What makes a birder...well, a birder? (1 Viewer)

[Gdavis248]

Been pondering this question to myself since I've recently seen a couple people say "I enjoy watching birds but I'm not a birder!"

To me this is highly confusing because I've been calling myself a newbie "birder" but in reality...what makes a birder? Does enjoying watching birds in any capacity make you a "birder" or is there some sort of list of requirements I'm missing here? I don't want to mislabel myself and pretend I'm something I'm not but....now I'm confused!

So, in your opinion, what makes a birder? Is someone who puts up a feeder in their back yard and watches happily from the window a...birder? Do I need the most expensive pair if bins I can afford with a harness, a Tilley hat, a checklist, a notebook, and a ticket to a faraway locale on a specific bird watching trip...does that make me a birder then?

Anyway, all in good fun! Just wondering what others think

 

[Farnboro John]

On the understanding that this is tongue in cheek:

There is a hierarchy of birders. Mind you, those in or preferring particular modes will stack it differently....

Below birder: robin strokers ("birds are nice but I don't know which are which")

Birder:

Raspberries (members of RSPB local groups) and dudes (all the gear no idea, but they are trying to at least some extent)

Self-aware birder: (keen, goes out a lot, has a local patch but isn't as fanatic as a patcher about it, might occasionally twitch something if it's close enough)

Birder: very keen, no other hobbies, has a regular crew, goes out most days before/after work, goes out at least one day a weekend somewhere more distant. May well holiday Mallorca or Lesvos. Twitches several times a year over some distance. Bores non-birder friends in the pub, though would probably argue they do the same to him with motorbikes or football.

Twitcher: Birds routinely (probably never stops and may not even be aware of what they are doing half the time) names a local patch but abandons it for twitches whenever necessary: uses the phrase "I need that" for birds they haven't seen; doesn't care what anyone else thinks of their obsession.

Maniac: As twitcher but off at the drop of a hat for anything new (NB doesn't need all that much, 500 is well in the rear view mirror).

Nothing to do with the above: ornithologist, ringer.

John

 

[Sangahyando]

Nothing to do with the above: ornithologist, ringer.

I'd say both of these categories tend to overlap with one or several of the ones listed above. Also, what about casual birders, who may or may not keep a life list, have a certain degree of background knowledge, are interested in seeing new species, but are rarely active about it? Met a fair few of those; IMO they may well be the largest category of birders worldwide.

 

[Farnboro John]

I'd say both of these categories tend to overlap with one or several of the ones listed above. Also, what about casual birders, who may or may not keep a life list, have a certain degree of background knowledge, are interested in seeing new species, but are rarely active about it? Met a fair few of those; IMO they may well be the largest category of birders worldwide.

I did say it was tongue in cheek... Obviously many ornithologists and ringers go birding, but I suspect not all, and there is no intrinsic link between the activities.

John

 

[Original PaulE]

I did say it was tongue in cheek... Obviously many ornithologists and ringers go birding, but I suspect not all, and there is no intrinsic link between the activities.

John

Out if curiosity what is an Ornithologist as in, is there an official qualification, degree or some such or do birders morph ino them as they get more skilled/experienced and are more into the science of it all?

 

[Farnboro John]

Out if curiosity what is an Ornithologist as in, is there an official qualification, degree or some such or do birders morph ino them as they get more skilled/experienced and are more into the science of it all?

In my view (other opinions are available) an ornithologist has qualifications and perhaps peer reviewed papers to their name. A very skilled birder is not an ornithologist and without commitment to academia never will be (though they may well be better fitted to answer questions on birding matters including identification ).

John

 

[Mysticete]

In my experience, most of the ornithologists I have meant are not really twitchers. They enjoy birding but tend to be more casual about it. Part of me does wonder, if for some folks, spending all your time thinking and teaching and writing about birds starts to make your hobby feel like an extension of work. Rather than a fun escape.

It's partially why I never went into ornithology or switched my paleo focus to birds. Well that, and the bird fossil record isn't the greatest. I like looking at birds without it being part of my job.

 

[Farnboro John]

In my experience, most of the ornithologists I have meant are not really twitchers. They enjoy birding but tend to be more casual about it. Part of me does wonder, if for some folks, spending all your time thinking and teaching and writing about birds starts to make your hobby feel like an extension of work. Rather than a fun escape.

