Conndomat
United States of Europe
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x32 SF (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter AlbertoJ
- Start date
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
I recall from somewhere that the fibre reinforcement in the FL line is 'E-spec fiberglass' , so called E-glass. It is not quite as good (in terms of stiffness and lightness) as the various carbon fibres. It is however a wholly suitable material for binoculars. Most of the experiences of FL owners exactly mirror your own. :t:
Proper carbon fibre would be better again (though more expensive - still, that's what mass production is for - to refine the process and bring the unit cost down - Lamborghini is chucking the stuff around like confetti now !
Chosun :gh:
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
Just who exactly are these walking dead consumers of the zombie apocalypse ??!! :eek!:
I guarantee you it's not the little old ladies of the birding world ! :cat:
I'd also wager that the vast majority of the birding world is materials technology agnostic - if it is stronger, lighter, cheaper, better, then people aren't going to give two hoots what it is, unless of course they're the marketing spin brainwashed Hairy chesTed types ! :-O
Chosun :gh:
I've bought 3 and played with numerous FLs during the years. My impression is they do have a higher return rate than other alphas. Most of them due to collimation problems. I personally returned one 42 and I saw returns of a 32 and two 56 of others due to the same problem. However I'm not sure if these originated from the fiberglass reinforced housing.
BTW, I believe Zeiss still uses magnesium making the barrels of the fls, plastic only for the hinges and out-housing. Is that correct?
BTW, I believe Zeiss still uses magnesium making the barrels of the fls, plastic only for the hinges and out-housing. Is that correct?
wdc
Well-known member
There is a difference between cluelessly copying and pasting quotes harvested off the internet to 'prove' one's position, which is Dennis' perpetual modus operandi, vs. actually knowing something about the issue at hand. Thanks for weighing in.
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
There are as many 'formulas' for carbon fibre as there are stars in the sky. :eek!: :cat:
The ones used for optics housings are closer in thermal conductivity coefficients than any of the metals - magnesium and aluminum alloys. Go to the engineering textbooks and check the data directly. If there issues then other factors are at play - construction quality, tolerances, mixed materials etc.
Expoxy breakdown might be an issue inside your high winding Lamborghini engine, but it's a non issue for binoculars - and I'm pretty sure astroscopes don't breakdown under moonlight ! You will note that most binocular armour's throughout history have been black - so that's obviously not an issue either. I don't recall white rubber or leather armour ever being a thing ! :cat:
Chosun :gh:
Conndomat
United States of Europe
Yes, the reason is that the aluminum cools down faster!
Apo's are often carried from the warm room into the cold night and are supposed to deliver maximum performance on the planet of 200x and more in a short time, with a magnification of 7-10x the term question is probably to be neglected completely.
An Apo in carbon fiber would provide a good picture in Jupiter in no time at max. 10x magnification, only nobody wants to see it, you're better positioned with binoculars ...
Andreas
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Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
Dennis, that's either a misquote or a misunderstanding of what I said. The chassis is not fiberglass, but E-glass is the fibre used to reinforce the plastic matrix ..... :cat:
I recall from somewhere that the fibre *reinforcement* in the FL line is 'E-spec fiberglass' , so called E-glass. It is not quite as good (in terms of stiffness and lightness) as the various carbon fibres. It is however a wholly suitable material for binoculars. Most of the experiences of FL owners exactly mirror your own. :t:
Proper carbon fibre would be better again (though more expensive - still, that's what mass production is for - to refine the process and bring the unit cost down - Lamborghini is chucking the stuff around like confetti now !
Mark9473
Well-known member
No, the reason is that the focal length change of the glass objective in its cell, and the physical length change of a carbon fiber tube due to thermal expansion are not well matched; aluminium does much better. A carbon fiber refractor requires more re-focusing. It's a killer material for reflectors though.
Gary
My post has been deleted. Maybe too close for comfort. Not a rumour, that’s all I said, as there was an event in the UK last week. I don’t work for Zeiss, but know many in the UK optics industry who were attending a Zeiss event. All nature / photo related dealers, so no need to be Einstein to work out, that it must be a major launch on a new binocular (32 SF).
With respect John, I think this is a misinterpretation of the purpose of those ergonomic comparisons. IMHO what they intend to illustrate is that if you value the stability of the full open-hinge grip (3 fingers around the barrel) as Carina Schiestel-Swarovski clearly does in the first pic below, then in the case of the EL you need to crank your finger at an angle to reach the focuser, just as Carina is doing and as is also illustrated in the other pic.
