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Kite Optics Lynx HD+

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Old Wednesday 31st July 2019, 11:24   #26
BryanP
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https://www.kiteoptics.com/en/nature/dealers/canada/
Andy,
According to this link there are no dealers in the United States but it does show 6 Canadian dealers so there's that.
Of the 6 I've only ever had dealings with Markarian Optics in Vancouver. They don't seem to reply to email or the contact form on their own website so one would have to call them.
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Old Wednesday 31st July 2019, 20:34   #27
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Bryan,

Thanks for the info, much appreciated...perhaps as they hit the market we will find out more about durability, and in the future, perhaps they will sell them in the US.
I take it you are enjoying the weather and the ocean down there.

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Old Wednesday 31st July 2019, 21:41   #28
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Andy
No worries, I was a wee bit curious myself. I am enjoying the weather and ocean but here in Nova Scotia and not Costa Rica as my location suggests. I won't be back in Costa Rica till November but I promise to change the location in my settings before then ;-)

Canip, thank you for your brief look at the 8x42 HD+. I have no experience or knowledge of Kite so It really helps with assessing the whole HD+ range. Colour me curious at this point.

Does it seems to folks here that Kite is positioning the 8x30 HD+ to go after the Nikon HG 8x30? The price on the website for the new Kite 8x30 is 575 Euros which seems to be designed to undercut the HG 8x30 but is more expensive than the M7 8x30. Certainly there are some interesting 8x30 choices these days so its nice to see the new Kites thrown into the mix.

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Old Thursday 1st August 2019, 06:05   #29
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The reins of the company are now in the hands of the next generation of de Putters I understand and they have had a bit of a rethink about Kite's business model. They have surprised many by diversifying into the hunting market and have done some sort of deal with Browning. I imagine that includes some plan to establish a market in the US, but I'm guessing. In the UK at least, the distribution for the birding market is handled totally independantly.

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Old Thursday 8th August 2019, 23:47   #30
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Kite is positioning the 8x30 HD+ to go after the Nikon HG 8x30?
Kite HD+ is very similar to Monarch 7 in terms of sharpness, aberrations, slightly better. Both similarly shows flares from side light sources.
Monarch HG is much sharper and has less aberrations than Kite HD or M7. Kite HD+ has better housing than M7.
MHG is even sharper than Swarovski CL companion B.

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Old Friday 9th August 2019, 06:09   #31
typo
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Kite HD+ is very similar to Monarch 7 in terms of sharpness, aberrations, slightly better. Both similarly shows flares from side light sources.
Monarch HG is much sharper and has less aberrations than Kite HD or M7. Kite HD+ has better housing than M7.
MHG is even sharper than Swarovski CL companion B.

Attachment 701794
Some interesting thoughts.

Sharpness is an ambiguous term and clearly means different things to different people, but at least in terms of effective resolution, I've found both the MHG 8x42 and 8x30 disappointing. When I last compared the 8x30 it was quite clearly beaten on the level of resolvable detail by the M7, CL and original Lynx. I would agree that the MHG is an worthwhile improvement over the M7 by other measures though. I hope to see the Lynx HD+ next week.

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Old Friday 9th August 2019, 21:48   #32
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These are 10x30. Sharpness for me is more detail. When I look at the distant complex pattern, I can resolve much more details with MHG. With Swaro CL B I can resolve better than M7/Kite and less than MHG. Clear winner here is MHG. Swaro CL B has lowest CA of all four I compare here, MHG has similar but smaller CA than M7/Kite, but CA is weak point of MHG at this price range.
Rally hard to spot any difference between M7 and Kite HD+. On paper HD+ has wider FOV, but in reality hard to nottice that.
Reflections on AR coatings when looking inside suggests identical optical design M7. From looking at these AR coatings reflections MHG has different lenses arrangement, and Swaro CL B also have different.

When I try Kite HD+ i expected more, but I strugled with focusing adjustment and felt lack of sharpnes, so I decided to compare with some other models. I will do some more tests, but I expected more from less reputable brand and higher price tag when compared to Monarch 7. Sure, housing of M7 is not the best, but this sticky rubber does not affect image details.
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Old Saturday 10th August 2019, 07:14   #33
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Thanks for the extra detail.

From what I've been told though the M7 and original Lynx HD shared a common optical design, they did not share a single component. I found the colour and contrast profile were significantly of the Kite was significanlt more to my taste than Nikon. Obviously I don't know how the HD plus compares yet.

"Complex patterns" are normally processed by brain at lower spatial frequencies than either the visual resolution limit of the eye or the effective resolution of the binocular. Obviously I can't judge exactly what you saw, but it is distinctly possible that I was referring to a level of detail 5 to 10 times smaller than you were. Nikon could have tuned the MTF curves to favour you comparisons rather than mine, but with different light, different targets and different eyes it's impossible to know for sure how to explain our different opinions. Hopefully I might know more about the HD plus at least next week.

