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Feathers83 · Sunday 2nd July 2006, 18:40

Hi there.

Saw this pair of birds by a public pond in Southern UK... are they Geese of some kind? Never seen anything like them...

Has anyone any idea what they might be?

Many Thanks

Feathers83

Gill Osborne · Sunday 2nd July 2006, 18:43

Hello Feathers and welcome to Bird Forum

Those are Muscovy Ducks you have taken pics of. They ARE a domestic species of duck and often turn up on ponds....apparently they are really intelligent and great characters.

Feathers83 · Sunday 2nd July 2006, 18:51

Wow!

Thanks Gill! So they are Ducks and not Geese? Gosh. They are quite large, broad birds which led me to believe they were of the Goose variety.

Thanks ever so much - that's cleared that mystery up!

Cheers,

Feathers83

colonelboris · Sunday 2nd July 2006, 19:04

Apparently the only non-mallard based breed of farmed duck. Originally from South America where they domesticated by local tribes and the old civilisations of the area.
They were bought to Europe, partly as wild birds for collections and studies, partly for domestic use. Now they're all effectively ornamental.
Although the common and latin name imply a link with Moscow, they are predominately from Brazil.

buzzard12 · Sunday 2nd July 2006, 20:07

They taste lovely too...

Gill Osborne · Monday 3rd July 2006, 04:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by colonelboris

Although the common and latin name imply a link with Moscow, they are predominately from Brazil.

I never knew that Tony - thanks for letting us know

A friend of mine's parents used to have a smallholding a few years ago and they had a couple of these ducks. They were ridiculously tame and would follow you around, come into the kitchen and lie next to the farm collie - lovely birds.

colonelboris · Monday 3rd July 2006, 11:24

Here's a point (and no, I'm not tick hunting...).
What were the numbers brought over for breeding and did they ever really take off as farm birds and how does that number compare with those brought over for collections?
Also are the domestic birds as different to the wild ones as you often get with mallards?

Gentoo · Monday 17th July 2006, 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by colonelboris

Here's a point (and no, I'm not tick hunting...).
What were the numbers brought over for breeding and did they ever really take off as farm birds and how does that number compare with those brought over for collections?
Also are the domestic birds as different to the wild ones as you often get with mallards?

Some of the Domestic Muscovy's can be pure white. Most look like the bird in the photo although are a bit larger than the wild ones. Wild ones also have a smaller facial knob than the bird in the pic. Males have a larger knob than females. Wild Muscovy's can occasionally be found as far noth as Texas.

colonelboris · Monday 17th July 2006, 18:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gentoo

Some of the Domestic Muscovy's can be pure white. Most look like the bird in the photo although are a bit larger than the wild ones. Wild ones also have a smaller facial knob than the bird in the pic. Males have a larger knob than females. Wild Muscovy's can occasionally be found as far noth as Texas.

Thanks! I was just wondering if it'll ever make into the 'introduced' pages of bird guides...

Gentoo · Monday 17th July 2006, 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by colonelboris

Thanks! I was just wondering if it'll ever make into the 'introduced' pages of bird guides...

It's in most of the American field guides but that could also be due to the wild birds that sometimes show up in Texas. They mention the feral birds too but I don't think they consider those in city parks necessarily introduced.

Gentoo · Monday 17th July 2006, 19:46

On a side note I love your stupid people quote.

colonelboris · Monday 17th July 2006, 20:06

South Park, I'm afraid - one of Mr Garrison's

London Birder · Monday 17th July 2006, 20:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by colonelboris

Thanks! I was just wondering if it'll ever make into the 'introduced' pages of bird guides...

Tony, it may be worth scouting around the BOU's site and reading the recently issued Cat C reclassification notes, it did discuss Muscovy status in the UK, particularly the Ely population if I'm not wrong ...

Evanji Axu · Tuesday 18th July 2006, 16:06

My old therapist had a pond behind her office building and we'd see Muscovy ducks all the time.

colonelboris · Tuesday 18th July 2006, 16:20

Considering how ugly they are, they're sort-of endearing.

