[mooreorless]

I received the new Cabela's Master Spring catalog today and it has Leupold Wind River Cascade Porro Prism binoculars 8x42 336ft/1000yds. 24.9 oz. and 10x42 273/1000 yds. 25.4 oz. with internal focus,water proof.These look like the Minox BD 8x44 BP with the same or close specs.$299 and $319.
Steve

[FrankD]

Hey Steve,

I received my Spring catalog a few weeks back and noticed them as well. I also saw that they now are phase coating the Katmais and Cascades. I have been to the local Cabelas 3 times since the catalog debuted and they have not received any of the new Leupold models in yet. The last time I was there they said that they expected them before the end of this month.

The only thing negative I saw about their specs was the field of view of only 336' for the 8x model.

[matt green]

they look identical to opticrons new HR WP porro's,maybe from the same factory but with different badge?

matt

[mooreorless]

Originally Posted by FrankD

Hey Steve,

I received my Spring catalog a few weeks back and noticed them as well. I also saw that they now are phase coating the Katmais and Cascades. I have been to the local Cabelas 3 times since the catalog debuted and they have not received any of the new Leupold models in yet. The last time I was there they said that they expected them before the end of this month.

The only thing negative I saw about their specs was the field of view of only 336' for the 8x model.

Hello Frank,
I haven't made it to Pa. Cabela's yet,a little bit of trip for me,I'm close to State College.Do they let you look through the binoculars etc. with no problem?Leupold also lists a Yosemite 6x30 Porro for kids and adults,supposed to be WP,close focus 16.4 ft.,8 degree-420/1000yds. field,17 oz,also interpupillary distance setting 50mm to 70mm. Adorama has them for $89.95. Is not 6 power the kiss of death for binoculars,Fujinon had a very nice 6x30 WF model once and still has the 8x30.These Leupold Wind River Yosemite 6x30 seems like they would be great for kids.
Steve

[mooreorless]

Originally Posted by matt green

they look identical to opticrons new HR WP porro's,maybe from the same factory but with different badge?

matt

Hi Matt,It seems like the same people are making a lot of the binoculars these days and like you say with a different badge.I think this has been going on for a long time and even for some of the high end major players.
Steve

[FrankD]

Steve,

Yes, they most certainly do allow you to look through and handle any of the binoculars that they have in stock even the $1500 European models. There are two individuals that work the optics counter that are very knowledgable but all of them are at least friendly. I have spent more hours in that department than anywhere else in the store. :) They even have resolution charts set up on the far ceiling/wall to utilize while you are comparing.

I do not think they have those bins you mentioned in stock. They only have what is advertised in the catalogs. For example, though they carry the Nikon LXL line they only have the 10x42, 8x42, 8x20 and 10x25s. They do not carry the 8x32s. Same thing applies for other lines as well...Leupold, Pentax, etc... I would check their website first before making the trip.

I am going to call again later in the week to see if they received the new Leupolds yet.

[mooreorless]

Originally Posted by FrankD

Steve,

Yes, they most certainly do allow you to look through and handle any of the binoculars that they have in stock even the $1500 European models. There are two individuals that work the optics counter that are very knowledgable but all of them are at least friendly. I have spent more hours in that department than anywhere else in the store. :) They even have resolution charts set up on the far ceiling/wall to utilize while you are comparing.

I do not think they have those bins you mentioned in stock. They only have what is advertised in the catalogs. For example, though they carry the Nikon LXL line they only have the 10x42, 8x42, 8x20 and 10x25s. They do not carry the 8x32s. Same thing applies for other lines as well...Leupold, Pentax, etc... I would check their website first before making the trip.

I am going to call again later in the week to see if they received the new Leupolds yet.