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Old Sunday 11th August 2019, 14:21   #34
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"Obviously I can't judge exactly what you saw, but it is distinctly possible that I was referring to a level of detail 5 to 10 times smaller than you were".

Wow 5 to 10 times, that is quite impressive.

Andy W.
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Old Sunday 11th August 2019, 16:34   #35
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Andy,

I believe it was EM Grainger working for Eastman Kodak Iat established that maximum visual sensitivity to contrast typically occurs at a spatial frequency of 10 arcminutes, and equated this with perceived image quality, whereas visual acuity limit is most often in the 1 to 2 arcminute range. That is 5 to 10 times difference in the level of detail. An optical system with contrast tuned to around 10 arcminutes will appear to be sharper when viewing complex targets, but this may be at the expense of effective resolution. The MHGs appeared to me to have poorer detail definition in the 1 to 2 arcminute range than the other models I mentioned.

David

Last edited by typo : Sunday 11th August 2019 at 18:28. Reason: Clarity
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Old Monday 12th August 2019, 21:47   #36
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Obviously I can't judge exactly what you saw, but it is distinctly possible that I was referring to a level of detail 5 to 10 times smaller than you were.
I was trying to change my impression with few hours comparison of the four 10x30 I have temporarly. My untrained binocularly eyes are not as sensitive as your lab equipment or your trained eyes for sure, but as typical user with excessive attention to detail I could not find difference betwen M7 and Kite HD+ that I could elaborate on... maybe something, I just gave up, and focused on trying judge if Swaro CL B or MHG is better for my needs.
Now I can tell that sometimes I like more first one, and sometimes the second one. In some contrasty scenarios CA are much worse in Swaro CL B edges than in MHG, regarding sharpnes, CL's edges are always much sharper.
I can now revise my opinion about center sharpness, CL B can be sharper than MHG, but my eyes are not perfect (slight acomodation fluctuations), and adjustment knob in CL B is not perfect also, but I liked watching the stars more with the MHG.

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Old Tuesday 13th August 2019, 07:12   #37
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PPV,

My background is science but I no longer have any access to laboratory equipment. I do some simple back yard tests but mostly, like you, I just rely on my eyes.

Individuals do vary in their anatomy, physiology and particularly psychology and 'see' things quite differently. While binoculars can vary between samples and batches and some models evolve over time, the biggest variable is the user. There are usually multiple differences between different binocular models but they can be quite subtle, and will be more obvious or important to some than to others. It can take time to understand our own strengths and weeknesses. Of course the variability of ambient light also serves to confuse the issue.

David

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Old Wednesday 14th August 2019, 00:45   #38
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Of course the variability of ambient light
yes, indors or in sunny day I had trouble to nottice coloration, but I quickly notticed that difference in cloudy day (when everything has a bluish tint), Swaro CL B is very neutral, while MHG produced image with slight yellow tint. I am also very aware that eyes adopts to the environment, or every of the two eyes can produce different colors.
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Old Monday 19th August 2019, 06:11   #39
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For what it's worth I spent some time with the Lynx HD+ range last Saturday at Birdfair. To be honest I'm not sure what to make of them. From the feel of the armour and the mechanical elements I suspect parts of the binocular and possibly the assembly are from quite a different factory than the original Lynx. As for the optics, I'm undecided. By all the usual parameters they are a range of fine binoculars, yet they didn't grab my attention in the way I was expecting, but I couldn't pinpoint exactly why in the limited time I had with them. They just lacked a bit of sparkle.

I've mentioned in previous posts in this thread that In repeated comparisons, the x30 and x42 Nikon MHGs have disappointed me at the finest level of detail. I last tried them at two different retailers earlier this year and saw nothing to change my view. Interestingly the samples on the Nikon stand were clearly better than I've previously seen, at least matching the M7s on sharpness and not too far off the EDG. Looks like they have tweaked something recently. Lets hope they weren't just specials for the show.!

David
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Old Monday 2nd September 2019, 12:04   #40
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For what it's worth I spent some time with the Lynx HD+ range last Saturday at Birdfair. To be honest I'm not sure what to make of them. From the feel of the armour and the mechanical elements I suspect parts of the binocular and possibly the assembly are from quite a different factory than the original Lynx. As for the optics, I'm undecided. By all the usual parameters they are a range of fine binoculars, yet they didn't grab my attention in the way I was expecting, but I couldn't pinpoint exactly why in the limited time I had with them. They just lacked a bit of sparkle.

I've mentioned in previous posts in this thread that In repeated comparisons, the x30 and x42 Nikon MHGs have disappointed me at the finest level of detail. I last tried them at two different retailers earlier this year and saw nothing to change my view. Interestingly the samples on the Nikon stand were clearly better than I've previously seen, at least matching the M7s on sharpness and not too far off the EDG. Looks like they have tweaked something recently. Lets hope they weren't just specials for the show.!

