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New Old Trinovids

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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 16:11   #1
Paskman
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New Old Trinovids

https://www.instagram.com/p/B443-Htn...=19myt95imf6ng

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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 17:22   #2
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If that's true, you have just made my year!
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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 20:35   #3
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Its seem to be true. https://leica-nature-blog.com/leica-...of-of-quality/

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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 00:39   #4
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For the 7x35, compared to the 2017 specs, the eye relief has increased from 15mm to 16mm, but the FOV has decreased from 150m/1000m to 140m/1000m and, what's even worse, the close focus distance increased from 3m to 4m.
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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 09:49   #5
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Hello All,

Does anyone know what sort of prism system will , or is used in these "retro" Trinovids.

Cheers.
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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 11:00   #6
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They are already in the Leica Store in the UK.

https://store.leica-camera.com/uk/en/trinovid

Prices are fairly steep, but as I am looking at some new binoculars I am tempted by the 7x35s
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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 13:14   #7
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Originally Posted by Paskman View Post
They ate already in the Leica Store in the UK.

https://store.leica-camera.com/uk/en/trinovid

Prices are fairly steep, but as I am looking at some new binoculars I am tempted by the 7x35s


Allbinos still has listed the Leica 7x35, 8x40 and 10x40 Trinovids which were announced in September 2017. In fact they currently are the first 3 Leica binoculars listed by Albinos at this time. They still show the original 3 different styles that came out in 2017.

https://www.allbinos.com/42-Leica-binoculars.html

https://www.allbinos.com/1887-Leica_...fications.html

Bob

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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 13:47   #8
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According to Leica, the only place that you will be able to buy them are the Leica Stores. It appears that they will not be available anywhere else.

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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 14:31   #9
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According to Leica, the only place that you will be able to buy them are the Leica Stores. It appears that they will not be available anywhere else.

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If they are going to do that I expect that they will be expensive!

I ordered one of the original versions from Camera Land when they were taking orders for them and, if my memory is correct it was about $400.00 US dollars less than their current projected (US) price of $1,600.00 is. Some may remember it differently than I do, however.

Bob

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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 16:11   #10
Gijs van Ginkel
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Paskman, post 8,
Only sold through Leica stores???????
I asked around and one thing is clear: House of Outdoor run by Jan van Daalen will immediately stop selling Leica binoculars and he will ban all Leicas from his shop, so I expect sales promotion of his complete Leica inventory soon, if Leica seriously chooses this path. Fortunately customers have a lot of choice of other bands than Leica in his shop I understand.
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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 16:22   #11
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There will be plenty of collectors who will purchase a pair or three, even if it means waiting a year or two. Aimed at that market I imagine rather than a birder or naturalist out in the field every day.
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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 17:01   #12
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There will be plenty of collectors who will purchase a pair or three, even if it means waiting a year or two. Aimed at that market I imagine rather than a birder or naturalist out in the field every day.
And why not.........

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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 23:30   #13
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In relation to the specifications, I've attached:
a) those from yesterday's announcement (see dipped's link in post #3), and
b) those from the previous 2017 announcement (from a 2017 catalogue)

Whether the differences are accurate, and what they indicate, who knows?
(simplification or refinement of the earlier design? a desire to provide greater differentiation from the Ultravid line?)

I've also attached images of the 3 models - now only offered in leatherette - perhaps reflecting market research as to likely buyer preferences


John
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 01:25   #14
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This is great news, I am surprised Leica followed through. Leica does like special more boutique
products in there lines so this seems to be one of them.

Kudos to Leica.

Jerry
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 06:22   #15
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Does anyone know if Leica will use Upendahl (spelling ?) prisms , or SP prisms in these binoculars ?.
The specifications only say "roof prisms".

Thanks.

Cheers.
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 07:00   #16
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John (post#13),

Something with the FOV specs went wrong, I think.

In the old specs, these were the numbers for the three models:
450ft, 387ft, 330ft
150m, 129m, 110m

The new specs are now:
460ft, 404ft, 341ft
140m, 123m, 104m

How can the FOV be wider in feet and smaller in meters, etc.?

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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 08:27   #17
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Hi 42za,

The 2017 catalogue did state that Uppendahl prisms were to be used
And it it would be reasonable to suppose that this is still the case - but until it’s confirmed we just don’t know

Uppendahl prisms are used in the still produced 2nd generation Geovid rangefinders. So it's not as if lack of current expertise should be a consideration

However, Schmidt-Pechan prisms are more compact, so theoretically they could fit into the existing space
- see the image from Jan van Daalen comparing an S-P pair from a Leica BN to the Uppendahl group from an original Leitz v2 Trinovid
(from: https://www.birdforum.net/showpost.p...3&postcount=95 )

As a practical consideration, the choice of prisms shouldn’t matter (what works works)
However in considering the likely market, one would think that authenticity/ nostalgia/ rarity would be important considerations


- - - -
Hi Canip,

Good pick up! I only looked at the FOV in meters, so I didn’t notice the discrepancy in the 2019 table
- and I presume that the figures in meters are the correct ones, since Leica’s original measurements would be metric

As we know, FOV conversion is an angular conversion i.e. meters at 1000 meters verses feet at 1000 yards,
so the conversion factor is x 3 (or 3 for feet to meters), since there are 3 feet in a yard

However, the conversion factor used is x 3.28. That is, what should be used to convert a linear measurement - and is used for the minimum focusing distances
- so it’s a failure in proof reeding (. . . a little joke, I couldn't resist!)