Frank,Thanks for the information,I am going to have to go to Cabela's.I did try a Swarovski EL 8.5x42 at Grice's Gun Shop a few years ago,slow focus model of course and liked it and I really liked the slow focus of it.There is an Amish shoe shop that is close to Port Royal that sells binoculars and high end models to,never been there.
Steve

[trashbird]

The Leupold Cascade porro binoculars look very interesting, especially in that they are internal focussing. This allows them to be more durable and truly waterproof than porros that focus by moving the eyepiece bracket back and forth. Here is a random ad.

http://www.opticsplanet.net/leupold-...ars-60992.html

If these have good porro optics, this could be the answer for those wanting the optical qualities of porros with the field-worthiness of roofs. They are nothing special as far as FOV goes, so they would have to excellent optically to justify buying them over $300 roofs like the Nikon Monarchs and Swifts.

Has anyone tried the Cascades yet?

And has anyone tried the Leupold Yosemite 6x30? They look great for younger users, but also for me as needing low IPD and long eye relief. Their FOV is expansive, but only because it's a 6x. And 6x would be great for steady extended views for scanning. Most places have the Yosemite for $99. Is the Yosemite any good optically?

Random ad:

http://www.opticsplanet.net/leupold-...ars-61165.html

EDIT: As well as Minox, the Cascades also look remarkably similar to the Opticron HR WP:

http://opticron.boson.posiweb.net/pages/page9HRWP.html

The Opticron HR WPs are discussed on this thread in the Opticron forum:

http://birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=38508

I suspect they are basically the same binocular.

Oh, and here is the thread about the Minox porros that are also basically the same bino.

http://birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=45575

What people are saying about the Opticron and the Minox is that they are both very good optically.

I think Swift should have looked into the internal focussing design when they made the new "waterproof" Audubon porros.

[FrankD]

trashbird,

I have been hitting the local Cabelas on an almost weekly basis since their ad debuted back in January. They are just now finally setting up a place in the display case for them...

..but I still have not seen them yet. Maybe this week.

[Pileatus]

Here's my initial reaction to a Leupold Cascade porro 10X42:

1. The diopter is set by focusing the right ocular, pulling the diopter adjustment out and then setting the focus of the left ocular. After a bit of frustration with the mechanism, I simply made small movements until I got a good image.

2. I did not inspect build quality that carefully, but it seemed pretty durable and functional.

3. I was primarily interested in image quality and, after I set the binocular for my eyes, I was blown away. The image in this binocular was so crisp and clean I didn't even notice its narrow field of view. It's sharp almost edge to edge and the overall clarity reminded me of my SE.

John

[matt green]

Originally Posted by John Traynor

Here's my initial reaction to a Leupold Cascade porro 10X42:

1. The diopter is set by focusing the right ocular, pulling the diopter adjustment out and then setting the focus of the left ocular. After a bit of frustration with the mechanism, I simply made small movements until I got a good image.

2. I did not inspect build quality that carefully, but it seemed pretty durable and functional.

3. I was primarily interested in image quality and, after I set the binocular for my eyes, I was blown away. The image in this binocular was so crisp and clean I didn't even notice its narrow field of view. It's sharp almost edge to edge and the overall clarity reminded me of my SE.

John

anyone know if leupold source their optics from japan?

they look identical to opticrons HR WP models,maybe they come from the same factory...i don't think this detracts.

the opticron badged model does have quite a slow focus action,two full turns
infact from close focus to infinity,though i did detect a little over run when
going to infinity?.

matt

[FrankD]

3. I was primarily interested in image quality and, after I set the binocular for my eyes, I was blown away. The image in this binocular was so crisp and clean I didn't even notice its narrow field of view. It's sharp almost edge to edge and the overall clarity reminded me of my SE.

John,

Are you serious? I have seen them sitting in the case at Cabelas for several weeks now but never asked to look through them as I had my interests focused on other optics. Are they really that good? I was just there yesterday but it looks like I am going to have to make another trip before the week is out.

[Pileatus]

Originally Posted by FrankD

John,

Are you serious? I have seen them sitting in the case at Cabelas for several weeks now but never asked to look through them as I had my interests focused on other optics. Are they really that good? I was just there yesterday but it looks like I am going to have to make another trip before the week is out.

