• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Some "unseen" descriptions … now seen! (1 Viewer)

Reichenbach's Naturliche System...
Mark has done a great service in making this rare volume available (Reichenbach's works are notoriously difficult to index). However, the identity of Tiltria still needs resolving. It is not the River Warbler Locustella fluviatilis, nor is it the River/Riverbank Warbler Phaeothlypis rivularis. My first impression was some sort of meliphagid, but it doesn't fit there either (the tail pattern seems quite distinctive). What do other readers think?
PS. Perhaps we should put this in the Identification Forum!!!
 
Well found, Mark!

mb1848 said:
I hope people not from North America can see google books. ... .
Click to expand...
I sure could (and obviously also James), but if someone else can't ... plate attached (+ close-up of the Tiltria itself).
x
 

Attachments

  • Plate LVIII incl. Tiltria .jpg
    Plate LVIII incl. Tiltria .jpg
    521.4 KB · Views: 89
  • Plate LVIII, Tiltria, detail .jpg
    Plate LVIII, Tiltria, detail .jpg
    83 KB · Views: 94
Last edited:
The head sort of looks like a Cinclus / dipper?? But the tail is not right. The asterisk means ad naturam. Natural size. A couple of places in the book it seems to say Reichenbach delineated the icones?
 
Tiltria identificaton ...

In Gray's Hand-list of the genera and species of birds 1869 Tiltria is listed as a synonym of the Genus Potamus (here), p.210, No. 790, (also see Potamus, here and here) [Note: the species in Parentheses is the Type for the Genus, not necessarily equal of any obscure synonym on species level], however I agree with James in that the illustration sure doesn´t fit Eurasian River Warbler Locustella fluviatilis WOLF 1810 [profile and tail here], and it is certainly not the South American species Neotropical River Warbler (Myiothlypis/Basileuterus) Phaeothlypis rivularis WIED-NEUWIED 1821 (a k a simply River alt. Riverbank Warbler). Check any photo.

So what is it?

The head pattern, shape of bill, the rounded tail with its distictive pattern, the relatively short wing and the very short hind toe ought to be enough to take us a bit further …

PS. The best place to start looking is probably (still today?) in (or close) to; "Trepidatores: Motacillinae, Anthinae & Malurinae" ...
xz
 
Last edited:
Calalp said:
In Gray's Hand-list of the genera and species of birds 1869 Tiltria is listed as a synonym of the Genus Potamus (here), p.210, No. 790, (also see Potamus, here and here) [Note: the species in Parentheses is the Type for the Genus, not necessarily equal of any obscure synonym on species level]
Click to expand...
The type species of Podamodus Kaup [OD] is Sylvia fluviatilis Wolf in Meyer & Wolf [OD] by original monotypy.
In Gray 1855, as explained [here], the genera are given with their main synonyms and types, hence the species in parentheses can indeed be interpreted as the type of the genus name treated as valid. [Here], Gray listed Tiltria in the synonymy of Potamodus, and cited the type (of Potamodus) as "Sylvia fluviatilis, Mey." (this might have been a type designation, had the type not already been fixed).
In Gray 1869, as explained [here], the species listed under a genus are those present in the British Museum collections (in bold), or wanted by the Museum (in thin), hence not (necessarily) the types of the genera. [Here], Gray once more placed Tiltria in the synonymy of Potamodus, in which he included only "fluviatilis, Mey. & W.; Descr.de l'Egypte, t. 13. 3; Gould B. E. pl. 102."

Note that Tiltria was indeed introduced without any nominal species included, in which case the first subsequently included nominal species are deemed to be the "originally included" nominal species. (The type species should normally be chosen among these, even if this conflicts with the illustration that made the name available.) In the present case, however, Gray did not actually include anything in Tiltria itself, because the "mere citation of an available genus-group name as a synonym of another" (which is what he did) "does not constitute inclusion of the nominal species of the latter in the former, or vice versa" (ICZN 67.2.4). Thus Tiltria may still never have had any included nominal species, and if so has no type species.
So what is it?

The head pattern, shape of bill, the rounded tail with its distictive pattern, the relatively short wing and the very short hind toe ought to be enough to take us a bit further …
Click to expand...
To me, the graduated tail, with dark markings forming a subterminal band interrupted on the central rectrice, is quite strongly suggestive of a Cisticolid (if so, most likely a plain Cisticola sp., albeit I can't say which one; clearly not C. juncidis; note that the tail here is seen from above, while in the figure labelled "Cisticola" on the same plate it is shown from below).
The very short hind nail is indeed intriguing, but it's probably hard to exclude the possibility that the nail was simply broken on the specimen which was illustrated.
 
