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careers or business with birds? (1 Viewer)

scuba0095

Well-known member
does anyone here do this for a living? if so does anyone have ideas of what someone might be able to do if you are a bird lover and want a career change that you could work with birds all day? or a business involving them?
 
The commonest 'careers' involving birding here in the UK appear to be either surveying in relation to wind farms or other developments and wildlife tours or guiding.
 
I'm only 13 but I KNOW my career's going to involve birds, or nature. I want to do conservation work or study ornithology, but then it's not an easy job to get...
 
I'm only 13 but I KNOW my career's going to involve birds, or nature. I want to do conservation work or study ornithology, but then it's not an easy job to get...

I thought the same. My advice: make sure you get a Phd, forget a relationship, money etc. A be prepared for putting a pair of bin.s on feeling like you're getting dressed for work. Also remember many 'conservation' jobs mainly involve sitting at a computer and lots of time on the phone to so you won't get to see much wildlife anyway.

Alternatively become a teacher: decent wage and 13 weeks holiday a year, that's a lot of birding time. Also there's English schools all around the world so it's a great way to work abroad. Choose the country you'd like to go birding in and then find a school there.

There were many good things about my ten years working in ornithological research/conservation but I wish I'd just done a year or so, so I realised the image and the reality are very different, and then chucked it in.

But the 13 year old me wouldn't have listened to me either.
 
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Carrying on in my career advisor role, if you really want to work in ornithology, as well as the PHD, you'll want a ringing license - you'll probably quickly find your first contract with that. So Birds 4ever I'd start on that one now.
 
Steve's absolutely spot on. I came to work in this field after a 20 year career in banking, and it's good but not great when it becomes work. I do on average a 90 hour week in summer/autumn, paid for 40- you'll never be rich, you'll be lucky to even have a semblance of a normal social life and you'll definitely need another hobby to relax! Mine's BF ;)

Other suggestions from my experience for the UK based hopefuls: work on developing your personal attributes because there are going to be so many others out there chasing the same opportunities. The sooner you start refining your character, the better. Find a 'unique selling point' that will make an employer see you as heads above the rest of the applicants.

Do voluntary work as soon as you can. Lots of it.

I'd echo that idea about a ringing permit, but be aware a UK permit will take you 3,4,5 years solid graft, giving up most of your weekends and holidays. Does that put you off? Perhaps not the career for you then, because this is the level of effort you'll need to shine above applicants.

If you feel your birding's already at a good enough level, perhaps get involved with trying 'real' surveys as soon as you can as well. Have a look at how the BTO's BBS works http://www.bto.org/bbs/index.htm if you're still in your early teens you might not yet have the opportunity to sign up long term for a real square, but you can practice your own locally. Or do some mock WeBS counts on your local lake and see if you can commit to the routine of once every month, regardless of whether a rare bird's turned up just down the road.

Oh, and get hold of one or two books detailing survey techniques and data analysis and learn about number crunching now.

And no, I'll not list the book titles here, nor suggest any other surveys you could look at as this is the first test of your resolve- if you're really serious about making this your career choice now you'll have a go at tracking some down, I can't just list them all here for your the lazy opposition to ruin your head start, can I?!

Actually, the main point of that last paragraph was if your initial reaction was 'aww, why can't he just tell me the titles' instead of 'great, now where should I start looking' then I'd say right now you're not going to make it- not unless you can change attitude and approach asap to be able blow the thousands of others out the water that you'll be fighting for fewer and fewer jobs in the years to come. That's how tough it's going to be.

Good luck!
 
Some great advice here from Steve and Kev.

I know that if I was embarking on my 20+ year career in bird/ornithology, then I wouldn't get to where I am now without some qualifications (I was educated to O level only).

I got my foot in the door first with RSPB as a full-time volunteer (18 months resident vol on a reserve) and then with the BTO where I spent 6 months full-time office volling with some field work research. From there on in it was about experience and moving on - not always at the right time or to the right place - but I've done OK. But I made up for lack of qualifications with gaining first-hand experience doing full-time voluntary work. I'm certain I couldn't repeat this now.

The big difference for me was that I expected a career in (partly) watching birds, educating others about birds - showing birds to others has always been my buzz. The longer my career went on the further from the field and working with birders I got and I am now an charity administrator running the BOU!

To counter this I started leading birding trips in my holiday time, and this has lead to me specialising in Lesvos. I also do freelance writing, publishing and consultancy work.

