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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

x32 SF: the waiting begins (1 Viewer)

Thats a very devious way to influence product development at Zeiss Tom :king:

Lee


Lee, yes!

A friend told me long ago that the moment you buy a good piece of kit you must stop looking at magazines, press releases, advertising, as something else is bound to be released the day after!

Tom
 
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That's not the way Murphy's law works. You can't clean windows to make it rain. You can't buy FL either, so there's finally an SF.
 
I would wager that Zeiss will find a way to update and improve the optical performance when they design the 8x32 SF without significantly increasing it's size. Size and weight are obviously really important on a 32mm because that is one of the big reasons people are buying them over a 42mm. I think you expect a slight decrease in performance with the smaller aperture. It will be interesting to see if they can achieve any improvements in balance in the smaller frame 32mm like they did with the 42mm. That will be a challenge.

I don't know about that. Zeiss have small 8x covered well with the 8x25 Victory Pocket and the 8x32 Conquest. The binocular that is probably Zeiss's main competition in the alpha 8x class (Swarovski's 8x32 SV FP) is also fairly large for an 8x32, so IF an 8x32 SF comes out, I'd expect it to be bigger, but offer more field of view. The two hallmarks of the SF concept are ergonomics/balance and field of view, not compactness/small size. If a putative SF 8x32 is going to offer a meaningful increase in field of view over the current 8x32 FL (to, say, 150m - the same field of view as the Oberkochen era 8x30 porro - or a bit more) that will require larger prisms and a larger binocular to go with it. A larger binocular would also allow more space to position the focus wheel similarly to the existing SF models.
 
I don't know about that. Zeiss have small 8x covered well with the 8x25 Victory Pocket and the 8x32 Conquest. The binocular that is probably Zeiss's main competition in the alpha 8x class (Swarovski's 8x32 SV FP) is also fairly large for an 8x32, so IF an 8x32 SF comes out, I'd expect it to be bigger, but offer more field of view. The two hallmarks of the SF concept are ergonomics/balance and field of view, not compactness/small size. If a putative SF 8x32 is going to offer a meaningful increase in field of view over the current 8x32 FL (to, say, 150m - the same field of view as the Oberkochen era 8x30 porro - or a bit more) that will require larger prisms and a larger binocular to go with it. A larger binocular would also allow more space to position the focus wheel similarly to the existing SF models.
Hello Patudo,

Are you writing that to improve the 8x32FL with larger FOV, they might have to increase weight and size, compensating with improved ergonomics? Is that a winning trade off for most 8x32mm users?

I understand that all binocular designs are compromises, which Zeiss recognised when it introduced the FL, and improvement over the ClassiC 8x30 in ruggedness and in optics. The FL was waterproof, controlled chromatic aberrations better, provided more light transmission with a slightly larger objective and improved coating, while still maintaining decent eye relief for those who wear spectacles. The same physical realities of an 8.5º FOV apply today as they did fifteen years, ago.

My guess is that Zeiss has spent much time and much effort on focus groups and on surveys to determine what could be marketable. My second guess is that the binocular may be designated 'SF,' but it won't be a scaled down 8x42 SF. The 8x30mm Classic did not have the same design as the 7x42 and 8x56; the 8x32 FL did not have the same design as the 7x42 and 8x42 FL's. Zeiss may be thinking outside the box. Actually, I hope that may be thinking about something rather different from the SF binoculars.

Happy bird watching,
Arthur :hi:
 
One thing to bear in mind is that i suspect Zeiss surprised a lot of folks with the amazing Victory Pocket 8x25; imagine that scaled up to 32mm with an even wider FoV and better ER. They may be coming up in size, not coming down from the 42mm SF. Ok, the CA control is not quite as good in the Pocket, but the inclusion of HT glass may help....
 
Surely, on a cosmetically based theme, it has to be an open double bridge design in black, with the same focusing system, eyecups, balance and feel.
 
Surely, on a cosmetically based theme, it has to be an open double bridge design in black, with the same focusing system, eyecups, balance and feel.

To keep the family resemblance, yes, but I am hoping for better eyecups and note that SF42 has three bridges not two, which I also hope will feature on SF32.