Frank,

The 10X42 was in the case and, yes, the image was wonderfully sharp and detailed. Since I was inside, I have no idea how it handles CA but I didn’t see any. Colors were excellent and the image across the entire FOV was excellent. I had no idea the FOV was a mere 272’.

If you look at this model, take your time to get the diopter set correctly. Focus the right lens and adjust the left with the diopter.

I did not spend enough time with this model to make a recommendation, but I did see the future of waterproof, high(er) quality porro prism binoculars.

Take a look at them and tell me what you think.

John

[Blackhorse]

Originally Posted by John Traynor

Frank,

The 10X42 was in the case and, yes, the image was wonderfully sharp and detailed. Since I was inside, I have no idea how it handles CA but I didn’t see any. Colors were excellent and the image across the entire FOV was excellent.

Take a look at them and tell me what you think.

John

Newbie here...joined up to get more info, more involved, etc.

Re: the above bin...I just bought 'em. Have an OLD Leupold 7X35 gold ring that is really crisp (single focus click type - which I actually like quite a bit) and a Canon 8X30 that is heavy and is cursed with fold down rubber eye cups, as is the old Leupold.

But here's the thing...I went to a local "Sportsman's Warehouse" specifically in order to compare the Leupold 10X42 with the Nikon Monarch 10X42 that is so highly touted (both being "budget-entry-quality-bins" and just within my spending limit). Spent a good thirty minutes going back and forth between the two bins...looking at the optics wall chart about 50 yards away (Brunton, I think). The poor clerk was smiling - but getting quite fidgity. lol

While I admit to "wanting" to like the Leupold, being a local Portland, Oregon company (my town) I was expecting to like the Nikon more and was totally stunned by the comparative experience. Is there an issue with Nikon quality control? Have these widely touted bins slipped in recent years? The Leupold was CLEARLY (heh, heh) superior!!! And the difference between the two was just that...a difference of brightness and "clarity". The resolving capability seemed to my eyes to be pretty equivalent. The chart had some horizontal and vertical lines - close and parallel with the line itself appearing to be the same dimension as the space between. Each bin resolved this feature well - and there was no clear winner. But...when I just "looked" through the Nikon (Monarch ATB 10X42) it seemed there was a "smudgy" (that's a technical term, I'm pretty sure) quality to the entire field compared to the Leupold. I even checked the external surfaces of the ocular and objective lenses - clean as you could want! But each time I looked through them I kept noting that very slight greyed blur of - was it a bit of distortion? Well, I don't know what it was. But it was there and obvious. In comparrison, the Leupold was everything that I had hoped a 10X40 could be. Clean, bright, clear, an apparent edge to edge lack of distortion...you know...the clouds parted, the sun came out, the birds started singing. Ah, it must be Spring.

Sidebar: Spring in Oregon...lovely...45 F., light winds from the SW at about 20 mph...scudding light to moderate rain showers off the Pacific Ocean. Historical footnote: Chance of rain on the 4th of July for the fireworks...50%. So a glass has to be pretty tough to be of much lon-term use.

OK - Regarding other aspects of the Leupold...the fit and finish was great, the apparent quality was excellent, I liked the "locking" diopter adjustment, the weight seemed "right on" (a 10X NEEDS weight...helps to steady 'em) but not so much as to tire the arms needlessly. I did NOT like the flimsy field bag that came with the bins, nor did I like the lens cover pieces all that much. I guess they're putting their money into the glasses, not the accessories.

So, when all was said and done, though I had gone in armed with twenty three websites worth of evaluative data and experts opinions and the like - expecting to like the Nikon (I mean, look at the MSRPs - both of these bins were marked at $299 in the store I went to) I went out with the Leupold Cascade 10X40 (Phase Coated sticker right on the bin) under my arm...the Nikon Monarch ATB still brooding on the shelf.