So, whatever you think now, its almost certain to change and whatever path you take thats likely to change too! I now wish I had more qualifications (but then if I had pursued this from O level I would not probably be a geologist or similar, and nothing to do with birds!). I also wish I had persevered with my ringing permit (didn't even get to C) when I was at the BTO, but I was busy birding instead - poor choice in retrospect.

So get as many relevant qualifications and experience as you can as early as possible!
 
If I had my time again I would be a qualified lawyer or accountant woking six months a year on contract and spending the other six months doing voluntary conservation work / tour leading / holidaying.

This would be a whole lot more lucrative and less stressful than a fulltime role in birding.

Since charitable bodies, conservation organisations etc. need lawyers and accountants the working time need not be spent on the dark side in the corporate world (although the money is better the more evil the employer)

The teaching suggestion is also a good one and the money is reasonable, but the holidays coincide with everyone else's and are not at the best times of year for birding. (I avoid holidays which coincide with half-terms as prices go up and nice places fill with screaming kids) Also the job can be very stressful, at least in some schools. Since it's possible (easier?) to convert to teaching after success in other careers, it may be better to qualify in something else initially after university.

Law and accountancy may not seem particularly exciting at age thirteen but they provide a very solid income and an avenue to any number of careers and senior positions. Most roles also seem to be less stressful than other routes to senior positions through sales, marketing, operations.

Graham
 
if so does anyone have ideas of what someone might be able to do if you are a bird lover and want a career change that you could work with birds all day? or a business involving them?

And switching to our US friend's original question.. if you'd read I'd managed to jump career ships a few posts back, that came about through good old fashioned luck and a bit of 'who you know'.

For several years' prior to leaving banking I'd been volunteering and serving on committees for my local RSPB Members' Group, and my County Ornithological Society- by playing an active part my name was out there. This meant that when a local Bird Observatory was looking for someone to work for them, one of their committee approached me and asked if I'd considered applying because I met the bill. Three years in I'd actually decided the grass wasn't as green as I'd hoped, and had quit with the intention to go back to something in the financial world, but within two days of resigning my latest conservation employer had approached me with an offer I couldn't turn down- 100% fieldwork, all birds, three generally good years. Once they knew about the managerial background I was offered a promotion that I couldn't refuse, to 40% office, 60% fieldwork, which actually is still kind of a nice balance- for the moment!

So, a lot of luck is needed, especially if you haven't got the qualifications (University of Life, me, so I've been extra, extra lucky), but you really (and I cannot stress this hard enough) must make your own luck and network like fury through every voluntary opening you can find in the areas that appeal. And at the same time, just as recommended for the youngsters, bite the bullet and work on your personal attributes to give yourself that edge.

Hope this helps.
 
Poor wages. To put that in perspective, I now earn well over three times what I last earned pro rata for the RSPB, and in that job on was seriously told that I should accept paying some of my own expenses as I was on a high wage! Poor job security: contracts. Working all over the country - that can be an advantage for some people but I had a partner, also by the end the RSPB stopped paying your accommodation so I would have had to pay rent and my mortgage. The realisation that, as Steve said, that if I did make it I'd [probably be spending all my time in an office anyway. Competing with people who had no life/interests outside work and so would literally work every waking hour. In the most extreme case I met someone who volunteered for the RSPB for ages with no income, he didn't get unemployment benefit as they said they could find him a job. So he lived to road kill. I'm just not that dedicated.

Also it's just not as fun as it sounds. Spending the day looking at birds sounds great but trust me wandering around Essex radio tracking song thrushes is actually very boring!

I could go on. But I'm just bitter and twisted ;)
 
Wish I'd got a trade instead. Get a job as a bricklayer or in a factory. Keep it a hobby but make it count. WeBS count, BTO atlas etc. You'll be skint forever if you go into it and there's loads of kids who fancy they could be a warden. Most of them are good at talking but not at birds and hard graft cause 8/10 times that's what it boils down to. Mark my words. Mark my words..........
 
I'm only 13 but I KNOW my career's going to involve birds, or nature. I want to do conservation work or study ornithology, but then it's not an easy job to get...

Do not let the negativity on here put you off. Okay, you have to accept that the better paid conservation jobs will not involve being outside all day and watching/monitoring birds. Wardening jobs and research/survey jobs are quite poorly paid. The better paid jobs involve a fair bit of time behind a computer rather than out in the field. You will never become rich working for a conservation NGO, so you have to decide whether this matters.