Tranquility Base · Wednesday 19th July 2006, 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by colonelboris

Considering how ugly they are, they're sort-of endearing.

Muscoveys breed all over Broadland as a feral population.... I reckon they (and Guinea Fowl) are next on the list! I seem to nearly always see both in Lincolnshire by the A17 too..........

colonelboris · Wednesday 19th July 2006, 22:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tranquility Base

Muscoveys breed all over Broadland as a feral population.... I reckon they (and Guinea Fowl) are next on the list! I seem to nearly always see both in Lincolnshire by the A17 too..........

You're probably right - it's not as they've been massively messed about with like mallards.
Hmm. Maybe we should stop convincing ourselves or we'll start ticking it next to the grosbeak...

Hotspur · Thursday 20th July 2006, 09:58

Boyos they are already on Cat C. You can tick em if you like, ergh!

London Birder · Thursday 20th July 2006, 10:05

Cat C4/E*

colonelboris · Thursday 20th July 2006, 11:55

I'd already insurance ticked them years ago.....

James Lowther · Thursday 20th July 2006, 12:39

I have to say i've just checked the latest british list on the BOU website and the BOU category C changes published Oct 2005 and they are NOT in category C yet according to those. Red-crested Pochard and Barnacle goose have both been added fairly recently though......

not that i'm bothered, just in case any of the anti-listing nazis are on the prowl!!

London Birder · Thursday 20th July 2006, 12:43

haven't read it since publication but I do seem to remember that they aren't 'tickable' as yet ...

stonechat1 · Thursday 27th July 2006, 14:15

Post from colonelboris:"Although the common and latin name imply a link with Moscow, they are predominately from Brazil."

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gill Osborne

I never knew that Tony - thanks for letting us know

It´s only sad that it is not so as colonelboris explained. The name from tis duck has no context with Moscow. Not the english and not the scientific name!
Moschata, part of the scientific name, means "musky" and not Moscow.
Regards, stonechat1

James Lowther · Thursday 27th July 2006, 14:30

muscovy is the name of an area of russia centred on moscow so the english name does imply a link, even if it's just a mutation from musky

Steven Astley · Friday 28th July 2006, 07:44

muscovy ducks are named after the muysca indians of nicaragua who were the first to domesticate the species.

Sunday 2nd July 2006, 18:40	#1
Feathers83 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: UK Posts: 2	A Goose? Hi there. Saw this pair of birds by a public pond in Southern UK... are they Geese of some kind? Never seen anything like them... Has anyone any idea what they might be? Many Thanks Feathers83 Attached Thumbnails

Sunday 2nd July 2006, 18:43	#2
Gill Osborne Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Alnwick Posts: 6,012	Hello Feathers and welcome to Bird Forum Those are Muscovy Ducks you have taken pics of. They ARE a domestic species of duck and often turn up on ponds....apparently they are really intelligent and great characters.
	Click here to Support BirdForum

Sunday 2nd July 2006, 18:51	#3
Feathers83 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: UK Posts: 2	Ducks and not Geese! Wow! Thanks Gill! So they are Ducks and not Geese? Gosh. They are quite large, broad birds which led me to believe they were of the Goose variety. Thanks ever so much - that's cleared that mystery up! Cheers, Feathers83

Sunday 2nd July 2006, 19:04	#4
colonelboris Right way up again Join Date: May 2006 Location: Back in the UK for the duration Posts: 4,232	Apparently the only non-mallard based breed of farmed duck. Originally from South America where they domesticated by local tribes and the old civilisations of the area. They were bought to Europe, partly as wild birds for collections and studies, partly for domestic use. Now they're all effectively ornamental. Although the common and latin name imply a link with Moscow, they are predominately from Brazil. __________________ tonykeenebirds.co.uk - photos, sketches and paintings of wildlife from Europe and Australisia. European Bird Names: A Translation Guide Field guide on bird names from English to French, German and Dutch.
	Click here to Support BirdForum