I guess like most of us that have been around a bit, I'll trust someone else's evaluation just so far. I've been stomping around in the muck and mire for over 50 years (from SE Asia to SE Alaska) and for an item as personal to me as a new bin...I'll trust my own eyes...and to me the Leupold is the "clear winner". Um...Sorry to run on so long.

[trashbird]

You should write ad copy, Blackhorse.

[Blackhorse]

Originally Posted by trashbird

You should write ad copy, Blackhorse.

I don't do that anymore.

[Pileatus]

Originally Posted by Blackhorse

Newbie here...joined up to get more info, more involved, etc.

Re: the above bin...I just bought 'em. Have an OLD Leupold 7X35 gold ring that is really crisp (single focus click type - which I actually like quite a bit) and a Canon 8X30 that is heavy and is cursed with fold down rubber eye cups, as is the old Leupold.

But here's the thing...I went to a local "Sportsman's Warehouse" specifically in order to compare the Leupold 10X42 with the Nikon Monarch 10X42 that is so highly touted (both being "budget-entry-quality-bins" and just within my spending limit). Spent a good thirty minutes going back and forth between the two bins...looking at the optics wall chart about 50 yards away (Brunton, I think). The poor clerk was smiling - but getting quite fidgity. lol

While I admit to "wanting" to like the Leupold, being a local Portland, Oregon company (my town) I was expecting to like the Nikon more and was totally stunned by the comparative experience. Is there an issue with Nikon quality control? Have these widely touted bins slipped in recent years? The Leupold was CLEARLY (heh, heh) superior!!! And the difference between the two was just that...a difference of brightness and "clarity". The resolving capability seemed to my eyes to be pretty equivalent. The chart had some horizontal and vertical lines - close and parallel with the line itself appearing to be the same dimension as the space between. Each bin resolved this feature well - and there was no clear winner. But...when I just "looked" through the Nikon (Monarch ATB 10X42) it seemed there was a "smudgy" (that's a technical term, I'm pretty sure) quality to the entire field compared to the Leupold. I even checked the external surfaces of the ocular and objective lenses - clean as you could want! But each time I looked through them I kept noting that very slight greyed blur of - was it a bit of distortion? Well, I don't know what it was. But it was there and obvious. In comparrison, the Leupold was everything that I had hoped a 10X40 could be. Clean, bright, clear, an apparent edge to edge lack of distortion...you know...the clouds parted, the sun came out, the birds started singing. Ah, it must be Spring.

Sidebar: Spring in Oregon...lovely...45 F., light winds from the SW at about 20 mph...scudding light to moderate rain showers off the Pacific Ocean. Historical footnote: Chance of rain on the 4th of July for the fireworks...50%. So a glass has to be pretty tough to be of much lon-term use.

OK - Regarding other aspects of the Leupold...the fit and finish was great, the apparent quality was excellent, I liked the "locking" diopter adjustment, the weight seemed "right on" (a 10X NEEDS weight...helps to steady 'em) but not so much as to tire the arms needlessly. I did NOT like the flimsy field bag that came with the bins, nor did I like the lens cover pieces all that much. I guess they're putting their money into the glasses, not the accessories.

So, when all was said and done, though I had gone in armed with twenty three websites worth of evaluative data and experts opinions and the like - expecting to like the Nikon (I mean, look at the MSRPs - both of these bins were marked at $299 in the store I went to) I went out with the Leupold Cascade 10X40 (Phase Coated sticker right on the bin) under my arm...the Nikon Monarch ATB still brooding on the shelf.

I guess like most of us that have been around a bit, I'll trust someone else's evaluation just so far. I've been stomping around in the muck and mire for over 50 years (from SE Asia to SE Alaska) and for an item as personal to me as a new bin...I'll trust my own eyes...and to me the Leupold is the "clear winner". Um...Sorry to run on so long.

