 2nd October 2017, 15:33   #134
FrankD
Registered User
 
FrankD's Avatar

 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Eastern Pennsylvania
Posts: 8,365
I had a brief opportunity to try out the new scope at the American Birding Expo this past weekend. I was extremely impressed with the optical performance. I really did not have much time but there really wasn't anything optically, and at any magnification, that was nothing short of impressive. That consistent apparent field of view is truly another step forward.
__________________
Visit our Optics Review site......
http://opticstheviewfromhere.com/
Digiscoped videos .....
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAf...1LMvsLF0DExoog
FrankD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 3rd October 2017, 22:56   #135
Steve O4B
VP of Sales, Optics4Birding.com
 
Steve O4B's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Aliso Viejo, CA
Posts: 104
The Zeiss Victory Harpia 85mm and 95mm scopes are now on our website, available for pre-order. It's interesting that the eyepiece is sold separately, since no other eyepieces are available. I'm looking forward to lining them up with the competitors.
__________________
Steve Sosensky, Optics4Birding.com
SoCA Bird Guides
Steve O4B is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 4th October 2017, 03:48   #136
chill6x6
Registered User
BF Supporter 2018
 
chill6x6's Avatar

 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Alabama
Posts: 931
Sounds like a really nice scope and possibly a real improvement over the Kowa 883...
__________________
Chuck
chill6x6 is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2017 2018 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 5th October 2017, 07:11   #137
SzimiStyle
The Shorebird Addict
 
SzimiStyle's Avatar

 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Milton Keynes, UK
Posts: 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankD View Post
I had a brief opportunity to try out the new scope at the American Birding Expo this past weekend. I was extremely impressed with the optical performance. I really did not have much time but there really wasn't anything optically, and at any magnification, that was nothing short of impressive. That consistent apparent field of view is truly another step forward.
How did you feel about the depth of field. I found the Gavia’s DOF to be very shallow and with the smallest movement the subject was out of focus.
__________________
My project: 'Handbook of Shorebirds of the World' http://thenewshorebirds.wordpress.com
My Bird Image Gallery: http://500px.com/SzimiStyle
Lifers: 2,186 l Latest lifer is Little Bunting (March, 2017)
SzimiStyle is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 6th October 2017, 17:06   #138
Apochromat
ZEISS VICTORY SF 8x42 KOWA 883 Prominar 25x-60x Wide

 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Germany
Posts: 13
Smile CaF2 is not Fl Glass

Dear Steve,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve O4B View Post
The Zeiss Victory Harpia 85mm and 95mm scopes are now on our website, available for pre-order. It's interesting that the eyepiece is sold separately, since no other eyepieces are available. I'm looking forward to lining them up with the competitors.
The CARL ZEISS HARPIA contains lenses from SCHOTT that contain a fairly high amount of fluoride ions. As stated by CARL ZEISS. Fluoride (glass with fluoride ions melted into) is not fluorite (CaF2 crystal).

Your website states in the description of the new HARPIA´s (http://www.optics4birding.com/zeiss-...ng-scopes.html), that the new HARPIA´s contain one or more lenses made from pure Fl- crystal, this is simply not the case.

Please correct that error. Thank you very much.

The only spotting scopes currently made with lenses polished from pure, artificially grown CaF2- crystal (made by CANON, see here: http://www.canon.com/the-eyes-of-eos...ogy/index.html) are those KOWA PROMINAR spotting scopes TSN 880 and 550 series we all know and love.

The difference in chromatic aberration correction ability and the advantages for the overall optical design (correction of image aberrations) is present when working with CaF2. Its only drawback is the much higher production cost of CaF2 crystals and the fact that this crystal material is much more difficult to polish accurately as it is fairly soft.

All the best
Michael

Last edited by Apochromat : Friday 6th October 2017 at 17:13.
Apochromat is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 8th October 2017, 11:04   #139
Apochromat
ZEISS VICTORY SF 8x42 KOWA 883 Prominar 25x-60x Wide

 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Germany
Posts: 13
Forgot to add the Link

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apochromat View Post
Dear Steve,



The CARL ZEISS HARPIA contains lenses from SCHOTT that contain a fairly high amount of fluoride ions. As stated by CARL ZEISS. Fluoride (glass with fluoride ions melted into) is not fluorite (CaF2 crystal).

Your website states in the description of the new HARPIA´s (http://www.optics4birding.com/zeiss-...ng-scopes.html), that the new HARPIA´s contain one or more lenses made from pure Fl- crystal, this is simply not the case.

Please correct that error. Thank you very much.

The only spotting scopes currently made with lenses polished from pure, artificially grown CaF2- crystal (made by CANON, see here: http://www.canon.com/the-eyes-of-eos...ogy/index.html) are those KOWA PROMINAR spotting scopes TSN 880 and 550 series we all know and love.

