Hybrid or Mutation?? (Goose) (1 Viewer)

C

Cinereous

Well-known member

• Nov 7, 2017

• #1

Here's a photo of a goose which was with a group of Canada geese... (taken in the UK)... Is it Barnacle X Canada? Brent X Barnacle? Something else? or an aberrant Barnacle? The later I would expect to part of a flock of Barnacle's.. unless Barnacle's shun aberrant individuals...

 

Attachments

• 
  0A6A0965.JPG

  138.2 KB · Views: 84

Joern Lehmhus

Well-known member

• Nov 7, 2017

• #2

It is an intergeneric hybrid (Anser x Branta) involving Barnacle goose (Black breast!). most likely the other parent is Greylag, allthough this then is one of the rare dark barnacle x greylag crosses. however without furtehr photos i wouldn´t like to exclude other Anser species 100% savely.

This is what Barnacle x Greylag can look like like:
https://waarneming.nl/foto/view/12823223
https://waarneming.nl/foto/view/4574358
https://waarneming.nl/foto/view/924262
https://waarneming.nl/foto/view/611526
https://waarneming.nl/foto/view/3928645

Brent does only extremely rarely hybridize with other species and the long upper-and undertail coverts of suh hhybrids resembling the brent parent give them away.

Canada x barnacle would have sharp borders between white and black in the head pattern and not such a greyish cheek

 

Last edited: Nov 7, 2017

C

Cinereous

Well-known member

• Nov 7, 2017

• #3

Thanks for the reply... It may well be a Greylag X Barnacle.. In pictures 1-4 you can clearly see the Greylag in the bill/feet colour, also the colouration on the back and flanks... Picture 5 looks more Canada X... The bird in my photo is Barnacle size and has black bill & feet (although you can't see the feet).. I can't say I'm convinced it's a Greylag hybrid... I lean more towards Canada.. Thank you for your thoughts..

 

Joern Lehmhus

Well-known member

• Nov 8, 2017

• #4

There is one thing you canbe sure of. it is a Branta x Anser hybrid and due to the black breast the Branta part can only be barnacle goose.

if you have a hybrid barnacle x canada you get such birds in the first generation:

https://waarneming.nl/foto/view/8262697
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-eXz3ygQQgKc/Vm3xw05EbPI/AAAAAAAALWc/LgBhQSh87Pk/s1600/2356.jpg
http://www.animalphotos.me/bird3/goos-barnac_files/hybrid2.jpg

these hybrids barnacle x canada are fertile, so this can split in the F2 (second filial generation) and there are also backcrosses with either parent species , but the birds have always clear white cheek patches.

Backcrosses to barnacle goose are also difficult to separate from Barnacle x cackling goose mixes.

However alone the cheek patch in your bird makes clear second parent is an Anser species.
here is another barnacle x greylag
https://iveneverkilledapipit.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/barnacle-greylag-hybrid.jpg


Here are for example some barnacle x lesser whitefront
http://users.utu.fi/hlehto/photo/hybrid/aeryxbleu1/_D3A5986_osa1.jpg
https://waarneming.nl/foto/view/10220663
https://waarneming.nl/foto/view/644846

 

S

stevethehydra

Well-known member

• Nov 9, 2017

• #5

Definitely Barnacle x Anser sp. I can't find any photos online of that particular combination, but it strikes me that (based on other Barnacle hybrids) Barnacle x Pink-footed might be expected to turn out much like this?

 

Joern Lehmhus

Well-known member

• Nov 10, 2017

• #6

Well, I can´t exclude it as I have neer seen that combination, but I think it is unlikely. Hybrids of Pinkfooted or any of the bean geese seem to be very rare.

Patternwise , but also structurally it fits best to a dark barnacle x greylag in my opinion.

More photos could help to clarify this...

 

S

stevethehydra

Well-known member

• Nov 10, 2017

• #7

Things that made me think of Pinkfoot as a possible parent:
- reported size (Greylag x Barnacle should be notably bigger that a pure Barnacle)
- "long and low" appearance
- fairly dark and uniform plumage
- smallish head (IMO, at least compared to Greylag)
- to me the bill looks vaguely pinkish and reminiscent of what you might get by mixing the Pinkfoot bill pattern with a plain-black-billed parent

But I agree Greylag parentage probably can't be ruled out.

 

Joern Lehmhus

Well-known member

• Nov 10, 2017

• #8

most barnacle x greylag hybrids ae clearly larger than barnacle , but sometimes there are quite small hybrids ... also darkbilled barnacle x greylag, with some pinkish colour shining through on the bill, are possible...
we ´ll never know for sure with that single photo though