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Leica ultravid 8x20 or 10x25 (3 Viewers)

J

Jake_w

New member
Hi All
I'm considering purchasing either the Ultravid 8x20 or 10x25
I want them mostly for general use- hiking etc, having trawled through countless webpages it was clear that the bird watching community are the most erudite, so despite me not being much of a birder I think I'll get the best advice here.
Which pair would you pick for GENERAL travel use? Or maybe I should be looking at another model entirely ( I just love Leica quality from my experience using their cameras, so I feel drawn to a pair of Leica bins!)
Thanking you for any advice
 
Both the 8x20 and the 10x25 with their small exit pupils aren't ideal for astronomy by any means. They're fine for general use though. For the kind of use you outlined I'd probably go for the 8x20. An 8x20 is easier to hold, especially if you aren't a very experienced user, and it's smaller, so you're more likely to actually have your bins with you when you need them.

Makes ... Well, take your pick. Before you shell out the money for a Leica Ultravid I'd have a close look at the Nikon HG myself. Check the threads on compacts here, especially the Nikon forum. The Nikon is very good indeed. I got myself a Nikon 10x25 HG after extensive comparisons because I felt the Leicas weren't significantly better.

Hermann
 
Leica ultravid 8x20 is excellent

Jake_w said:
Hi All
I'm considering purchasing either the Ultravid 8x20 or 10x25
I want them mostly for general use- hiking etc, having trawled through countless webpages it was clear that the bird watching community are the most erudite, so despite me not being much of a birder I think I'll get the best advice here.
Which pair would you pick for GENERAL travel use? Or maybe I should be looking at another model entirely ( I just love Leica quality from my experience using their cameras, so I feel drawn to a pair of Leica bins!)
Thanking you for any advice
Click to expand...

In the "pocket sized bino" category, the Leica ultravid 8x20 is the very best in built quality among all the pocket sized binos now on the market, the most updated pocket little bino. It is also a lot better than the previous "Leica 8x20" models, easier to use, better design and built, a much improved optical clarity. Besides being small the sharpness is the same level with the larger Leicas. I had the "Leica 8x20" binoculars all along, including the current version of "Leica ultravid 8x20". In comparison to other makes of the same size, I feel it is the best, particularly much better than the Swaro 8x20, while the Swaro 8x20 is in the same price level. The new "Leica ultravid 8x20 & 10x25" are also the same as it's bigger brothers - 5 meter water resistance, maybe the only one in pocket-sized category.
 
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Thanks for your replies/advice!
After a little more research I realise that astronomy bins are more specialist, so I'll stick to a quest for a more general use pair.
 
Jake_w said:
Thanks for your replies/advice!
After a little more research I realise that astronomy bins are more specialist, so I'll stick to a quest for a more general use pair.
Click to expand...

I've been through most except the Swarovski - Leica Ultravid, Nikon HGL, Zeiss Victory 8x20 (and Bushnell Elite 7x26, as well as various other "reverse-porros). For birding, I came back to the Leica Ultravid 8x20 for all the reasons in posts above, and compactness/weight. However, for general use, you could save yourself a lot of dosh, as the optical differences are minimal. The Nikon HGL give superb views, as do the Zeiss, although for me, the latter showed too much flare for birding when looking up in tree-tops. If price isn't too much of an issue, the Leicas will give the best views coupled with easiest focusser and tiniest size, but do try the others if at all possible. On the subject of 8x v. 10x, I can't help, as I prefer 8x for the greater brightness and field of view. But I did once look through a friend's Ultravid 10x25 and was very impressed.
 
Jake_w said:
Hi All
I'm considering purchasing either the Ultravid 8x20 or 10x25
I want them mostly for general use- hiking etc, having trawled through countless webpages it was clear that the bird watching community are the most erudite, so despite me not being much of a birder I think I'll get the best advice here.
Which pair would you pick for GENERAL travel use? Or maybe I should be looking at another model entirely ( I just love Leica quality from my experience using their cameras, so I feel drawn to a pair of Leica bins!)
Thanking you for any advice
Click to expand...