I think you confused the porro model with the roof. My comments related to the new, waterproof, internal focus porro prism models. Unfortunately, Leupold calls them both Cascades.
http://www.eagleoptics.com/search.asp?q=cascade

John

[brocknroller]

Blackhorse,

Thanks for that mini-review. The prism housing on the Cascade reminds me of the Vixen Foresta, which is similar to the Swift Audubon 820, and the oversized eyecups also look similar to the twist-up cups on those bins. The ER on the Audubon was significantly lower than advertised (12mm vs 17mm), and I found it difficult to get the hard, wide eyecups close to my eyes to see the entire FOV even w/out my glasses on (I have deep-set eyes). The large Audubon focuser protruded from the prism housings into the interoccular space and brushed up against the bridge of my nose, also preventing me from getting closer to the EPs. Though the Audubon's FOV was large enough that I could afford to lose a degree or two, the Cascade's FOV is comparatively small, thus I couldn't afford to lose 1/2 degree FOV.

The focusing was also a bit rough, perhaps due to the waterproofing.

Accordingly, I have several questions for you about the new Cascades:
1. Is the 18mm ER on the Cascade fully useable for eyeglass wearers? Can you see the entire FOV with glasses (or sunglasses if you don't use glasses?)
2. Do the wide eyecups pinch your nose when adjusted to your IPD?
3. Does the top of the focuser hit the bridge of your nose?
4. Is the focusing smooth or stiff?

Thanks for your help,
Brock

[Otto McDiesel]

Originally Posted by brocknroller

Accordingly, I have several questions for you about the new Cascades:
1. Is the 18mm ER on the Cascade fully useable for eyeglass wearers? Can you see the entire FOV with glasses (or sunglasses if you don't use glasses?)
2. Do the wide eyecups pinch your nose when adjusted to your IPD?
3. Does the top of the focuser hit the bridge of your nose?
4. Is the focusing smooth or stiff?

Thanks for your help,
Brock

1. I do, but my eyeglasses are slim and sit close to my face.
2. No, and i actually like the eyecups, they are confortable for people who wear eyeglasses as well as for people who don't, and that is rare these days.
3. No
4. Smooth after 2 minutes of use.
I would not say that the roof Cascades are as good as the Monarchs. Half of the field of view of the Cascades is badly distorted and bent. They made me seasick.

[FrankD]

I picked up a pair of these last night at the local Cabelas to try out. I was comparing them initially to the Nikon Monarch 8x42s, Cabelas XT 8x42s and then to the Leupold Golden Ring 8x42s and the Nikon Premier LX 8x42s. I did not expect them to be in the same class as the higher end glass but like to have something with proven superior optical quality present so that I can look for specific differences in one optical characteristic or another.

Build and Ergonomics:

Let me start out by addressing build quality. These binoculars have a very solid feel to them. I am unsure if it is because of the internal focus design on a porro but they have more of a roof prism's solidness. Ergonomics for my hands are excellent. They seem to have the perfect size and shape for my hands to fit comfortably around them. Something I found with a few porro prism bins is that the objective barrels aren't long enough for all my fingers to sit comfortably over them. The Cascades are long enough to offer that.

The focus is fairly good but not as smooth as the Nikons I am accustomed to. It feels a tad bit more "gritty" for lack of a better word. Not rough by any means but not butter smooth either. Speaking of the focus wheel, the diopter control is "hidden" inside. You must pull out on the focus knob to expose the diopter adjustment...which subsequently controls the left side of the binocular. Not a bad design in my opinion as the chance of knocking it out of position is remote.

The eyecups are an all or nothing style sliding adjustment. They do have enough resistance to be set in between fully extended or fully collapsed but there are no click-stop settings.

Optical quality:

Here is where they really shine, pun intended. Brightness levels on these bins were, comparable in store to the higher end bins I was comparing them to. They were noticeably brighter than the Monarchs and XTs. Not surprising though with the porro prism design in my opinion.

Edge sharpness was also very good and, again, somewhat comparable to the higher end bins. Color was very neutral and contrast seemed very comparable to other bins in this price range. ($300 US).

