Found Kestrel with broken wing (1 Viewer)

Found a Male American Kestrel Broken Wing

Hello,

I found a male American kestrel with a broken wing. He is very active. I've left two messages with the rehabilitation centers listed online in West Virginia but have not received any calls back yet. I'm leaving for vacation tomorrow for two weeks and will be working during the day so I'm not sure how I am going to get the bird to the center. I have a friend who might be able to transport it.

At any rate, if I have to keep this bird over night, what care should I give it?? I'm sure it will live. It's climbing all over the make shift cage I have it in right now and was running all over the yard a while ago.

When he was a bit calmer I fed him some water through a small syringe. I had two pairs of garden gloves on which he quickly put a death grip on.

Thanks,

Becca

That wing is much too badly damaged to ever be repaired. It's a very bad injury to the carpal joint, the equivalent of having your wrist torn out and twisted round and hoping it will ever be the same again. I'm afraid that euthanasia is the only practical option. Take it to any vet and ask them to do it for you, or do it yourself if you can (bird in bag, whack bag lots with baseball bat - crude but quick and kind). It really has no chance, and any rehabber will simply do it as soon as you leave. In the meantime, it's suffering all the time you have in that box.

KnockerNorton said:

That wing is much too badly damaged to ever be repaired. It's a very bad injury to the carpal joint, the equivalent of having your wrist torn out and twisted round and hoping it will ever be the same again. I'm afraid that euthanasia is the only practical option. Take it to any vet and ask them to do it for you, or do it yourself if you can (bird in bag, whack bag lots with baseball bat - crude but quick and kind). It really has no chance, and any rehabber will simply do it as soon as you leave. In the meantime, it's suffering all the time you have in that box.

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You have got to be kidding ! I have seen birds with only one wing in nature centers - perhaps this bird could be cared for and used for teaching at such a place. Also, are you so sure of your diagnosis based on a photo ? I wouldn't want you as my doctor that is for sure !:C

I put a small narrow box in the cage with him. I also put in two trips worth of worms in a little bowl. He came out to eat them very quickly. I found online that they eat worms. Hopefully I didn't just doom him. LOL... He is VERY active and is climbing all over the cage. I am going to get him to a rehab center anyway. Just to let someone with more experience than I check him out.

These are the only two places I can find online.. and have left messages at both places.

http://www.tracwv.org/

http://www.wvrrc.org/

He actually looks like he has his wing in a more comfortable position now. Standing up right and very alert. I hope he makes it and they can use him for training and education.. or at least give him a comfortable life.

Here he is now.. a couple hours later. He's standing right over the bowl I had the worms in. I hope he goes back into the box for the night.

I hate that I have a wild animal in a cage...:-C The cage is disgusting too. Its just been sitting outside at a friends house for years. Thankfully my daughter (2 years old) fell asleep right after she got home today and my son (4 years old) is more interested in the Nintendo DS. LOL.. Other than the house wrens on the porch barking at him, he's had a lot of peace.

danehower said:

You have got to be kidding ! I have seen birds with only one wing in nature centers - perhaps this bird could be cared for and used for teaching at such a place. Also, are you so sure of your diagnosis based on a photo ? I wouldn't want you as my doctor that is for sure !:C

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Can you SEE the wing in that photo? It's completely out of orientation, it's upside down. the radius, ulna and carpals are clearly totally shot. Wings do not bend that way! I have seen enough broken wings to know a hopeless case - only simple fractures can mend enough to give good flight.

The bird is a wild animal. It will be petrified, it will not become tame. Do you think it's fair to make it spend the rest of its life in a cage with one wing? It will not even be able to get from one perch to another, eg to reach food, so quality of life will be zero. it really is much kinder to end its suffering, as you would a dog with a broken back. Every minute in that box is another minute of fear and stress that there is no chance of ending in a pleasant way.

Hope all goes well.

KnockerNorton said:

Can you SEE the wing in that photo? It's completely out of orientation, it's upside down. the radius, ulna and carpals are clearly totally shot. Wings do not bend that way! I have seen enough broken wings to know a hopeless case - only simple fractures can mend enough to give good flight.

The bird is a wild animal. It will be petrified, it will not become tame. Do you think it's fair to make it spend the rest of its life in a cage with one wing? It will not even be able to get from one perch to another, eg to reach food, so quality of life will be zero. it really is much kinder to end its suffering, as you would a dog with a broken back. Every minute in that box is another minute of fear and stress that there is no chance of ending in a pleasant way.

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Point taken. I apologize for my prior post , perhaps I over reacted a bit. However wouldn't it be more pertinent for baccalynnvw to wait it out until an expert with hands on observation of the bird make the call ?

ps -KnockerNorton, I am sure you have the birds best interest in mind and I apologize if I offended.

