Join for FREE
It only takes a minute!
Zeiss - Always on the lookout for something special – Shop now

Welcome to BirdForum.
BirdForum is the net's largest birding community, dedicated to wild birds and birding, and is absolutely FREE! You are most welcome to register for an account, which allows you to take part in lively discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.

Peregrines, a juvenile? southeast Sicily

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old Wednesday 13th June 2018, 18:20   #1
Kinthissa
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Lunigiana Italy
Posts: 319
Peregrines, a juvenile? southeast Sicily

Cava d'Ispica, 3 June

calls coming from cliff-face and all around the canyon, at first i was not sure the birds in flight were Peregrines as they seemed smaller and lighter than i'd seen previously, but the proportions indicated a kind of Peregrine

i'm thinking the bird in no.2 may be an adult, and nos. 1 and 3 show a juvenile. not sure about no. 5. I would be grateful for help.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400721.jpg
Views:	47
Size:	77.6 KB
ID:	665879  Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400728.jpg
Views:	30
Size:	63.1 KB
ID:	665880  Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400734.jpg
Views:	35
Size:	93.6 KB
ID:	665881  Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400777.jpg
Views:	97
Size:	88.3 KB
ID:	665882  Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400790.jpg
Views:	32
Size:	77.9 KB
ID:	665883  

Kinthissa is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 13th June 2018, 18:22   #2
Kinthissa
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Lunigiana Italy
Posts: 319
no.6 : there are apparently clear white areas in the underwing (not evenly barred), could you help me understand what i'm seeing?

any idea which subspecies they might be, are these ssp. brookei? after discovering the complexities of identifying (common) buzzards, i now see 'peregrine' is also not straightforward
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400760.jpg
Views:	59
Size:	78.6 KB
ID:	665884  
Kinthissa is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 13th June 2018, 19:32   #3
tconzemi
Tom
BF Supporter 2018
 
tconzemi's Avatar

 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Luxembourg
Posts: 4,960
they are all juvenile Peregrines and thus of the local brookei subspecies
the white areas in the wing are just reflections
not all adult brookei are easy to identify as so often with subspecies there is a broad overlap and it is even more difficult in juveniles
__________________
Tom
tconzemi is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 13th June 2018, 20:03   #4
Kinthissa
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Lunigiana Italy
Posts: 319
Thank you for id, Tom, and what you say is very helpful.

I'm puzzled that all the photos I have of a solo bird in flight were of a juvenile.

Is it possible to tell if at least one of the 3 birds in photo no.4 is an adult? after I took this snap, one got fed.
Kinthissa is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 13th June 2018, 20:14   #5
tconzemi
Tom
BF Supporter 2018
 
tconzemi's Avatar

 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Luxembourg
Posts: 4,960
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kinthissa View Post
Is it possible to tell if at least one of the 3 birds in photo no.4 is an adult? after I took this snap, one got fed.
really difficult, my guess would be the middle bird but far from sure
__________________
Tom
tconzemi is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 13th June 2018, 21:06   #6
Kinthissa
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Lunigiana Italy
Posts: 319
That's kind of you to have another look, thank you, Tom.
Kinthissa is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 13th June 2018, 22:48   #7
Deb Burhinus
Registered User

 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Norfolk
Posts: 245
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kinthissa View Post
I'm puzzled that all the photos I have of a solo bird in flight were of a juvenile.
When the fledgings are this age, the parents spend long periods away from the scrape (although one parent or both will watch from short distance and either parent will return just to make food drops) and the ‘practice flights’ of the fledglings will be all be in the vicinity of the scrape. So it’s not surprising to often see just the juveniles flying around the nest site.

From a clutch size of up to 5 (depending on egg viability and chick mortality), there could be anything up to 2-3 days between the first fledge and the last, (which is a long time at this stage of rapid development!), it’s quite possible one or two of the chicks still need to be fed from the prey item to ensure it’s getting a share while they are practicing their launching (even though they will all be able to eat from whole prey items on their own at this stage) so if you saw a chick being fed, one of the birds (the middle one?) may well be one of the adults.