Sunday 2nd July 2006, 20:07	#5
buzzard12 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: sweden Posts: 2,873	They taste lovely too... __________________ http://blogbirder.blogspot.com/ http://www.alandalton.net/

Monday 3rd July 2006, 11:24	#7
colonelboris Right way up again Join Date: May 2006 Location: Back in the UK for the duration Posts: 4,232	Here's a point (and no, I'm not tick hunting...). What were the numbers brought over for breeding and did they ever really take off as farm birds and how does that number compare with those brought over for collections? Also are the domestic birds as different to the wild ones as you often get with mallards? __________________ tonykeenebirds.co.uk - photos, sketches and paintings of wildlife from Europe and Australisia. European Bird Names: A Translation Guide Field guide on bird names from English to French, German and Dutch.
	Click here to Support BirdForum

Monday 17th July 2006, 19:46	#11
Gentoo Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: california Posts: 2,624	On a side note I love your stupid people quote.

Monday 17th July 2006, 20:06	#12
colonelboris Right way up again Join Date: May 2006 Location: Back in the UK for the duration Posts: 4,232	South Park, I'm afraid - one of Mr Garrison's __________________ tonykeenebirds.co.uk - photos, sketches and paintings of wildlife from Europe and Australisia. European Bird Names: A Translation Guide Field guide on bird names from English to French, German and Dutch.
	Click here to Support BirdForum

Tuesday 18th July 2006, 16:06	#14
Evanji Axu Spiteful Cynic Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hampton Roads, VA Posts: 395	My old therapist had a pond behind her office building and we'd see Muscovy ducks all the time. __________________ ~Liz "The just man takes care of his beast, but the wicked man is merciless." - Proverbs

Tuesday 18th July 2006, 16:20	#15
colonelboris Right way up again Join Date: May 2006 Location: Back in the UK for the duration Posts: 4,232	Considering how ugly they are, they're sort-of endearing. __________________ tonykeenebirds.co.uk - photos, sketches and paintings of wildlife from Europe and Australisia. European Bird Names: A Translation Guide Field guide on bird names from English to French, German and Dutch.
	Click here to Support BirdForum

Thursday 20th July 2006, 09:58	#18
Hotspur James Spencer Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Nafferton, East Yorkshire Posts: 6,122 Blog Entries: 19 My location	Boyos they are already on Cat C. You can tick em if you like, ergh! __________________ Idiocy Birding Tophill Low Ringing My Flickr Last UK Lifer: Golden Pheasant (338)
	Click here to Support BirdForum

Thursday 20th July 2006, 10:05	#19
London Birder Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: London Posts: 3,335	Cat C4/E* __________________ D. McKenzie.

Thursday 20th July 2006, 11:55	#20
colonelboris Right way up again Join Date: May 2006 Location: Back in the UK for the duration Posts: 4,232	I'd already insurance ticked them years ago..... __________________ tonykeenebirds.co.uk - photos, sketches and paintings of wildlife from Europe and Australisia. European Bird Names: A Translation Guide Field guide on bird names from English to French, German and Dutch.
	Click here to Support BirdForum

Thursday 20th July 2006, 12:39	#21
James Lowther Registered User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Weymouth Posts: 1,988	I have to say i've just checked the latest british list on the BOU website and the BOU category C changes published Oct 2005 and they are NOT in category C yet according to those. Red-crested Pochard and Barnacle goose have both been added fairly recently though...... not that i'm bothered, just in case any of the anti-listing nazis are on the prowl!!

Thursday 20th July 2006, 12:43	#22
London Birder Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: London Posts: 3,335	haven't read it since publication but I do seem to remember that they aren't 'tickable' as yet ... __________________ D. McKenzie.

Thursday 27th July 2006, 14:30	#24
James Lowther Registered User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Weymouth Posts: 1,988	muscovy is the name of an area of russia centred on moscow so the english name does imply a link, even if it's just a mutation from musky

Friday 28th July 2006, 07:44	#25
Steven Astley Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Bolton Posts: 1,744	muscovy ducks are named after the muysca indians of nicaragua who were the first to domesticate the species.

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