I have received a call from the Three Rivers place. We are trying to arrange for transport now. They are 2 or 3 hours away from me.

ETA: She says they don't eat worms... whoops...

ETA again: I am going to meet a man at 10:30 tomorrow morning at a location about 25 minutes away..

Well done finding help. Hope your new friend does well and that you have a good vacation.

KnockerNorton said:

I'm afraid that euthanasia is the only practical option. Take it to any vet and ask them to do it for you, or do it yourself if you can (bird in bag, whack bag lots with baseball bat - crude but quick and kind). It really has no chance, and any rehabber will simply do it as soon as you leave. In the meantime, it's suffering all the time you have in that box.

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The advice both on BF and RSPCA is to put injured birds into a quiet place in a container and seek professional help ASAP

IMO members should follow those guidelines not advise people to bludgeon Birds of Prey to death if they are injured - especially not giving an unprofessional diagnosis about it's prognosis based on one photo over the internet.

Hope the Kestrel finds the professional care it needs and is dispatched humanely by a qualified vet if it's absolutely necessary.

deborah4 said:

The advice both on BF and RSPCA is to put injured birds into a quiet place in a container and seek professional help ASAP

IMO members should follow those guidelines not advise people to bludgeon Birds of Prey to death if they are injured - especially not giving an unprofessional diagnosis about it's prognosis based on one photo over the internet.

Hope the Kestrel finds the professional care it needs and is dispatched humanely by a qualified vet if it's absolutely necessary.

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How do you know it isn't 'professional' or 'expert' advice? You have no idea what my job is. The OP wasn't getting any response from rehabbers and was asking for practical advice, as it looked like they were going to be stuck with a bird with an OBVIOUSLY (just look at it, for crying out loud!) crippling injury. My advice was intended for the best interests of the bird and OP, not tip-toeing around the facts like this was an episode of House.

Well, he was delivered to the transporter alive. Hopefully they can either help him or put him down peacefully. He was still standing and walking when I took him but he was no where near as active as he was yesterday.

KnockerNorton said:

How do you know it isn't 'professional' or 'expert' advice?

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because the 'professional and expert' advice with regard to injured birds is to take them to a vet/rehab ASAP not advise members, anonomously, on an internet forum to take matters into their own hands and kill birds they find injured.

Well done baccalyn for doing the best you could and getting it expert help ... it's in the best hands whatever the outcome.

deborah4 said:

because the 'professional and expert' advice with regard to injured birds is to take them to a vet/rehab ASAP not advise members, anonomously, on an internet forum to take matters into their own hands and kill birds they find injured.

Well done baccalyn for doing the best you could and getting it expert help ... it's in the best hands whatever the outcome.

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If your child fell over and hurt itself, would you apply first aid or sit there waiting for a 'professional' to come and give it a painkiller and an elastoplast? "Taking matters into their own hands" is exactly what people do when they pick up a bird (a gull chick for example), feed it, put in a box etc etc etc. Deciding that euthanasia is the best option is another decision that can be made - you do not necessarily need 7 yrs at vet school to know when an animal has no chance and is suffering. There is nothing 'wrong' in deciding that ending suffering is the best option.

Such 'professionals' in wild bird care are rather few and far between. Many vets won't even look at them, and RSPCA can be worse than useless (often totally unskilled in wild birds). 'Expert' is more applicable, as many more people have 'expertise' through experience, or it may form part of their job in one way or another. Don't be so quick to judge others' advice, and assume that your advice is somehow more 'expert' and informed. For all you know, I may have decades of experience of treating, keeping and diagnosing problems in wild birds, and may even get paid for it. Les Stocker never went to vet school or worked for RSPCA, y'know, and 'rehabbers' don't have degrees in the field.

Well done baccalyn for doing what you could. My advice was on a 'if you feel you can' basis, and no disrespect to you.

KnockerNorton said:

If your child fell over and hurt itself, would you apply first aid or sit there waiting for a 'professional' to come and give it a painkiller and an elastoplast?

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Absolutely - I wouldn't bash it's brains out though if the ambulance was slow to arrive which is what you were advocating.

There was no reason to think from the posts re. this Kestrel, it was either in it's final death throws or writhing around in agony - it was eating and moving around in the container.

Anyway not going to argue this any more - We will simply beg to differ as to what the best course of action is if someone comes on here asking for help for a bird of prey with an injured wing.

Of course, if I found an animal or bird with it's guts half out and rear end squashed as a result of a car accident and consequently screaming in agony, I'd wish I'd have a gun or hyperdermic at least to hand but would certainly dispatch it as quickly and humanely as possible.

deborah4 said:

Absolutely - I wouldn't bash it's brains out though if the ambulance was slow to arrive which is what you were advocating.