John
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 09:27   #18
42za
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Hello John (post 17),

Thanks for your reply and thoughts on this matter.

I have a gut feeling , (probably completely wrong ) , that Leica will use SP prisms and "improve" or "modernise" the old Trinovid recipe , the accountants at Leica have probably had their say .

I for one would like a new Trinovid that is made exactly like the old ones were , but with modern glass and coatings , we can dream can't we.

Or am I just too old for this .

Cheers.
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 09:36   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John A Roberts View Post
The 2017 catalogue did state that Uppendahl prisms were to be used
And it it would be reasonable to suppose that this is still the case - but until its confirmed we just dont know

Uppendahl prisms are used in the still produced 2nd generation Geovid rangefinders. So it's not as if lack of current expertise should be a consideration

However, Schmidt-Pechan prisms are more compact, so theoretically they could fit into the existing space
In the new specs, all models have become 40g heavier, so perhaps that is indication that they haven't moved to the smaller/lighter SP prisms.
But unless they explicitly say otherwise, I'm assuming SP nonetheless.
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 11:41   #20
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As a practical consideration, the choice of prisms shouldnt matter (what works works)
This is not correct. The choice of prisms *does* matter. SP are the worst choice among relevant roof prism designs (SP, AK and Uppendahl). Check the relevant literature, e.g. Merlitz 2019.

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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 14:56   #21
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This is not correct. The choice of prisms *does* matter. SP are the worst choice among relevant roof prism designs (SP, AK and Uppendahl). Check the relevant literature, e.g. Merlitz 2019.

Hermann
If SP this would be a huge disappointment. I dont think Leitz would do it.
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 15:10   #22
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Uppendahl prisms are not really not so much larger than Schmidt-Pechans. They are just a little wider with a lateral offset that the original Leitz Trinovid closed bridge was designed to accommodate. Longitudinally, the two types take up about the same space, so there would be no significant size or even weight advantage in using S-P.

I notice that the close focus in the new specs has been extended from 13' to 18' for the 8/10x40s. That's about what the original Leitz models had. That might seem like a deal breaker to many birders now, but in the 70s and 80s close focus that distant was not so unusual. In those days some dealers (or perhaps it was the Leitz importer) offered a "close focusing" service that shortened the close focus to around 12'-13', presumably by either repositioning the eyepiece focusing elements and/or moving the objective lens forward a little to shift some focus range from beyond infinity. The 2017 specs might reflect an intention to use that same close focus modification which was subsequently abandoned.

I also noticed a spec of 88% light transmission on the Leica store site, which seems modest for a binocular using modern coatings and only ten glass to air surfaces. There's no mention of dielectric mirror coating (or phase coating) in the new specs. Presumably that's an oversight, but silver mirror coating would also explain the relatively low transmission spec.

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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 18:15   #23
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Uppendahl prisms are not really not so much larger than Schmidt-Pechans. They are just a little wider with a lateral offset that the original Leitz Trinovid closed bridge was designed to accommodate. Longitudinally, the two types take up about the same space, so there would be no significant size or even weight advantage in using S-P.
You're right, as usual. However, why then did the weight of the 7x35 increase by 40gr, and why did they cut down on the field of view? It will be interesting to see some detailed drawings of the new old Trinovids - if they ever publish them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by henry link View Post
I notice that the close focus in the new specs has been extended from 13' to 18' for the 8/10x40s. That's about what the original Leitz models had. That might seem like a deal breaker to many birders now, but in the 70s and 80s close focus that distant was not so unusual. In those days some dealers (or perhaps it was the Leitz importer) offered a "close focusing" service that shortened the close focus to around 12'-13', presumably by either repositioning the eyepiece focusing elements and/or moving the objective lens forward a little to shift some focus range from beyond infinity. The 2017 specs might reflect an intention to use that same close focus modification which was subsequently abandoned.
That's very well possible. I had forgotten about those modfications, even though two friends in the Uk had them done at the time.

Quote:
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I also noticed a spec of 88% light transmission on the Leica store site, which seems modest for a binocular using modern coatings and only ten glass to air surfaces. There's no mention of dielectric mirror coating (or phase coating) in the new specs. Presumably that's an oversight, but silver mirror coating would also explain the relatively low transmission spec.
Agreed. It will be interesting to see what people think once the Trinovids are finally on the market. Mind you, given what happened last time round I'll only believe they really do exist when I see them.

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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 20:37   #24
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Hello,

Perhaps Leica should start over , with a blank sheet of paper , and bring back a state of the art Porro.



Cheers.
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 20:55   #25
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Perhaps Leica should start over , with a blank sheet of paper , and bring back a state of the art Porro.
State of the art porro: Perger prism ...

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