• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Ringtail Harrier UK (1 Viewer)

mr.p

not of this world
I know there are a few raptor experts out there. Is it possible to identify the attached with certainty from this image?

Southern England early June.

Thanks,
mr.p
 

Attachments

  • DSCN5708 (4).JPG
    DSCN5708 (4).JPG
    100.6 KB · Views: 389
Tricky commenting on photos of this quality, but my impression is of slim-winged harrier with a long hand. On the second image, the white rump looks narrow and rectangular rather than squarish and the tail appears flimsy and pinched. In all the photos the wingtip seems to consist of three rather than four primaries. Are there more images?
 
Wing formula (assuming at least outer primaries intact) looks much better for Monty’s over Hen to me. Pale bases to obviously barred primaries, limited baring on the secondaries and little contrast between primaries and secondaries (cf possible pallid) also pro Monty but very hard to be sure on less than clear images of underwing imo and with molting adults and transitional plumages thrown in ... but wrong shape for HH
 
Last edited:
I'd have thought that early June for a Hen Harrier in Southern England would be exceptional ?

Cheers
 
Thanks all.

Fwiw field Id wasMonties.

I was interested whether the photos alone could be used for positive identification, but it seems they are too poor from the comments here.

All three ringtails are candidates where this was photographed, all would be a very good record in June.

Was hoping Tom might comment as he usually posts on raptor pix...

Mr.p
 
Thanks all.

Fwiw field Id wasMonties.

I was interested whether the photos alone could be used for positive identification, but it seems they are too poor from the comments here.

All three ringtails are candidates where this was photographed, all would be a very good record in June.

Was hoping Tom might comment as he usually posts on raptor pix...

Mr.p

skbirder said it all, nothing to add
 
Tricky commenting on photos of this quality, but my impression is of slim-winged harrier with a long hand. On the second image, the white rump looks narrow and rectangular rather than squarish and the tail appears flimsy and pinched. In all the photos the wingtip seems to consist of three rather than four primaries.

Montagu's is indeed the likely bet here, but whether Pallid can safely be excluded is another matter...

yes, really perfect analyse, not a Hen
 
Without a clear image of underwing and head pattern, it’s very difficult is it not, to age accurately and therefore separate Pallids from Montagu’s ringtails just on structure from poor photo images? which was the point I was trying to make! It was always going to be either Pallid or Monty so previous comments on structure were a given! (and my post was also in response to the previous IDs of Hen in order to rule that out, which I thought I had but maybe not clear enough in my post? )

Anyway, both your posts directed at me now come across as rather dismissive. There are some very interesting dynamics on the ID forums!
 
Without a clear image of underwing and head pattern, it’s very difficult is it not, to age accurately and therefore separate Pallids from Montagu’s ringtails just on structure from poor photo images? which was the point I was trying to make! It was always going to be either Pallid or Monty so previous comments on structure were a given! (and my post was also in response to the previous IDs of Hen in order to rule that out, which I thought I had but maybe not clear enough in my post? )

Anyway, both your posts directed at me now come across as rather dismissive. There are some very interesting dynamics on the ID forums!

Sorry Deb, skbirder was the first to point out it was not a Hen, your analyse was even more precise. I'm rather inactive at the forum right now and just scrolling through... Sorry if you feel disregarded, really not my intention.
 
No worries Tom - ;) and the ob skbirder made on the length of the hand in relation to the arm was probably the most helpful in making a cf to Pallid
 
Warning! This thread is more than 6 years ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top