I have had most of the compacts and here is what to get and where to get it. For one thing the 10x25's and 8x25's are better than the 8x20's. The extra 5mm of aperture makes a difference in compacts when you have such a small aperture any way especially in dim light due to their superior twilight factor 15.8(10x25) versus 12.6(8x20) and the Nikon LX 10x25 is as good as any and alot cheaper than the Ultravid. $299.95 for the Demo at Cameraland. I here that the Olympus Tracker 8x25 is as good optically as the Ultravid but not waterproof and you can get them on that famous auction site for $50.00. It's another case of the cheap porro being as good as the alpha roof just like the Nikon 8x30 EII being as good as the Zeiss 8x32 FL. I have an Olympus tracker ordered so I will write a review when I receive them. They have 5 star reviews on Amazon though.

http://www.cameralandny.com/optics/nikon.pl?page=nikon7507

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/New-Olympus-8...phy_Binoculars_Monoculars&hash=item43a62e8c69

[http://www.amazon.co.uk/product-rev...e=UTF8&showViewpoints=1&qid=1303689698&sr=8-1

http://www.birdwatching.com/optics/pockets_reviews.html
 
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[email protected] said:
I here that the Olympus Tracker 8x25 is as good optically as the Ultravid but not waterproof and you can get them on that famous auction site for $50.00. It's another case of the cheap porro being as good as the alpha roof just like the Nikon 8x30 EII being as good as the Zeiss 8x32 FL. I have an Olympus tracker ordered so I will write a review when I receive them. They have 5 star reviews on Amazon though.
Click to expand...

Dennis
While I have the 8x25 Olympus Trackers, I certainly would not rank them with the alphas as others have. But they are a very nice little reverse porro, so it will be intersting to see your take on them,

tom
 
I was considering buying the Leica Ultravid 8x20 until I saw and looked through the Ultravid 8x32.
This is an amazingly compact and light weight mid sized binocular weighing just 560 grams. The smallest of the mid sized alpha binoculars. It is in a different league to the smaller compacts.
The engineering build is outstanding and the quality of the image that it produces is phenomenal, sharp, bright, breathtaking.
Don't pick it up if you are easily tempted and susceptible to beauty - you will be seduced.
 
Vivian Darkbloom said:
I was considering buying the Leica Ultravid 8x20 until I saw and looked through the Ultravid 8x32.
This is an amazingly compact and light weight mid sized binocular weighing just 560 grams. The smallest of the mid sized alpha binoculars. It is in a different league to the smaller compacts.
The engineering build is outstanding and the quality of the image that it produces is phenomenal, sharp, bright, breathtaking.
Don't pick it up if you are easily tempted and susceptible to beauty - you will be seduced.
Click to expand...

Ha,Ha! You can't compare a 32mm to a 20mm. There is NO comparison! Any 32mm is way better than a 20mm optically.
 
lilcrazy2 said:
Dennis
While I have the 8x25 Olympus Trackers, I certainly would not rank them with the alphas as others have. But they are a very nice little reverse porro, so it will be intersting to see your take on them,

tom
Click to expand...

I got them for $15.00 shipped because I had an auction site bonus bucks! So not much loss if they aren't any good.
 
Vivian Darkbloom said:
I was considering buying the Leica Ultravid 8x20 until I saw and looked through the Ultravid 8x32.
This is an amazingly compact and light weight mid sized binocular weighing just 560 grams. The smallest of the mid sized alpha binoculars. It is in a different league to the smaller compacts.
The engineering build is outstanding and the quality of the image that it produces is phenomenal, sharp, bright, breathtaking.
Don't pick it up if you are easily tempted and susceptible to beauty - you will be seduced.
Click to expand...

I know what you mean by seduced. I picked up a Swarovision 8.5x42 and it was all over. Don't look through one unless you can afford it.
 
lilcrazy2 said:
Dennis
While I have the 8x25 Olympus Trackers, I certainly would not rank them with the alphas as others have. But they are a very nice little reverse porro, so it will be intersting to see your take on them,

tom
Click to expand...

