[John151]

Earlier today, I was out walking in the woods which were surounded by open fields. I was without my camera so there is no picture to help. Through a clearing above I saw two birds circling. The undersides were pale cream. The wings were slimmer than a buzzard’s and the tips were jet black and spread like fingers. The tails were fanned and rounded rather than straight. I have checked the reference books and I was fairly certain that they were hen harriers until I read that these fly low over the fields. These were circling at about 300 feet or more.

Does anyone have any ideas on what they might have been.

Thank you,

John.

[Jos Stratford]

If they were birds of prey, then male Hen Harriers does seem the obvious candidate. Perhaps migrating would account for the height.

[Edward woodwood]

difficult from the description John

possibly
Buzzards
Honey Buzzards
Marsh Harriers
even Red Kites

the black tips on male hens are rather extensive
two Hens would be an excellent (and unusual) record around Southwell though

Tim

[John151]

Thank you Jos and Tim.

Bes wishes,
John

[Simon G]

Did you notice anything else about the birds' structure, John, such as wing and tail length, or how the wings were held?

[John151]

Originally Posted by Simon G

Did you notice anything else about the birds' structure, John, such as wing and tail length, or how the wings were held?

Hello Simon,

I didn't notice how the wings were held because they were directly overhead.
I did notice that the wings were longer, lighter and plainer than those of a buzzard.

Thank you,

John

[dandare]

Could well have been two male Hen Harriers... Several years ago I was watching a female Hen Harrier flying low(hunting)over open moorland. She then flew up to a height of 2 - 300 feet, circled a few times before drifting off(still at height)into the distance.

dan

[John151]

Originally Posted by dandare

Could well have been two male Hen Harriers... Several years ago I was watching a female Hen Harrier flying low(hunting)over open moorland. She then flew up to a height of 2 - 300 feet, circled a few times before drifting off(still at height)into the distance.

dan

Thank you Dan.

I first saw one of these quite low, about 100 feet. It then slowly rose to about 300 + feet before drifting off into the distance.

Best wishes,

John.

[Edward woodwood]

sounds very unlike a Hen to me

Buzzards are extremely variable down to very pale birds indeed

probably unidentifiable now

Tim

[John151]

Originally Posted by Tim Allwood

sounds very unlike a Hen to me

Buzzards are extremely variable down to very pale birds indeed

probably unidentifiable now

Tim

Thank you Tim. I didn't know buzzards could be so variable,but then I am new to birding. I thought of Buzzards have having a fairly strong cream and brown underwind pattern with quite broad wings rounded at the ends but fingered. I'm learning slowly.

Best wishes,

John

[Harry Hussey]

Hi John,
I'd say that the mention of a fanned tail would point more towards Buzzards, with the different wing shape perhaps being accounted for by these being juveniles? As Tim says, however, they can't be identified with certainty from the detail given.
Regards,
Harry

[John151]

Thak you Harry,
Best wishes
John

[pianoman]

Hi - combination of cream underwings and black tips probably wouldn't indicate Hen harrier either; Black tips would only present in adult male, which would have grey underwings.

[John151]

Thank you Pianoman.

Best wishes
John.

[Jos Stratford]

John,

Only one way you will be ever sure of these birds - get yourself to one of their haunts this winter and have a good look at a few males and I think you'll probably understand if your birds were or not (and if you can't decide, no problem, 'cos then you would have seen the real things anyhow) :)

[John151]

Originally Posted by Jos Stratford

John,

Only one way you will be ever sure of these birds - get yourself to one of their haunts this winter and have a good look at a few males and I think you'll probably understand if your birds were or not (and if you can't decide, no problem, 'cos then you would have seen the real things anyhow) :)

Jos, sounds like good advice to me. I will have a look around the internet to find a likely spot. My problem is that at 75 my memory is not so good, I see a bird note its characteristics and if I don't see one again for a couple of months I've forgotten.

Best wishes,

John.