Lee
 
To keep the family resemblance, yes, but I am hoping for better eyecups and note that SF42 has three bridges not two, which I also hope will feature on SF32.

Lee

So is it going to be a design to keep in line with the "family"? Or should emphasis be on ergonomics? Considering the compact size of the present x32 FL models, I think open bridges will not really fill the bill.
 
So is it going to be a design to keep in line with the "family"? Or should emphasis be on ergonomics? Considering the compact size of the present x32 FL models, I think open bridges will not really fill the bill.

This is pure speculation of course because we have no hint from Zeiss as to whether they will favour an open hinge or not. In fact we only have the barest info that there will even be an SF32 at all.

But addressing your point Robert, which is absolutely valid, choosing between open hinge and closed will depend on which part of 'ergonomics' they consider most important. Will it be handling they prioritise or size?

When I slide three fingers around the barrel of an SF42, just under the second bridge, my first finger falls directly on the focus wheel without having to bend my finger or shuffle my hand position. For me, this is excellent ergonomics, and if it could be duplicated on a 32mm bino, without (and this is your point) making it too large, then this could be a desirable feature.

Opticron's open hinge Savanna 32mm is only 10mm longer than FL32 and Ultravid32. Is this 10mm too much or does it depend on how nicely the bino functions in the hand? And of course the question of weight plays a part in this balancing act.

The leading question here is how large is too large?

And I cheerfully admit to a confusing conflict of opinion in my own mind about the overall question here because I do love the handling and feel of, for example, Meopta's closed hinge MeoStar 8x32.

Lee
 
Hi Lee,

I was actually hoping you could get some more 'hard' info about the development of the SF 32:
1. Will Zeiss develop one?
2. If so, how far are they in the process?
3. If so, do they have a (vague) planning to bring it to the market?

;)
 
Hi Lee,

I was actually hoping you could get some more 'hard' info about the development of the SF 32:
1. Will Zeiss develop one?
2. If so, how far are they in the process?
3. If so, do they have a (vague) planning to bring it to the market?

;)

Temmie

Who needs Zeiss when we have CJ?

Lee
 
Lol ! :-O All I am permitted to say is that anyone hankering for a triple bridge 32mm SF is wishing for a bridge too far ...... 3:)


Interesting snippets from the vault ...... from 2014 no less! :)
https://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?p=3729812#post3729812 ..... search for 32mm, or 32SF, etc
I agree... Nice to have a large FOV.....Without distortion preferably, otherwise,, whats the point??

When I spoke to Dr Dobbler at Birdfair, we discussed a future 8x32 SF with a fov of over 150m and a 10x32 of 130m plus....


Cheers Tim

Yes, In my conversation, I asked if there would be a 32mm SF version with a greater fov than 150m plus for the 8x and 130m for the 10x. He confirmed this....

There was no time frame attached to these models release though sadly. But I think it would be a fair guess thats its goin be 2016 or
sooner.

Cheers Tim

At this rate I think it will be a race between Brexit and the 32mm SF to see which one gets here first ...... ! :cat:




Chosun :gh:
 
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Naughty CJ!

I now see that a 3 point bridge couldn't be squeezed in to keep the focusing wheel in position and allow your fingers to be wrapped around the tubes / barrels. What a task for the designers but maybe that is why the Swaro 32 ELs work so well. I still love my Zeiss 8 x 32 FL for handling and image.

Stop teasing young lady.

P
 
Naughty CJ!

I now see that a 3 point bridge couldn't be squeezed in to keep the focusing wheel in position and allow your fingers to be wrapped around the tubes / barrels. What a task for the designers but maybe that is why the Swaro 32 ELs work so well. I still love my Zeiss 8 x 32 FL for handling and image.

Stop teasing young lady.

P

* Honestly, it's not an either / or question .... and it's not rocket science ....
* There's what - half a billion plus more people on the planet than when the speculating kicked off .... so the market is hardly shrinking ....
* Plenty of people like the form factor of the x32 FL ..... so just fill it full of HT glass
* Plenty of people love the Swarovski SV and I don't think I've ever heard of anyone dissing the ×32's handling .....
* Since the advent of the Nikon MHG a 32mm SF form factor chooses itself :t: :)



Chosun :gh:
 
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