The solution of moving the hand so that the next finger can rest on the focusing bridge and the first finger can reach the focuser more easily means you must diminish the open-hinge grip by removing one of your strongest fingers and placing it on top of the bridge. This is even more necessary on Leica's Noctivid.
If you regard the open-hinge design as just another style of bino then none of this will be important, but if you want to benefit from the full grip that this design offers, and have comfortable and easy, instinctive, first finger access to the focuser, then this is what SF offers, as can be seen in the second pic.
Moving the hand that is holding the EL doesn't answer the question, it changes the question.
Lee
Attachments
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
Lol ! Lee 3
Gawd :-O - I think you were a jockey in a former life - you do like to flog a dead horse ! :gn:
For starters those grips are exaggerated, secondly the Zen ED3 and Nikon MHG with their nicely shaped, sized, and placed bridges are nicer to hold than both bins you show (well for me anyhow, and I'm the only one that counts !) . Thirdly, neither of the two bins I mentioned, nor the Swarovski EL feature the contrived grip forward shoulder loading hold of the SF - why in gawd's name Zeiss wasted precious life replicating this in x32mm will be something that puzzles and flummoxes archeologists millenia from now ! :h?: :cat:
Lastly, these bins are x32mm ! Those with even average hands will be all over both tubes of any open style frame. Placing the middle digit on a bridge is not flipping the bird to stability, since it is more than likely that your thumbs are going to extend fully under each barrel and firmly contact the opposite tube. That makes the grip rock solid already - the only question is where to place all your other fingers ........... real estate will be at a premium ..... :brains:
I wonder how much Nikon would charge to put the Zeiss optics in a x32mm MHG style body .... ??? :cat:
I agree with John, it's poor form for an 'Alpha' company to be explicitly passing judgement on a competitor's product ......
Chosun :gh:
jan van daalen
Well-known member
:gh::gh:
Regarding your last remark:
The "leaked" info was not meant for public use but only for internal use.
It is common to use these comparisons during those meetings and this is done by all brands and in the past they didn't use names but colors (Blue is Zeiss, Green is Swarovski, Red is Leica and Yellow is Nikon).
In these political correct, non profiling times brand names are used.
Don't blame Zeiss for doing something (for internal use) everybody does but the others weren't catched in the act:-C
By now everybody knows that the new baby SF will be launched at the IWA.
It is a "shame" it leaked out, but let's not make it more then it is.
Jan
Regarding your last remark:
The "leaked" info was not meant for public use but only for internal use.
It is common to use these comparisons during those meetings and this is done by all brands and in the past they didn't use names but colors (Blue is Zeiss, Green is Swarovski, Red is Leica and Yellow is Nikon).
In these political correct, non profiling times brand names are used.
Don't blame Zeiss for doing something (for internal use) everybody does but the others weren't catched in the act:-C
By now everybody knows that the new baby SF will be launched at the IWA.
It is a "shame" it leaked out, but let's not make it more then it is.
Jan
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Rotherbirder
Well-known member
I agree; I must be a freak too Chosun - CA doesn't bother me and neither do the location of the focusing wheel or strap lugs, eye cup design, weight, eye relief etc etc of a binocular, I just get out there and use it for its intended purpose! Rolling ball ordinarily isn't an issue either, though an 80's vintage 10x40 BGAT* Dialyt made me want to gag, then the focusing failed catastrophically whilst on a trip to Nepal ... Zeiss? Never again!
RB
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Lol ! Lee 3
Gawd :-O - I think you were a jockey in a former life - you do like to flog a dead horse ! :gn:
For starters those grips are exaggerated, secondly the Zen ED3 and Nikon MHG with their nicely shaped, sized, and placed bridges are nicer to hold than both bins you show (well for me anyhow, and I'm the only one that counts !) . Thirdly, neither of the two bins I mentioned, nor the Swarovski EL feature the contrived grip forward shoulder loading hold of the SF - why in gawd's name Zeiss wasted precious life replicating this in x32mm will be something that puzzles and flummoxes archeologists millenia from now ! :h?: :cat:
Lastly, these bins are x32mm ! Those with even average hands will be all over both tubes of any open style frame. Placing the middle digit on a bridge is not flipping the bird to stability, since it is more than likely that your thumbs are going to extend fully under each barrel and firmly contact the opposite tube. That makes the grip rock solid already - the only question is where to place all your other fingers ........... real estate will be at a premium ..... :brains:
Chosun :gh:
LOL. You should be in show business CJ...... :-O:-O
Lee
Alexis Powell
Natural history enthusiast