Now the downside. The field of view is fairly narrow at 6.3 degrees (336 feet at 1000 yards). I felt it was more noticeable with these bins than it was with the Monarchs. I am not sure why exactly though. Could it be because they are of the porro prism design and the wider objective spacing made it more noticeable? Could it be related to the increased depth of field (which, by the way, was very good on these bins)? I do not know.

Related to this I found them completely undesirable at reasonably close distances. Their advertised close focus is about 10 feet. Not great by today's standards and the porro design makes it even more difficult to use at these distances. Unlike other porros I have owned these seem to restrict a tighter adjustment of the barrels for closer distances. I actually get a sort of double image (figure 8) when attempting to look at items within 15 feet or so. I would tend to blame this on not being able to get the interpupilary distances lower. I do not remember running into this problem with the Nikon EIIs, SEs or Action EXs.

Overall I think they are a design with alot of potential. If they could change the eyepiece design to allow for a substantially larger field of view and better interpupilary adjustment then I think they would offer a distinct improvement over the roofs in the same price range.

[michaelboustead]

Originally Posted by mooreorless

Frank,Thanks for the information,I am going to have to go to Cabela's.I did try a Swarovski EL 8.5x42 at Grice's Gun Shop a few years ago,slow focus model of course and liked it and I really liked the slow focus of it.There is an Amish shoe shop that is close to Port Royal that sells binoculars and high end models to,never been there.
Steve

Lost Creek Shoe Store. If you are interested in trying out a lot of different binoculars before purchase- The place is very good. The place is "unique".

Mike

[Tero]

I have spent more hours in that department than anywhere else in the store. :)

Store staff: Oh oh, here he comes for his weekly visit. Bob can take him while we go on a coffee break. Then one of us will cover the rest of the hour with him...

The 10x Cascades are useable for birding as well, as the close focus is 11 ft, not 20 ft as in a typical 10x porro.
http://www.opticsplanet.net/leupold-...ars-60643.html
OR try http://www.opticsplanet.net/leupold-binoculars.html
look for 10x Cascade porro.

The closest competition is 14ft, Audubon
http://www.eagleoptics.com/index.asp...rch=1&pid=3825

Even the Premier is 16ft
http://www.eagleoptics.com/index.asp...urch=1&pid=793

[FrankD]

Store staff: Oh oh, here he comes for his weekly visit. Bob can take him while we go on a coffee break. Then one of us will cover the rest of the hour with him...

:-) I bet you are right. My favorite salesperson even transferred to another department!

The 10x Cascades are useable for birding as well, as the close focus is 11 ft, not 20 ft as in a typical 10x porro.
http://www.opticsplanet.net/leupold...lars-60643.html

The closest competition is 14ft, Audubon
http://www.eagleoptics.com/index.as...urch=1&pid=3825

Even the Premier is 16ft
http://www.eagleoptics.com/index.as...purch=1&pid=793
__________________

I am not questioning their usefulness for birding. The close focus distance is more than adequate for my personal tastes if I had not run into the problem with the interpupillary distance adjustment. Close focus seems to be a popular characteristic to advertise about with many binoculars I would assume because of the folks that enjoy butterfly watching as well. The closest I typically get to birds is about 15-20 yards and at that distance any binocular's close focus measurement is more than enough.

[mooreorless]

Originally Posted by michaelboustead

Lost Creek Shoe Store. If you are interested in trying out a lot of different binoculars before purchase- The place is very good. The place is "unique".

Mike

Hi Mike,Lost Creek Shoe Store,is that the one that is run by Amish?Also is it half way close to Port Royal?I have been wanting to go to this Shoe Shop but never made it.I have heard they have a viewing portal of some sorts to look outside.I live in Huntingdon area.
Regards,Steve

[FrankD]

I have heard of this shoe store as well. There was a nice little article about it in one of the outdoor magazines I subscribe to. In addition, the folks that run the store post on the PA Birds Listserve. I believe the gentleman's name is Aden Troyer. I think there was a Harris Sparrow visiting one of their feeders this past winter.

http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/PENN.html