Laurent said: "Thus Tiltria may still never have had any included nominal species, and if so has no type species."
But Reichenbach in the text I've seen has a part called Genera et Species typicae. He often not only names the type species but refers to a book or picture.
 
Interim report!

So far so good … this far we´ve been able to solve quite a few (or at least add some information on most) of those earlier "unseen" ones. Not bad!

This only leave us with the following:

gerhardi:
● in the subspecies Zosterops senegalensis gerhardi VAN DEN ELZEN & KÖNIG 1983 (OD, here).
= the German ornithologist Gerhard Nikolaus (fl. 2010), writer of Distribution Atlas of Sudan's Birds with Notes on Habitat and Status 1987 and Birds of South Sudan 1989 ... etc. etc.

Also see this link, and the earlier Bird Forum thread here.

passmori
● … in the invalid "Cygnus Passmori" HINCKS 1865 (OD, here) [Syn. Cygnus buccinator RICHARDSON 1832]
= most likely the British (later Canadian) Samuel Wilkins Passmore (b. ca. 1805), of Toronto, taxidermist to the Montreal Natural History Society …

mariae
● … in "T. [Trochilus] Mariæ" (OD, here).
= most likely (I agree), thanks to the clever "guess" by Martin and the links in his Post No. #18: the French Marie Wachanru (1821–1853), whose full (maiden) name was Marie-Rose Gaudemard. Wife of the French naturalist, entomologist Alexandre Wachanru ... etc. etc. much more on her (if you know French) in that Obituary.

and then it´s the tricky, still unidentified:

● Tiltria
James Jobling said:
Perhaps we should put this in the Identification Forum!!!
Click to expand...
Yes, James, why not? Do that. Maybe the Identification guys would be able to tell us what it could be!?

And, by the way; while on the subject of identification!

nigellii
● in the "Nigells Pheasant-Grouse. Tetraogallus Nigellii" GRAY … couldn´t the nigellii and nigelli commemorate the same man (i.e. Dr Macneill)!? And be synonymous of (or at least intended at) the same (of today's valid) species? I think that was the original intention …

See link here, and Wiki's Taxonomy and systematics chapter (here) for Himalayan snowcock (Tetraogallus himalayensis).

---

However, the following are, this far, still totally unexplained:

● libussa (OD, here)

● Merva … (OD, here)

● lucieni (OD, here)
"… proposons de lui donner le nom d’un jeune Français, collaborateur de MM. le Dr Lucan et Petit à qui nous devons tant de fait nouveaux intéressant lʼornithologi de la région du Congo."
Click to expand...
The answer to who this "Lucien" was is probably hidden in Louis Petit's book Dix années de chasses d'un jeune naturaliste au Congo 1926 (apparently nowhere to be found on-line).

● sabinae a k a "Le C.[Colibri] de Sabine" (OD, here)

● tounelieri
… in the subspecies Hypotaenidia philippensis tounelieri SCHODDE & NAUROIS 1982 as "Gallirallus philippensis tounelieri" (OD, here, p.131+):
"Accordingly, we treat our series from the Coral Sea as a new subspecies, naming it after a colleague of de Naurois,
Gallirallus philippensis tounelieri, n. subsp."
Click to expand...
Who this colleague was, or is (presumably a Mr. Tounelier) we still do not know.

Anyone know anything on any of these names?

PS. "Himelia", in No.33 ... sorry for the earlier (erroneous) link. Wrong year, wrong journal! :h?:It´s this one (here)!!!
Not to be confused with Himalia (on p.224, same volume).

PPS. And the Leocadiae (vs Aline) still remain a mystery?
x
 
Last edited:
Taphrospilus is correct. JOHANN LUDWIG CHOULANT Ludwig Reichenbach's most intimate friend wrote an Opera called Libussa.
 
As HBW Alive mention now....

Eponym; "Colibri de Marie"; dedication not given (Bourcier & Mulsant 1846, Annales Sci. Phys. Nat. Agric. Indust., Soc. Royale Agric. Lyon, 9, 319); perhaps for Bourcier's daughter Marie Jules Victorine Bourcier (b. 1842), or Mulsant's aunt Marie Rosalie Etiennette Tuffet née Mulsant (d. 1834), or Maria Sybilla Merian (1647-1717) Swiss-German botanical artist and entomologist in Surinam 1699-1701, or Marie-Rose Wachanru née Gaudemard (1821-1853) French entomologist, both of whom Mulsant admired (syn. Amazilia beryllina)
Click to expand...