The difference in chromatic aberration correction ability and the advantages for the overall optical design (correction of image aberrations) is present when working with CaF2. Its only drawback is the much higher production cost of CaF2 crystals and the fact that this crystal material is much more difficult to polish accurately as it is fairly soft.

All the best
Michael
Dear All,
I forgot to quote the link from CARL ZEISS:

https://www.zeiss.com/sports-optics/...ry-harpia.html

It says: "Elaborate lens system
FL glass and other custom glass ensure an absolutely sharp and colour fidelity image even at maximum magnification."

And this is true.

P.S.: I did not want to offend anybody here with my previous post.

Performance in optics is not what a manufacturer is capable to do but what is possible to be done by an amount of money the end user can afford/ shell out.

Thanks
Michael
Apochromat is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 10th October 2017, 18:35   #140
Steve O4B
VP of Sales, Optics4Birding.com
 
Steve O4B's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Aliso Viejo, CA
Posts: 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apochromat View Post
Dear All,
I forgot to quote the link from CARL ZEISS:

https://www.zeiss.com/sports-optics/...ry-harpia.html

It says: "Elaborate lens system
FL glass and other custom glass ensure an absolutely sharp and colour fidelity image even at maximum magnification."

And this is true.

P.S.: I did not want to offend anybody here with my previous post.

Performance in optics is not what a manufacturer is capable to do but what is possible to be done by an amount of money the end user can afford/ shell out.

Thanks
Michael
Thanks for catching that, Michael. I've already made the corrections. I don't know where the kid who wrote that would have seen that incorrect information. I'll have a chat with him next time he comes in.
__________________
Steve Sosensky, Optics4Birding.com
SoCA Bird Guides
Steve O4B is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 1st November 2017, 22:29   #141
DRodrigues
Registered User

 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Coimbra
Posts: 461
astro eyepieces usable?

Just had a look on Harpia info at Zeiss web-site and still no news about other accessories (expected to October...), so we still don't know for sure if astro eyepieces can be used...
__________________
David
_____________________

http://www.pt-ducks.com
DRodrigues is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 21st December 2017, 08:06   #142
kbzsl
Registered User

 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Budapest
Posts: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by henry link View Post

Looking at it this way there is a rapid drop to alarmingly low effective focal ratios over the higher magnifications exactly because the aperture is dropping so slowly.
Hi Henry,

Please elaborate what is the effect of this "alarmingly low effective focal ratios" in the real usage.

I have to admit that my knowledge about optics are limited and faded.
In my mind lower f-number means lower depth of field. I am not sure that the formulas used by photographers can applied here. If yes, the hyperfocal distance is proportional with the square of focal length (objective ?) and inverse proportional with the f-number. Doing the math, the hyperfocal distance for the 23x is lower than for 70x magnification, which means higher DOF for 23x.
The other aspect what I can think of, is the diffraction. But lower f-number means lower less diffraction and sharper images. Which is good news for digiscoping.

What are the (theoretical) advantages and disadvantages of having the zoom element in the ocular vs having in the objective considering observation and digiscoping? I know that the truth will come comparing these optics side by side (I doubt that I will have chance to do this comparison).

Thank you.
kbzsl is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 21st December 2017, 13:58   #143
Binastro
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: S.England
Posts: 3,475
Low focal ratios in telescopes mainly mean severe chromatic aberration and other problems.
But only a test will see how it actually performs.
Binastro is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 21st December 2017, 18:58   #144
henry link
Registered User

 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: north carolina
Posts: 4,059
I would add severe spherical aberration to chromatic at very low focal ratios for "normal" refractor optics.

The Harpia looks like it more closely resembles a zoom telephoto lens than a normal telescope, with possibly many more lens elements. We know the aperture is restricted at low magnification and, across much of the magnification range, effective focal ratios are much lower than any high quality refractor. We'll just have to see how well it works.
henry link is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 3rd February 2018, 10:59   #145
DRodrigues
Registered User

 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Coimbra
Posts: 461
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRodrigues View Post
Just had a look on Harpia info at Zeiss web-site and still no news about other accessories (expected to October...), so we still don't know for sure if astro eyepieces can be used...
Did the same and it persists... Now no dates for other accessories...
Did a quick web search and didn't found the model available anywhere. Some sites mention end January / early February...
__________________
David
_____________________

http://www.pt-ducks.com
DRodrigues is offline  
Reply With Quote
Advertisement
Reply


Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Camera for Zeiss Scope roger48 Zeiss 9 Wednesday 21st January 2009 16:10
Best cameras for Zeiss 'scope? Dave Appleton Digiscoping cameras 7 Sunday 16th December 2007 15:20
Zeiss scope repair henry link Zeiss 31 Wednesday 7th February 2007 21:01
New Zeiss scope Needs Help, Please Ruger Zeiss 6 Saturday 29th May 2004 04:21



Fatbirder's Top 1000 Birding Websites

Help support BirdForum

Page generated in 0.23467898 seconds with 30 queries
All times are GMT. The time now is 00:11.