David
Agree wholeheartedly. I've had a review sample of the 8x42s for a couple of weeks and while initial impressions were good, after using them in the field in various conditions I've been decidedly underwhelmed.

The original Kite HD is a great little binocular where everything seems to "click" (for me at least). I use a pair of the 8x30s regularly when I don't want to carry my big Swaros, and I'm never left wishing I had a better pair of bins with me.

I was expecting great things from the new model, which on paper looks superb, but in the field, the image just kept leaving me disappointed.
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Old Tuesday 3rd September 2019, 07:01   #41
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Calvin,

Reassuring I'm not alone. I thought my eyes must be playing tricks with me early in the day, but a quick comparison to the Bonelli 2.0 said not. Frazer was keen to point out the HD+ 8x42 at Ł719 is 'only' 3/4 the price and that means we should expect some compromises, but how many?

David

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Old Saturday 27th June 2020, 01:19   #42
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I was at a convention last year casually going through any and every binocular I could find. There were all the top models from the European brands and a lot of others, some very pricy and many cheaper models. I had never heard of Kite by that time. I lifted up the little Lynx 8x30 (gen 1. - non + version) and was immediately surprised at the quality feel. I was even more surprised when I put them to my eyes. I was blow away! The pricetag at that time was around 500 euro. I could not believe it. They view is BIG. Wider than anything I've ever tried. The view made me think of sitting inside one of those great cinemas in Hollywood where the immense image is hovering before you, wide and immersive. It is very sharp, has great contrast and resolution with a grand sweet spot. The focus wheel has a fast throw and focuses very close! I would have bought it then and there but could not justify it since I have a Habicht 8x30W, but the thought of getting one has not let go.

A friend of mine asked for advice on a new binocular the other week. I would like something better than what I have now he told me showing me a sad, dusty and un-collimated plastic Nikon reminiscent of a Pentax Papilio.
I did some internetting and realized that Kite had released a new version of the Lynx HD, now called the "Lynx HD+". These things always worry me. The "new and improved" promise heard so many times only to later discover that "improved" can be defined very subjectively..
I send an e-mail to Kite Optics asking them exactly what has been changed on the new + version. This is the reply I got:

Please find below the upgrades for the new KITE LYNX HD+:



Upgrades relative to LYNX HD gen. 1 :

- 2% optical transmisson increase.

- 4-stage removable twist-up eyecup

- Improved comfort for spectacle wearers

- attached objective covers



The new KITE LYNXH HD+ 8x30 will cost € 575,00 so it will be a small price increase of 3,5 %.



My friend pulled the trigger on this new + model and it arrived today. I took my Habicht 8x30 and went over to see how the Kite compared.
I can't believe how good these are! The handling, feel and view is absolutely top notch! This has got to be one of the best, if not the best performing 8x30's on the market today! I can't understand why I haven't heard more about these? If you get a chance, try them!

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Old Saturday 27th June 2020, 03:55   #43
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Thank you for sharing your thoughts Bramberg. I’ve been curious to see/try one of these for some time. I’m quite a fan of the 8x30 compact offerings similar to this from other manufacturers, though it’s reputed Kite is sort of the cream of the crop (als the Mavens in the US).

Do you know if this model is made in China or Japan? If China that would be in common with the Opticron Traveller and Nikon M7. If in Japan, that would be in common with the Maven B3.

A comparison of the Kite, Maven, and perhaps Nikon MHG would be fascinating. Would take a bit of doing to get ahold of the three all at once!
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Old Saturday 27th June 2020, 10:03   #44
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Thank you for sharing your thoughts Bramberg. I’ve been curious to see/try one of these for some time. I’m quite a fan of the 8x30 compact offerings similar to this from other manufacturers, though it’s reputed Kite is sort of the cream of the crop (als the Mavens in the US).

Do you know if this model is made in China or Japan? If China that would be in common with the Opticron Traveller and Nikon M7. If in Japan, that would be in common with the Maven B3.

A comparison of the Kite, Maven, and perhaps Nikon MHG would be fascinating. Would take a bit of doing to get ahold of the three all at once!
I'm not sure but from what I've read and just from the feel of this I think it is made in Japan. Some people seem to prefer the earlier "non +" version. Although the non + version is the one that instantly got me hooked my first impression of the newer + version is that it to is pure optic awesomeness. I've never tried a maven so I cant speak to that. I did do a side by side comparison to both the Swarovski CLC 8x30 and my Habicht. The Habicht is dear to me because of it's build and because I prefer the characteristics of porro view. I would have chosen the Kite over the SLC though!
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Old Tuesday 30th June 2020, 22:00   #45
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My friends mom had been over today. She had picked up the Kite and looked through it. After a short glance she pulled the trigger and ordered one for herself. Later in the evening it came to light that her sister had also bought one. I can imagine the price going up on these as the rumor begins to spread and the demand surpasses supply.
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