It's partially why I never went into ornithology or switched my paleo focus to birds. Well that, and the bird fossil record isn't the greatest. I like looking at birds without it being part of my job.

That also influenced me (though in my case I failed at the qualification stage) - I never tried any route into a bird related job as I didn't want to spoil my hobby. Forty years of sheer delight says that was right for me.

John

 

[PaulCountyDurham]

Also, what about casual birders, who may or may not keep a life list, have a certain degree of background knowledge, are interested in seeing new species, but are rarely active about it? Met a fair few of those; IMO they may well be the largest category of birders worldwide.

Plenty of people won't fall into any of those categories.

I don't bother going out when the light's not decent, partly pragmatic in that I have other stuff to do, and I much prefer the smaller birds and any other song bird. I don't have a list. I had the opportunity recently to photograph glossy ibis, nightjar and a few others but not for me: all of these birds were close to me. I will make an effort for those birds I like most, such as two recent trips for shrikes, mind you I only went to Yorkshire so hardly a trip to the end of the earth. That said, if the light is decent I'm out from 7 in the morning until 8 at night. I'm the type who'll wait patiently for certain birds, such as waiting hours for a garden warbler yesterday. My knowledge of the sounds of birds has progressed markedly through being around them so much and being interested. Every bird I've ever photographed I can spot their song straight away, although I'm not at the point yet where I recognise all of the sounds of a certain bird. I'm still surprised now and again when I hear a bird but can't see it, and when it comes into view it turns out to be a bird I've seen many times. I don't have a patch. I go to various places where I like the walks, the scenery and I know the birds I like will be there: when choosing between them I tend to follow the weather and there can be a dramatic difference in a distance of 30 miles 'round here, but I am drawn to uplands and surrounding streams so will risk those areas now and again when the weather forecasts are not conclusive. I watch a lot of documentaries on birds also.

By the way, some of those people who are out all of the time and photographing birds aren't necessarily what they seem. I've come across some who when they think they can get away with it, i.e. there is nobody around who will mention it to others and damage their reputation, will lure birds with food and songs on their mobile. I was stood 'round one day watching a certain bird with about 20 other people: all of these people would consider themselves to be serious birders. One of them played the bird's song on his mobile. Of the 20 people stood around, there was only me and one other person who had a problem with him doing that. I've heard some horror stories also about 'serious birders' absolutely torturing owls, calling them out time after time so that they can get the best pictures, and I'm aware of people who have been fined for trampling very close to nest sites in order to get the best picture. I would guess the number of people who consider themselves to be serious birders, and yet lure birds with calls on their mobiles and the like when the birds should be conserving their energy to do what they have to do, is a lot higher than many imagine.

 

[Ries]

Purposefully watching/listening/studying birds, no matter how or to what extent etc.

Some think they're ornothologists, not birders.

 

[opisska]

The 3rd place WP/gWP birder in the Czech Republic (behind guess who ) is a former professor of ornithology. One day, he became fed up enough with academia, grants, paperwork, cliques and whatever and just quit, since then he writes books, speaks about birds in public and occasionally even does research just for fun - and also twitches, pretty hardcore. In 2020 he did a big year in the country, coming just a few species short of the all-time record, mainly because he decided only in May to start doing it So some professionals can be completely mad birders sometimes.

 

[Ries]

Yeah, sure both sometimes overlap and the borders and criteria can be vague. That's a given in each area. But some birders still think they're ornithologists; I mean, they take themselves, their knowledge and their "lists" too serious, add to much worth to it. On the other hand there are quite a lot of scientists, in each discipline, that are way more humble without inflated ego's. An objective difference between being a scientist and a hobbyist can be said to be; the first investigates, writes and publishes about it in academic/governmental/business attachment, the other just gathers knowledges and excercises it in practice (and they surely can overlap or go together) for their own fun/good.
Which doesn't say anything about (difference in) personal or social "worth" imo, but some themselves think it does... It's that ego-stuff, attitude, I'm quite allergic too, on either side. Says something about me and my self-valuation of course, I know.

