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Lihu_Xiong
Friday 10th October 2003, 05:01
This pic was taken by one of my friends--Laodeng.

But What is it?^_^

Lihu_Xiong
Friday 10th October 2003, 05:03
This is another pose of the same raptor taken by Laodeng.

Lihu_Xiong
Friday 10th October 2003, 05:06
I am sorry, I had made a mistake.
The second pic is another raptor. and it is also taken by Laodeng.
Then what is it?

Sumit
Friday 10th October 2003, 06:06
Before the experts come in, let me start by suggesting:
Rufous-bellied Eagle for number one.
Maybe way off, but Eurasian Sparrowhawk for number 2?
Sumit

Lihu_Xiong
Friday 10th October 2003, 07:01
^_^Hi Summit, if you post the scientific name of them, I will be easy to know which species you meaned,

From your post, I just know that Eurasian Sparrowhawk's scientific name is Accipiter nisus. But the another one's I don't know. Please post it. Thanks!

Lihu

Birdingam
Friday 10th October 2003, 07:05
I agree with Sumit for number one, possibly a second year bird with the spots on the wings. Where was the picture taken though because I'm not sure you get Rufous-bellied Eagles in China. Usully found south of the Himalayas, Java, Phillipines etc.

As for number two, certainly looks like an accipiter to me so probably agree again.

Andy

logos
Friday 10th October 2003, 07:24
For number 1 I'd also have to go for sub-adult Rufous-bellied Eagle (Hieraatus kienerii). This species does not occur in China but I presume both birds were taken in captivity which might explain that.

For number 2 I'll go for a juvenile Northern Goshawk (Accipiter gentilis). The heavy underpart streaking rules out most other species and the somewhat harrier like face pattern fits well.

Spud

Lihu_Xiong
Friday 10th October 2003, 07:40
Hi Birdingam,
They were both taken in Shandong Province, China. In shandong there is a research center for banding raptors named Changdao Reserve. And every year, 83% of Banded raptor in China migrate through there. So it is a nice place for raptor birding.

and I have find the scientific name of Rufous-bellied Eagle: Hieraaetus kienerii. It is only can be seen in Hainan Island, South to China.

Lihu

Lihu_Xiong
Friday 10th October 2003, 07:44
And both pics were taken when raptors were captured for banding.

Lihu.

Sumit
Friday 10th October 2003, 07:59
Thanks Spud! Did think of Northern Goshawk juv but expected a more buffish yellow cast.
Cheers!
Sumit

logos
Friday 10th October 2003, 08:26
Assuming the identification as Hieraatus kienerii is correct then this would seem to be a notable record and well to the north of any previuos records I know of.

Perhaps though it is a Mountain Hawk Eagle (Spizaetus nipalensis)? As far as I'm aware though that species always has a pale eye so I'll stick with kienerii (which is a good match in many ways) until someone can show this is not always the case.

If kienerii was to wander this is the age (sub-adult) that it would be most likely to do so I suppose.

Spud

Sumit
Friday 10th October 2003, 08:43
A Google search on kienerii resulted in the following:
1) The bird is listed as endangered in China
2) The range includes se China (Hainan)

Michael Frankis
Friday 10th October 2003, 10:11
The bill on #1 is very slender - is it not too slender for a Hieraaetus eagle ??

I agree with Spud on Accipiter gentilis for #2.

Lihu - do you have another photo for #1, and some measurements for it?

Michael

Andrew Rowlands
Friday 10th October 2003, 10:57
Bird no 1 appears to have a slit shaped nostril.

Andy.

Michael Frankis
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:02
Originally posted by satrow
Bird no 1 appears to have a slit shaped nostril.

Any significance to that?

Michael

Andrew Rowlands
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:15
HB does ;-)

logos
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:19
Nostril shape is likely to prove an interesting line of enquiry but appopriate refernce material seems scant.

It should be pointed out that not everyone places Rufous-bellied Eagle in Hieraaetus, some give it its own genus (Lophotriorchis). Within Hieraaetus it is notably small-billed...

The slimness of the bill is just one of the reasons I don't think it can be a Spizaetus species.

Spud

Andrew Rowlands
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:21
Don't Know how variable they are but try this:-

http://www.laurencepoh.com/gallery/malaysia/DSCN1603_copy_001

Oriental or Crested Honey Buzzard?

Andy.

Andrew Rowlands
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:22
Scant Spud?

Try Googling.

Andy.

logos
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:27
A juvenile Oriental HB is a definite possibility I'd say!

Spud

Andrew Rowlands
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:30
It is a bit younger but take a look:-

http://www.birdsofprey.org/exotic%20raptors/crested_honey_buz4.gif

Andy.

logos
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:32
Cheers Andy,

That solves it for me, I'd assumed that Oriental was always pale eyed and showed a more obvious gorget.

Well done that man!

Spud

Michael Frankis
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:44
I'd wondered about Oriental HB too, but didn't have the conviction to say so!

Laurence Poh's shot also shows exactly the same bill pattern, dark grey slanting down over most of the upper mandible and the tip of the lower.

Michael

Michael Frankis
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:49
Originally posted by satrow
Bird no 1 appears to have a slit shaped nostril.
. . . . HB does ;-)

Is that so they can keep wasps out of their nose while feeding?

For Lihu, Oriental Honey Buzzard = Pernis ptilorhynchus

Michael

Andrew Rowlands
Friday 10th October 2003, 11:55
As variable a (sub)species as our Honey, Juvs are dark - eyed too.

Yes it appears to be an adaptation to feeding amongst stinging insects. Also 'scaly' feathering around the face.

I thought you were the bookworm, Michael?

Andy.

Lihu_Xiong
Friday 10th October 2003, 13:04
thanks, everybody.

Oriental Honey-buzzard distributes widely in north,south and east of China.

Lihu

wpercy
Friday 10th October 2003, 18:43
A bit late again here, slotted nostril confirms the first bird, the second certainly looks like a Gos,an older juv due to the yellow eye,younger juvs have a grey eye.
What a cracking looking bird, that Honey.