Optically, the Olympus is nearly identical to the Leica as far as I can tell. The Leica has better glare control; otherwise you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference. The exit pupil on the Olympus is bigger, and easier to view. Now, aside from optics, sure the Leica is nicer. It has a locking diopter, it's waterproof, it's ridiculously cute, etc. But for just looking at stuff, I could be happy with either. If I had had the Olympus next to the Leica at the store I might have saved my money, told my wife to pick a restaurant and a Broadway show, my treat.

But once you have the little Leica, you won't want to part with it. It's a suave little thing, wonderfully engineered. When I travel with them, I do tend to worry about losing them (I've been known to leave stuff behind in restaurants and such). Obviously, the Olympus is less worrisome.

Mark
 
Since you inquired about concerts I can state that my older 8 x 20 Leica Trinovids were (and still are) excellent for indoor concerts and operas. The 8 x 20 Ultravid will be even better I'm sure. If you are considering out door concerts from larger arenas a 10 x 25 might be better if you are far back. The 8 x 20's are quite compact and fit easily into jacket and sport coat pockets. Reverse porro's and 10 x 25's are more bulky.

I now prefer my new Nikon 10 x 25 Premier binocular as a compact binocular for overall general use. Although it has double hinges it is designed so the binocular can be used in a single hinge fashion, either with the left hand or the right hand. Alexis has explained the technique in the past. If one is right handed, open the right barrel all the way, put it up to your right eye and then adjust the left barrel to the left eye. This speeds up finding one's IPD. The 8 x 20 version works the same way. The focusing knob is in the front and one's ring finger must be used to focus it.

Bob
 
I use both the Nikon and Ultravid on lunch time walks at work Mon to Friday, bicycling and on other occasions I can’t or don’t want to bring a larger bin. I spend half my time using the Ultravid 10x25. The other half of the time I use Nikon 10X25 Premier LXL.

I like them both but prefer the Ultravid a little more (not enough to stop me from using the Nikon which cost far less and is excellent too). Its just a personal prefrence.

I have used both at indoor events like concerts. I have had some great views of the moon using the 10X25. You are not going to see the rings of Saturn with a 10x25 as you might with a 10X42 under favorable conditions.

Life is too short and I would miss way too many fantastic birding opportunities if I did not own these small but useable binoculars.

It should be obvious there are some compromises made for the small size of a 10x25 when compared to performance of a full size binocular. But extreme portability is one compromize you dont have to make with these little wonders. When it comes to small size the Nikon Ultravid and Zeiss are the top picks (that I am aware of, there may be others). Pick one and you wont be saying "if only I had taken my binoculars".

Some people don't like these small bins but for for those who do - they are great!

As always try before you buy!

Good Birding
 
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Jake,

Have you ever used a compact roof bin before?

Certainly, you'd find the top o' the line engineering on the Leica compacts as you do Leica cameras. But with cameras, you don't have to worry about holding them steady.

Compacts can be hard to hold, particularly if you have BIG hands. Not much to grip and not much weight to dampen vibrations.

Also, despite the high quality and the WPing down to 20,000 leagues, compacts are one area of optics where you can still get as good or nearly as good optical quality in a reverse porro such as a Bushnell 7x26 Elite, costing hundreds of dollars less.

Some would disagree, but read this compact bin primer (old article, but the basic ideas still apply):

http://www.betterviewdesired.com/compact-binoculars-bvd.php#The%20Big%20Plus

Second piece of advice is forget about 10x for hiking. Even if you can hold 10x fairly steady, a 10x compact is harder to hold steady for reasons outlined above and after walking up a steep hill, you are in no condition to use a 10x bin without stabilization. Holding 8x will be hard enough until your heart rate drops and your arm muscles relax. So for your application, a 7x or 8x is recommended.

Compacts have small exit pupils (size of light cone coming through the EPs), and the finicky eye placement this causes can be fatiguing to use for long periods, particularly since you live in sunny old England where your eyes' entrance pupils are going to exceed the compact's exit pupils on many days of the year.

My personal preference for a hiking bin is a lightweight 8x32. Unless you're packing camping gear or lots of camera equipment, don't skimp on aperture and exit pupil size to save on weight.