 

[opisska]

This is a really good point and I think English birding has this really nicely sorted out - because you have "birder/birdwatcher" and "ornithologists". It's slightly less clear in my language as there is no single accepted word for the former - many people use the English words, the aforementioned professor is really heavily pushing a Czech alternative that sounds a bit silly, but some people also like to say "amateur ornithologists" (while meaning birders) and that is confusing. I for one correct anyone who would call me any form of "ornithologist" because I don't see it as fair.

But it's way worse in astronomy as there is NO Czech form of "stargazing" or whatever and everyone with an eye and a lens calls themselves "astronomers" and if they look at the sky, it's "observation" (and I am guilty of that as well, because there really aren't any words to use) - to the point where some professional astronomers started really insisting on being called "astrophycisists" because many of them don't even know where the constellations are and don't want to be asked questions about visual sky (one such person is sitting over at the other table in our home ).

 

[Larry Sweetland]

I'd say a birder is anyone who spends much of their time actively looking for birds, and is constantly aware of any birds that appear within earshot/view wherever they happen to be and whatever else they happen to be doing. They would also be incapable of not attempting to identify every bird they happen to see or hear. If you don't passively notice every bird around you and attempt to identify it, (even subconsciously with common species) then you're not a birder 🙂

 

[Gdavis248]

I'd say a birder is anyone who spends much of their time actively looking for birds, and is constantly aware of any birds that appear within earshot/view wherever they happen to be and whatever else they happen to be doing. They would also be incapable of not attempting to identify every bird they happen to see or hear. If you don't passively notice every bird around you and attempt to identify it, (even subconsciously with common species) then you're not a birder 🙂

This is my favorite definition so far and pretty much how I would describe myself!

 

[PaulCountyDurham]

I'd say a birder is anyone who spends much of their time actively looking for birds, and is constantly aware of any birds that appear within earshot/view wherever they happen to be and whatever else they happen to be doing. They would also be incapable of not attempting to identify every bird they happen to see or hear. If you don't passively notice every bird around you and attempt to identify it, (even subconsciously with common species) then you're not a birder 🙂

'Agree to an extent. Sometimes, on a nice sunny day when everything seems happier: the birds, the water, the trees and so on; I don't reach for the binoculars. Sometimes, it's a pleasure to just sit and take it all in: the birds flying around in the sun in their habitat, among the bright, green trees, the glistening water, the hills, the lush green grass, the lambs in the fields and so on: which bird it is doesn't always matter.

 

[Larry Sweetland]

'Agree to an extent. Sometimes, on a nice sunny day when everything seems happier: the birds, the water, the trees and so on; I don't reach for the binoculars. Sometimes, it's a pleasure to just sit and take it all in: the birds flying around in the sun in their habitat, among the bright, green trees, the glistening water, the hills, the lush green grass, the lambs in the fields and so on: which bird it is doesn't always matter.

But in those circumstances I think the difference between a birder and a non-birder, would be their reaction if they suddenly heard a call that was either unfamiliar or rang an alarm bell, or if a glimpsed bird didn't fit anything expected at the location.

 

[Ratal]

"uses the phrase "I need that" for birds they haven't seen"

Farnboro John made a solid point even if it is tongue in cheek.

I'd say a birder is anyone who spends much of their time actively looking for birds, and is constantly aware of any birds that appear within earshot/view wherever they happen to be and whatever else they happen to be doing. They would also be incapable of not attempting to identify every bird they happen to see or hear. If you don't passively notice every bird around you and attempt to identify it, (even subconsciously with common species) then you're not a birder 🙂

^^ Nails it to the notice board. Job done.

 

[Dave Ball]

"uses the phrase "I need that" for birds they haven't seen"

Farnboro John made a solid point even if it is tongue in cheek.





^^ Nails it to the notice board. Job done.

Agreed.

 

[MJB]

But in those circumstances I think the difference between a birder and a non-birder, would be their reaction if they suddenly heard a call that was either unfamiliar or rang an alarm bell, or if a glimpsed bird didn't fit anything expected at the location.

I'd extend that to my own experiences, but particularly in Australia, where through the background bird noise I hear a call or song that I'd heard 5 or a dozen years before, but not in between, yet my aural memory recognises it instantly, although my ID memory recall combination lock may take some time to unpick!🤩
MJB