...I ask myself if Marie Jules Victorine Mulsant (b. 1842) (and not Bourcier) would be correct?
 
Another "unsen" one!

promaucanus
● … in the the invalid, discussed and hard to-identify "Phalacrocorax promaucanus" PHILIPPI 1899 (OD, attached)

Good luck interpreting it!
x
 

Attachments

  • Philippi 1899, Anal. Univ. Chile, 103.pdf
    472.1 KB · Views: 59
Calalp said:
promaucanus
● … in the the invalid, discussed and hard to-identify "Phalacrocorax promaucanus" PHILIPPI 1899 (OD, attached)

Good luck interpreting it!
x
Click to expand...
Promaucaes/Promaucas/Purumaucas: "(quechua purum awqa: wild people), [...] indigenous pre-Columbian Mapuche tribal group that lived in the present territory of Chile, south of the Maipo River basin of Santiago, Chile and the Itata River." This may also refer to the area these people inhabited: "The early Spanish in the area knew their region as the province of Promaucae and its inhabitants were called Promaucaes."
+ -anus, -ana, -anum: "of" or "pertaining to".

Are there reasons to make this something else than a young Neotropic Cormorant?

(The footnote on the preceding page stating that eumegethes ["of a good size"] means "esbelto" [slender] is a bit surprising.)
 
Last edited:
Laurent, quick as ever!

A full reply in just about 20 minutes!? That´s close to a record!

However; here´s yet some more of Jobling's "unseen" ones … for you, and all of you other guys out there (and for James, of course), to ponder over:

joanae
● … in the invalid "Ailuroedus melanotis joanae" MATHEWS 1941 (OD, here)

myrtae
● … in the hard-to-place subspecies Puffinus newelli/auricularis/assimilis myrtae BOURNE 1959 as "Puffinus assimilis myrtae" (OD, here)

klecho
● … in the invalid "Hirundo Klecho" HORSFIELD 1821 (1822?) (OD, here)

duivenbodei
● … the hybrid "Paradisaea duivenbodei" MÉNÉGAUX 1913 a k a Duivenbode's Bird of Paradise (OD, here)

benickenii
● … in the invalid "Lestris Benickenii" BREHM 1855 (here)

Tinamulus
● … in the invalid Generic name Tinamulus MACKLOT 1830 as in "Tinamulus virescens" and ditto "paludum" and "decoloratus" … (here)

… and at last; a name unlisted (!?) in the HBW Alive Key, thereby presumably "unseen":

jouchistos
● … in the (for me totally unknown) "Parus jouchistos" HODGSON 1845 (here)

Good luck figuring out those ones as well!!

Björn
x
 
Last edited:
We sure discussed Benicken (i.e. "Uria motzfeldi" BENICKEN 1824) in the Auk tread (Etymology of some Auks), post 34, 35, 39, 42 and 43 ... but at that time only his work (and the Auk he described), not the man himself. Now we know that as well.

Thank´s for enlighten us!

PS. That suddenly also added some info regarding benickii ...
x
 
Last edited:
Calalp said:
PS. That suddenly also added some info regarding benickii ...
Click to expand...
Lestris Benickii Brehm 1824, "Benickes Raubmöve" [OD].
It seems that Brehm changed his mind about Benicken's name between 1824 and 1855, and that he emended his 1824 name to reflect this.
 
Klecho is the Javan name for a kind of tree Culiket, Diospyros malabarica. And a few place names based on the tree? Samber-galeng is I think a place name for the Brother Islands in the Java Sea??
 
Warning! This thread is more than 2 years ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.

Similar threads

Taphrospilus
Hypochera ignestii Moltoni, 1925
Replies
0
Views
404
Taphrospilus
Taphrospilus
Taphrospilus
Hermotimia theresia Salvadori, 1874
Replies
1
Views
491
PScofield
P
Taphrospilus
Melanerpes superciliaris florentinoi (Garrido, 1966) & Contopus caribaeus florentinoi Regalado Ruiz, 1977
Replies
0
Views
494
Taphrospilus
Taphrospilus
Björn Bergenholtz
The Italian name Scardafella
Replies
1
Views
796
James Jobling
J
Björn Bergenholtz
Baron Finot's invalid White-throated Robin
Replies
1
Views
879
l_raty
l_raty

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 2 (members: 0, guests: 2)
Back
Top