Since you prefer Leica, and you have deep enough pockets to own Leica cameras, consider using the 8x32 Ultravid as your hiking bin. It's only 19 oz., it has a much wider FOV than the compact, and when you're not hiking it's a bin you can use all year round for birding and general use.

Brock
 
I have the 10x25 Ultras, and am contemplating getting the 8x20 Ultras in a few weeks. For your purposes, the 8's would be best. The 10's are good for longer range birding, but they can be a little shaky, and the field of view is smaller, because of their higher magnification. The 8's have a wider field of view, a better close focus (7' v. 10'), and are compact enough to fit in a shirt pocket (the 10's are a little too long for that).
The improvements of the new Ultras over the previous Trinovids are most noticeable in the compact line. The focus knob that juts out from the center is much easier to use than the old knob (although not quite as compact). Eye relief has been improved. The image is brighter and flatter. Close focus distances are excellent. No other premium brand has improved their compacts like Leica has, and to me they are the best you can get.
 
Kammerdiner said:
Optically, the Olympus is nearly identical to the Leica as far as I can tell. The Leica has better glare control; otherwise you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference. The exit pupil on the Olympus is bigger, and easier to view. Now, aside from optics, sure the Leica is nicer. It has a locking diopter, it's waterproof, it's ridiculously cute, etc. But for just looking at stuff, I could be happy with either. If I had had the Olympus next to the Leica at the store I might have saved my money, told my wife to pick a restaurant and a Broadway show, my treat.

But once you have the little Leica, you won't want to part with it. It's a suave little thing, wonderfully engineered. When I travel with them, I do tend to worry about losing them (I've been known to leave stuff behind in restaurants and such). Obviously, the Olympus is less worrisome.

Mark
Click to expand...

I got the Olympus Tracker 8x25 today and I have to agree with you Kammerdiner they are amazing little binoculars. Every bit as good and better in some ways than the alpha roofs. I have had just about all the alpha roofs at one time or another and you are right these are as good optically as any of them and better in these ways. They are brighter because of the 25mm aperture and the fact that they are a porro they transmit more light. Also, as you say eye placement is much less fidgity with the bigger 3mm exit pupil versus the 2.5mm in the 8x20 alphas. I bought a pair of Leica Ultravids 8x20's on E-bay once for $400.00 new and to be truthful I only kept them a few days because I had so many blackouts and eye placement was so difficult on them. The Olympus Trackers remind me of the Nikon EII in ways because it is as good or better than much more expensive compact alpha roofs. Another porro that slays the big name roofs. I find they fit my hands better than the tiny Leica Ultravids too. The focus is smoother than the Ultravid and roll-up eyecups work as good as the alphas and lock in place perfectly. It comes with a nice little case which attaches to your belt and a nice strap and eyepiece covers. You really don't need objective covers because the objective lenses are inset pretty deeply. One big advantage over the alpha roofs is the startling 3D images the porro gives you and they have amazing DOF for such an inexpensive glass. Like you say you don't have to worry about them like you do your $600.00 Ultravids either and for that reason they get more use. The edge sharpness is very good too in fact it is remarkable. Overall a very good compact and one of the best I have seen regardless of price. I was comparing them to my Swarovision's 8.5x42 at sunset and I know that is not a fair comparison! But I will tell you the little suckers held there own. Amazing little binoculars and I highly recommend them.
 
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Reverse porro compacts can be real gems. I bought a 6.5x21 Pentax Papilio last week and it's rapidly becoming my only binocular to take along in daytime. They are amazingly sharp, and even with 6.5x magnification they outperform my Zeiss 10x40 BT*'s in sharpness and detail recognision. I can hold them as steady as my stabilized Canon 10x30 IS but they are way sharper than these, too. They fit in my hands perfectly, they're quick and easy to use thanks to the 3.2 mm exit pupil, and have a 131 m FOV. The image is amazing, bright and beautiful. Plus they weigh only 300 grams, which is especially nice if you have them around your neck for a full day.
It's just sheer pleasure using them, and I'm no longer considering buying an alpha compact in the future. I will in fact look for a waterproof reverse porro compact. The Papilio's are dustproof with an optical, coated window in front of the moving objective lenses, but not really waterproof.
Since I have these, I feel reluctant to use my other, full sized bins as I can now see how much CA those have. The 18x50 Canon IS will show more detail, but the CA is terrible with IS on. The 10x30 Canon is better in this respect, but not nearly as sharp as the little Pentax, and the Zeiss, well, it's not phasecoated and the relaxed view is now becoming annoying for lack of sharpness.
Best of all, the Papilio's focus down to 45 cm, and they go almost half a turn over infinity, a truly impressive range.