As someone else said, you need to make your own luck and put yourself out there. Get involved with your local societies, start volunteering for the local wildlife trust or RSPB. I started volunteering when I was 14 and this definitely helped me get my first break. A degree is essential, so start thinking about this now.

I have worked in conservation for the last ten years and can honestly say that I have never regretted my career choices.
 
This is silly. People are letting their own experiences determine their responses.
There is no need to get upset. The question was "career or business with birds".
Imo, there is plenty of opportunity, starting with the defense and natural resource industries.
There are probably more bird specific opportunities with the power generation (windmills) firms, but that is a small subset.
None of these jobs are purely birds specific, but all allow you to spend a lot of time in the field and perhaps to have more impact than a more bird focused job.
 
Wish I'd got a trade instead. Get a job as a bricklayer or in a factory. Keep it a hobby but make it count. WeBS count, BTO atlas etc. You'll be skint forever if you go into it and there's loads of kids who fancy they could be a warden. Most of them are good at talking but not at birds and hard graft cause 8/10 times that's what it boils down to. Mark my words. Mark my words..........
DO NOT BECOME A BRICKLAYER!!!You will fall off the scaffold looking at birds,and be harrased by fellow tradesmen for being a weirdo birder.Oh yes you will ge ripped off,rained off,p****d off,Have no money at christmas,i could go on but it gets scary!Great careers advice that!!
 
This is silly. People are letting their own experiences determine their responses.
There is no need to get upset.

Jeez Etty, there was us thinking life experiences were worth responding to.

The question was "career or business with birds".

No, that was the thread title, the question was

does anyone here do this for a living? if so does anyone have ideas of what someone might be able to do if you are a bird lover and want a career change that you could work with birds all day? or a business involving them?

We have an idea- and that idea is 'think very carefully'. We're showing people that you can easily lose that love for birds when you work with them every day. No raised expectations. No rose-coloured spectacles. No 'can do' attitude here I'm afraid.

Imo, there is plenty of opportunity, starting with the defense and natural resource industries.

IMO.. opinions are formed from experiences. If they're informed opinions that is.

There are probably more bird specific opportunities with the power generation (windmills) firms, but that is a small subset.

My experi.. opinion on natural resource industries, based on fifteen years bird ringing inside an oil-fired station and a coal-fired station is they are great for birds, but nowadays if you work there, you won't enjoy them because H&S and terrorist threats will get in the way of you doing anything like lift a pair of bins on site. My old ringing trainer is a Field Centre manager at one, who nowadays can't have any adult groups come to visit his nature reserve in the power station grounds because of the possibility that green protestors might infiltrate the site. Trust this opinion, its only going to get worse. And guess, what, the windfarms are owned by the same peeps, and they don't particularly want their staff showing an interest in blades and birds..

In the main they leave the birds to the environmental consultants. Who often know a good deal less about birds than we'd dare think. When I was at the Bird Obs I did a bit of sub-contracted survey work for consultants because their own paid troops weren't up to it. Of a dozen or so friends actually in that profession, I know of only one who really enjoys it, because at the end of the day they're really only managing some limited damage limitation, and it's bloomin' depressing..

None of these jobs are purely birds specific, but all allow you to spend a lot of time in the field and perhaps to have more impact than a more bird focused job.

Not in relation to the actual question they won't. Don't get me started on 'defence' btw.. C'mon, employers soon get pretty dang pee'd off with people slacking off from the specific task at hand in this day and age. Presenteeism anyone?

Sorry if this seems a little harsh to you Etty, but it isn't written for you. If someone, reading all this, still comes through it thinking they want to go into a bird-related career, then great, they're half-way to achieving it, because they're eyes are half-opened and their dreams are shattered. If they're not, then they've lost already. This is the real world, not where we escape to. I've had to hire people for this bird-related work lark, and I can assure you the dreamers, the idealists, the half-baked, the eco-warriers and the bunnie-huggers don't even make it to interview nowadays*

DunnoKev
---------------
MD, Thersites and Pandarus, Environmental Consultants


*Unless it's for PETA
 
DO NOT BECOME A BRICKLAYER!!!You will fall off the scaffold looking at birds,and be harrased by fellow tradesmen for being a weirdo birder.Oh yes you will ge ripped off,rained off,p****d off,Have no money at christmas,i could go on but it gets scary!Great careers advice that!!

True. He should aim higher. How about steeplejack? ;)
 
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