Hopefully this creates a little context for the series of photos!
Deb Burhinus is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 14th June 2018, 13:51   #8
Kinthissa
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Lunigiana Italy
Posts: 319
Thank you, Deb. I figured the young ones stole the show and I snapped only them in the foreground. There were pleading calls from the cliff-face, also from the trees low down, so likely there were others apart from the two careering around.

photo 4 atop a cliff (my opening post): the one in the air got fed once it landed, by the bird in the middle; the middle one then flew off - this bird looks more bulky in the little video-clip I got. so I think Tom worked it out right and the middle one was the adult.

On the way out of the canyon 50 minutes later (at some 2km distance from where I took the above pix), there was a falcon which I took to be one of the Peregrines. Thick-bodied, pale and short-tailed in the first photo, but the other pix show a longer tail (I remember seeing only one bird). Paleness likely to be due to poor photography. Just thought I'd check : is the moustache more narrow and pointed than Peregrine? I'd like the experts to tell me that it is a bulky adult female Peregrine, not another falcon!

Am I right in thinking Peregrines have thicker/more robust bodies and more blunt tails than Saker and Lanner falcons?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400813.jpg
Views:	6
Size:	72.1 KB
ID:	665967  Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400814.jpg
Views:	6
Size:	66.1 KB
ID:	665968  Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400815.jpg
Views:	4
Size:	65.0 KB
ID:	665969  Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400816.jpg
Views:	5
Size:	70.3 KB
ID:	665970  Click image for larger version

Name:	p1400817.jpg
Views:	9
Size:	67.4 KB
ID:	665971  

Kinthissa is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 14th June 2018, 14:47   #9
tconzemi
Tom
BF Supporter 2018
 
tconzemi's Avatar

 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Luxembourg
Posts: 4,960
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kinthissa View Post
there was a falcon which I took to be one of the Peregrines. Thick-bodied, pale and short-tailed in the first photo, but the other pix show a longer tail (I remember seeing only one bird). Paleness likely to be due to poor photography. Just thought I'd check : is the moustache more narrow and pointed than Peregrine? I'd like the experts to tell me that it is a bulky adult female Peregrine, not another falcon!

Am I right in thinking Peregrines have thicker/more robust bodies and more blunt tails than Saker and Lanner falcons?
first you are right about Saker and Lanner, and the bird is a juvenile Peregrine with short tail (looking even shorter like in pic 1 under certain angles) aged by very broad white tip of tail. And yes nobody else shows such a bold moustache as a Peregrine
__________________
Tom
tconzemi is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 14th June 2018, 15:24   #10
Kinthissa
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Lunigiana Italy
Posts: 319
It's good to clear that one, Tom, thank you! funny how I was not seeing what was before me in these photos : clean perfect feathering, even all around, with that immaculate white end to the tail ~ because I thought it was time to find an adult Peregrine! amazingly stout-bodied, a juvenile.

soon I want to try and tackle the pointers you gave a while ago for differentiating between Lesser and Common Kestrels.
Kinthissa is offline  
Reply With Quote
Advertisement
Reply


Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Marsh harriers? southeast Sicily Kinthissa Bird Identification Q&A 3 Wednesday 13th June 2018 08:24
Short-toed eagle, juvenile? Marettimo Sicily Kinthissa Bird Identification Q&A 4 Friday 3rd November 2017 14:21
dark Booted Eagle, juvenile? Marettimo Sicily Kinthissa Bird Identification Q&A 6 Sunday 29th October 2017 21:39
juvenile Black Storks and HB? Marettimo Sicily Kinthissa Bird Identification Q&A 0 Monday 2nd October 2017 14:24
Black storks, adult and juvenile? Marettimo Sicily Kinthissa Bird Identification Q&A 7 Tuesday 26th September 2017 13:40



Fatbirder's Top 1000 Birding Websites

Help support BirdForum

Page generated in 0.15686107 seconds with 23 queries
All times are GMT. The time now is 09:51.