The depth of field is excellent, but the 3D-effect must come from that, not from the placing of the objectives, that would be illogical since the objectives are set closer together than in a roof, let alone a normal porro with wide spaced objectives.

I had an Olympus 8x25 years back, but I forgot which model, that was very nice but not nearly as good as the Pentax 6.5x21.

Too bad the reverse porro's don't get bigger than 30mm, I'd love to see a 7x30 or 8x30 that is tough and fully waterproof. With internal focusing this shouldn't be too difficult to make. Those would be outstanding for all-round use IMHO.

Best regards,

Ronald
 
KorHaan said:
Reverse porro compacts can be real gems. I bought a 6.5x21 Pentax Papilio last week and it's rapidly becoming my only binocular to take along in daytime. They are amazingly sharp, and even with 6.5x magnification they outperform my Zeiss 10x40 BT*'s in sharpness and detail recognision. I can hold them as steady as my stabilized Canon 10x30 IS but they are way sharper than these, too. They fit in my hands perfectly, they're quick and easy to use thanks to the 3.2 mm exit pupil, and have a 131 m FOV. The image is amazing, bright and beautiful. Plus they weigh only 300 grams, which is especially nice if you have them around your neck for a full day.
It's just sheer pleasure using them, and I'm no longer considering buying an alpha compact in the future. I will in fact look for a waterproof reverse porro compact. The Papilio's are dustproof with an optical, coated window in front of the moving objective lenses, but not really waterproof.
Since I have these, I feel reluctant to use my other, full sized bins as I can now see how much CA those have. The 18x50 Canon IS will show more detail, but the CA is terrible with IS on. The 10x30 Canon is better in this respect, but not nearly as sharp as the little Pentax, and the Zeiss, well, it's not phasecoated and the relaxed view is now becoming annoying for lack of sharpness.
Best of all, the Papilio's focus down to 45 cm, and they go almost half a turn over infinity, a truly impressive range.

The depth of field is excellent, but the 3D-effect must come from that, not from the placing of the objectives, that would be illogical since the objectives are set closer together than in a roof, let alone a normal porro with wide spaced objectives.

I had an Olympus 8x25 years back, but I forgot which model, that was very nice but not nearly as good as the Pentax 6.5x21.

Too bad the reverse porro's don't get bigger than 30mm, I'd love to see a 7x30 or 8x30 that is tough and fully waterproof. With internal focusing this shouldn't be too difficult to make. Those would be outstanding for all-round use IMHO.

Best regards,

Ronald
Click to expand...

It's funny how you always discover something new. You woudn't think 21mm of aperture would do much but coupled with only 6.5x it gives you a nice 3.2mm exit pupil and as you say 131m FOV and with a reverse porro which is a simple optical system and cheap to build and hard to screw up it gives you great sharp bright images. How are they at distance or are you just using them for close in birds. I know you did a lot of long distance ID's with your big Canon's. Do they work at all at for that? Does anybody know of a good waterproof reverse porro compact? I think you are right in that they don't make them in to big of an aperture like a 30mm. I am really impressed with the Olympus. Of course I have always preferred their cameras for their high quality lenses. Korhaan that Papilio 6.5x21 is quite a change from your Canon 18x50 IS's isn't it? I bet your arms appreciate it! Next to the huge Canon's the Papilio probably looks like it's baby! HaHa! I ordered a pair of the Papillo 6.5x21's from Amazon. I will let you know if I like them.
 
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