[tarzzz]

Hi.

Are all these Common Redpolls (flammea) ?

All photos taken at the same time at january 07 2007 in the VERy north of Sweden.

Or, Are the light birds Arctic redpolls ?

Thanks

//Ben

[Andreas Hagerman]

Originally Posted by tarzzz

Hi.

Are all these Common Redpolls (flammea) ?

All photos taken at the same time at january 07 2007 in the VERy north of Sweden.

Or, Are the light birds Arctic redpolls ?

Thanks

//Ben

to me it looks like three arctic redpolls and the dark one probably a flammea

[tarzzz]

Yes, .. the 3 pics of the light bird is all the same bird.

//Ben

[buzzard12]

Very hard to say for sure from these photos, The paler bird does look very interesting, looks clean on the underparts with reduced streaking on the flanks. Did you notic the rump or the undertail??
The light doesnt help you a lot up there... Certainly, at that location, Arctic is not unlikely though..

[tarzzz]

I had 2 of those white Redpolls today.. they doesn't show undertail, but I took some pics.. I'll put them out here later. But I think Arctic.. they differ a lot when you see the "normal" Redpolls together with these white ones..

And no.. the light isn't here now.. full ISO 1600 on the camera gives time of 1/80... :(

//Ben

[Andreas Hagerman]

OK I would say they are clearly arctic redpolls..

[tarzzz]

Here is a bunch of photos of the 2 latest birds...

I still think they are Arctics..

http://orre.mine.nu/arp/arp.htm

//Ben

[marklhawkes]

Originally Posted by tarzzz

Here is a bunch of photos of the 2 latest birds...

I still think they are Arctics..

http://orre.mine.nu/arp/arp.htm

//Ben

Sorry to go against the flow of peoples opinions, but to me, they look like Common Redpolls (Mealy Redpolls). Having scrolled down to the lower photos, they show heavily streaked rumps. Arctic Redpoll should have a large clean and broad unmarked white rump. Also, on the original photos, they have buff coloured wing bars, which I don't think is white enough for Arctic Redpoll.

[Hubert]

If you want to be 100% sure, you must see rump and undertail.
Without it I can say nothing about this birds.

[tarzzz]

Yes.. it is not easy, I will put them down as Commons..

But.. there is a big diff between the "normal" and the light ones.. ?

//Ben

[marklhawkes]

Originally Posted by tarzzz

Yes.. it is not easy, I will put them down as Commons..

But.. there is a big diff between the "normal" and the light ones.. ?

That could be a female/1st-winter and a male. They are very variable birds

[Andreas Hagerman]

the colours of the pale bird are very typical of arctic redpoll: the pure wihte underparts, and the blackish and beige upperparts. this combined with faint streakings on the flanks, small bill and bull-headed appearance leaves no doubt in my opinion. the rump does not have to be completely clear of streaking and the undertail-coverts feature has been overestimated during the past

[marklhawkes]

Originally Posted by Andreas Hagerman

the colours of the pale bird are very typical of arctic redpoll: the pure wihte underparts, and the blackish and beige upperparts. this combined with faint streakings on the flanks, small bill and bull-headed appearance leaves no doubt in my opinion. the rump does not have to be completely clear of streaking and the undertail-coverts feature has been overestimated during the past

I agree about the undertail coverts, but have never heard of Arctic Redpolls having streaking on the rump. Is their some literature on this feature? I thought Arctic Redpolls should have a "sugar-lump" white rump pattern, usually in the region of 10mm deep. I also thought the wing bars were neither broad enough or white enough.

[J Jones]

Originally Posted by marklhawkes

I agree about the undertail coverts, but have never heard of Arctic Redpolls having streaking on the rump. Is their some literature on this feature? I thought Arctic Redpolls should have a "sugar-lump" white rump pattern, usually in the region of 10mm deep. I also thought the wing bars were neither broad enough or white enough.

I agree here Mark.

Take a look at http://www.kevindurose.co.uk/uploade...web-706066.jpg

Note the unstreaked white rump and the broad wingbars.

[Andreas Hagerman]

Here is a site about redpolls: http://web.telia.com/~u15702529/eindex.htm
with a nice picture of arctic redpoll together with cabaret and flammea: http://web.telia.com/~u15702529/ealtindex.htm - in swedish I'm afraid.

[tarzzz]

Thanks for those links. After I have read them I will go back to Arctic Redpolls for the light birds.

//Ben