There was no reason to think from the posts re. this Kestrel, it was either in it's final death throws or writhing around in agony - it was eating and moving around in the container.

Anyway not going to argue this any more - We will simply beg to differ as to what the best course of action is if someone comes on here asking for help for a bird of prey with an injured wing.

Of course, if I found an animal or bird with it's guts half out and rear end squashed as a result of a car accident and consequently screaming in agony, I'd wish I'd have a gun or hyperdermic at least to hand but would certainly dispatch it as quickly and humanely as possible.

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Deborah, you show your inexperience of the topic here - what do final death throws and agony look like in a bird? Do you actually know? Distressed and suffering birds are usually quiet and still. It is the ones making all the noise and bouncing around like a maniac that are in the best shape. Birds can generally only be caught once they are very far down the line, as they hide minor stress/injury well (so as not to look like an easy target). If you know much about bird anatomy and how broken wings repair, then you could see by one look at that pic that the wing has had it. There HAVE to be major breaks and joint/ligament damage for it to be in that position. It's like seeing a human leg on backwards. Such injuries cannot be repaired, as the joints never regain total function and the nerves/ligaments are broken. Once one realises that, then there will only be one outcome. And it is better for the bird that that outcome comes sooner rather than later - that is the most humane thing, as a cooped-up wild bird in close proximity to people looming over it is under immense stress and fear (we can measure this with hormone levels). What pain it feels is genuinely hard to know (judging from ourselves, it would be horrific), so the stress is the main humane issue. And how that final outcome is reached is a matter of choice. I was offering a solution that would be quick for the bird and the least distressing for the finder - pulling a birds neck or drowning it is too close-quarters for most people. Having it for 2 days til someone injects it is unacceptable in terms of suffering to my view.

You do not need to be a trained vet to know all this. It is largely common sense, O level biology and basic humanity. Killing a bird is a last resort, but by the time most casualities are found, that is the only option left in terms of future suffering. Experienced people can tell when this is necessary without it having "it's guts half out and rear end squashed as a result of a car accident". If one takes on advice from some posts on here rather than knee-jerk argue against them from a position of relative ignorance, then they may actually learn something and know how to respond in the most humane way if they were in a similar position.

KnockerNorton said:

Deborah, you show your inexperience of the topic here - .

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gosh are you really as objectionable in real life ''Poecile'', ''Knockernorton'' or whatever your name is, as you come across on the internet? And I'm not just referring to this thread.

My ''inexperience'' as you put it, follows guidelines by the RSPB, RSPCA and BF - none of them advise bludgeoning a bird to death rather than taking it for proper help. The only one giving advice to the contrary of accepted standards is yourself. It would have been far more responsible to PM the OP with such an opinion rather than openly advocate killing the bird on an open forum, if that's what you believe.

If you find an injured bird, put in in a box and contact the nearest vet/rehab etc
as for the rest of the diatribe above .... I really can't be bothered.

The original poster did the right thing. Case closed

deborah4 said:

gosh are you really as objectionable in real life ''Poecile'', ''Knockernorton'' or whatever your name is, as you come across on the internet? And I'm not just referring to this thread.

My ''inexperience'' as you put it, follows guidelines by the RSPB, RSPCA and BF - none of them advise bludgeoning a bird to death rather than taking it for proper help. The only one giving advice to the contrary of accepted standards of what is regarded as expert advice is yourself.

If you find an injured bird, put in in a box and contact the nearest vet/rehab etc
as for the rest of the diatribe above .... I really can't be bothered.

The original poster did the right thing. Case closed

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I apologise if the facts gets in the way of your sentiments, but the RSPB is not a welfare organisation (and has nothing to do with injured birds), the RSPCA has very few trained wildlife/bird staff, and Birdforum is a web forum not a vet practice. It is clearly better to get a bird to someone who knows what to do, but often this is very difficult/impossible, and the time taken can be unnecessarily cruel to the bird. In those frequent cases, it is helpful to have a clue as to what to do.

Seeing as you are unable to define a 'proper' rehabber, I'll inform you: it is anyone who calls themself a rehabber. No training necessary. There are no 'accepted standards' as there is no 'authority'. There is no 'rehabber school' to accredit people. It is anyone who decides to take in casualties. I've taken in and handled many. Does that count? I'm guessing that you've treated zero yourself.

Unless you have ever been involved with treating broken wings (rather than taking a bird in a box to someone else), then i don't think you are really in a position to condemn the advice of others with experience in the matter.

I'd be interested to know your advice on how to euthanase a bird when a vet is not available and you actually have to make a decision for yourself?

deborah4 said:

The original poster did the right thing. Case closed

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Agree !! :t: