!! Micro-Plastics in the Environment !! (1 Viewer)

WOW - this is truly disturbing!

This has been touched on in a few other threads in the past, but it is high time that we put it all together. The link below from Australian Science TV series - "Catalyst" , handily contains video and transcript.

Micro-Plastics in the environment ... coming from where you wouldn't have thought, and with a greater impact than you would have thought :eek!:

Each Micro-Particle acts as a magnifier for pathogens, bio-toxins, and heavy metals etc. It is thought that there may be Nano-scale effects that haven't even been discovered yet.

Micro-Plastics are not only jeapodizing the web of life, accumulating in the food chain, but also making their way through gut barrier into the bloodstream - disrupting endocrine systems, loading organs and worse .....

A lot of this data is based around the study of marine life. If anyone knows of any later studies, and/or research in humans - please post.

https://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/4424996.htm

This following link was also posted by Joost (No Hatch) in another thread. Thanks. https://www.theguardian.com/environ...es-found-tap-water-around-world-study-reveals

More:
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...astic-planet-what-does-it-mean-for-our-health
Jayzus! - micro-plastics in Honey! - how the @#^! does that happen?!
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/19440049.2013.843025




Chosun :gh:

This is one of those incredibly disturbing societal issues that I only think will change if we legislate plastics out of existence or have a foolproof way to recycle/reuse/destroy them back out of the environment after use.

Well, that or some of the biodegradable plastic substitutes being worked on.

But I still suspect that unless we make it mandatory, it will never happen.

Avoiding plastics these days as a consumer requires a truly Herculean effort and in many cases can't be avoided on a tight budget.

And after the big exposé brought to light after China restricted the import of mixed plastics, my heart has sunk rather further on the subject of plastics.

It really is a horrible mess.

Even if all plastice are banned now, we'll still have the stuff we've already got, lingering in the environment for at least centuries, more likely millennia :-C

People get a little more freaked out about this than is reasonable.

You should be aware that you swallow several grams of micro-plastics daily.* It's probably not good for you, but it's obviously not catastrophic. Similarly, though it certainly is reasonable to worry about some species or ecosystems (e.g., sea turtles swallowing larger chunks of plastic because it looks like jellyfish, and subsequently dying of impacted gut), and unknown knock-on effects (if some small plankton are adversely affected, what does that do to the ecosystem as a whole?) there is plenty else to worry about when it comes to the health of the oceans and of the planet as a whole.

The vast majority of plastics are not much more dangerous than sand. You wouldn't want it in your eye, and you should take reasonable steps to keep it out of your food, but the fact that some of it ends up in the ocean is, on its own, not particularly alarming.

* Take a look at the lint screen in your clothes dryer. Chances are that most of what you see is small, broken bits of nylon, rayon, etc. Your clothes shed that all day long, and your carpets shed even more. A lot of that, especially the smallest bits, float through the air and end up in your lungs. From there, they get trapped in mucus and swept up to your esophagus, and you swallow them.

nartreb,

So in that vein, what do you say to the literature about ingested plastics messing with the endocrine system of mammals?

(This is just one of the many "bad things about plastics in the environment," just picking this one for now.)

Am honestly looking for your reasoned response; perhaps what I "know" is wrong, as you imply.

I really don't think it's blown out of proportion more than anything other thing we should be worrying about in the ecosystem; I think the ecosystem is staring at death by mosquito, honestly--lots of tiny, important things that add up.

nartreb said:

People get a little more freaked out about this than is reasonable.

You should be aware that you swallow several grams of micro-plastics daily.* It's probably not good for you, but it's obviously not catastrophic. Similarly, though it certainly is reasonable to worry about some species or ecosystems (e.g., sea turtles swallowing larger chunks of plastic because it looks like jellyfish, and subsequently dying of impacted gut), and unknown knock-on effects (if some small plankton are adversely affected, what does that do to the ecosystem as a whole?) there is plenty else to worry about when it comes to the health of the oceans and of the planet as a whole.

The vast majority of plastics are not much more dangerous than sand. You wouldn't want it in your eye, and you should take reasonable steps to keep it out of your food, but the fact that some of it ends up in the ocean is, on its own, not particularly alarming.

Click to expand...

There's chemical effects too - some plasticisers (stuff that keep plastics from going hard and brittle) act like sex hormones in the body; suggestions they may be implicated in heavily skewed sex ratios in various animals, which can result in severe population declines (saying this from memory of reading it; not checked publications).

Nutcracker said:

Even if all plastice are banned now, we'll still have the stuff we've already got, lingering in the environment for at least centuries, more likely millennia :-C

Click to expand...

It's even worse than that - as the current load of plastics breaks down to smaller and smaller particle sizes the total surface area vastly increases. This leads to even more toxins accumulating on these micro-plastics ..... adding bio-magnification to bio-accumulation. This affects the top of the food chain proportionally more - right where we sit.

It's getting harder to escape the exposure - micro-plastics are in the oceans, the soil (mostly via composted sewerage sludge, and some by road run-off too), the air, and by extension even rainwater, and aquifers.




Chosun :gh:

CalvinFold said:

This is one of those incredibly disturbing societal issues that I only think will change if we legislate plastics out of existence or have a foolproof way to recycle/reuse/destroy them back out of the environment after use.

Well, that or some of the biodegradable plastic substitutes being worked on.

But I still suspect that unless we make it mandatory, it will never happen.

Avoiding plastics these days as a consumer requires a truly Herculean effort and in many cases can't be avoided on a tight budget.

And after the big exposé brought to light after China restricted the import of mixed plastics, my heart has sunk rather further on the subject of plastics.

It really is a horrible mess.

Click to expand...

Kevin, As well as a domestic wind, solar powered, ground-source HVAC, passive solar designed bungalow and domestic EV powered transport, on site water collection, grey water recycling, and veggie gardens on a suburban plot, it looks great attention has to be paid to eliminating sources of plastic pollution, and dealing with that generated elsewhere.

It seems that a widespread source of microfiber pollution is clothing. You will have to filter your washing wastewater, have a first flush diverter on your rainwater collection (and then filtered before disposal of that small amount), and then filter all your rainwater collected and drinking water supplied. You will also have to be very careful with any compost or soil brought into the garden.

We also have to be vigilant over the ingredients in the products we use - makeup (where applicable ! , soaps, shower gels, shampoos, toothpaste, cleaners etc, etc. and careful of the containers we use and recycling that we do. I already tend towards glass or stainless steel drinking water containers wherever possible, but that Catalyst report was a real eye opener - it's not just the containers but the water itself!

Btw - I'd probably also look to get somewhere a bit higher and not on geological faults ! :cat:




Chosun :gh:

Chosun Juan said:

Kevin, As well as a domestic wind, solar powered, ground-source HVAC, passive solar designed bungalow and domestic EV powered transport, on site water collection, grey water recycling, and veggie gardens on a suburban plot, it looks great attention has to be paid to eliminating sources of plastic pollution, and dealing with that generated elsewhere.

It seems that a widespread source of microfiber pollution is clothing. You will have to filter your washing wastewater, have a first flush diverter on your rainwater collection (and then filtered before disposal of that small amount), and then filter all your rainwater collected and drinking water supplied. You will also have to be very careful with any compost or soil brought into the garden.

Click to expand...

I can't even imagine having that much land or resources at my disposal; though I envy those that do. I also marvel that those who do have the resources (around here), don't seem to make any concerted effort towards such goals as yours. It's confusing to me.

CalvinFold said:

nartreb,

So in that vein, what do you say to the literature about ingested plastics messing with the endocrine system of mammals?

(This is just one of the many "bad things about plastics in the environment," just picking this one for now.)

Am honestly looking for your reasoned response; perhaps what I "know" is wrong, as you imply.

I really don't think it's blown out of proportion more than anything other thing we should be worrying about in the ecosystem; I think the ecosystem is staring at death by mosquito, honestly--lots of tiny, important things that add up.

Click to expand...

Just what I said in my initial post - "probably not good for you, but obviously not catastrophic." If any mammals are going to suffer from endocrine disruption, it's long-lived, slow-breeding mammals like us. Most species can evolve faster and adjust their hormonal regulation. Could be bad news for whales or elephants, worth doing some research, but if we're going to say we care about them let's start with actually enforcing bans on whaling and elephant hunting.

Generally, although I don't completely dismiss the idea that multiple simultaneous threats to ecosystems can interact and "death by mosquito" can result, there are some clear and present dangers that need to be, and can more easily be, tackled head-on. In the coastal context, eutrophication (caused by agricultural runoff). Oceans generally, acidification and global warming. Terrestrial forests, clear-cutting.

CalvinFold said:

I can't even imagine having that much land or resources at my disposal; though I envy those that do. I also marvel that those who do have the resources (around here), don't seem to make any concerted effort towards such goals as yours. It's confusing to me.

Click to expand...

I'm not sure what your living situation is, but you could implement those things on a modern very stingy subdivision lot of say 400m2. Even if folks are on a terraced townhouse or duplex lot of as little as 150~250m2 it's still doable - admittedly you'd be doing a bit of vertical gardening etc - but that's ok, it could combine with a cool wall etc.

Residences and Buildings do need to be faced the right way though (towards the midday winter sun with appropriate sunlight access /shading controls). Your capacity to store much water might be reduced a bit unless it is designed from the get go (underground etc). Of course you need owners or other rights to install the solar pv generation and solar access (no significant shading).

Even apartment dwellers can do a bit (shared power generation, cutting edge window generation etc) and balcony gardens watered by small tanks. Not ideal but it all helps.

I think as far as eliminating micro-plastics goes it will be quickest implemented if it is consumer led - natural products (oatmeal scrub etc). Doing your own filtering (in and out), and making considered decisions on clothing and fabrics etc. I have owned quite a bit of technical gear throughout my life (early on realising that the only clothing that really worked was layers of Gore-Tex lined fleeces) - I noticed them thinning over the years, and I'm shocked to consider that may have contributed to the problem.

Also, I think the younger generations (well younger than me anyway ! need a bl**dy good kick up the *rs* !! Areas that I grew up in that I have visited recently are littered with rubbish along the sides of roads leading to /from /or through bush .... bl**dy disgraceful !!! :storm: The last ~20 years has seen a leftist driven perversion of positive psychology such that every mongrel child can do whatever the heck they want, the parents are too insecure and/or stoopid (or just plain feral themselves) to say boo to them, and society tells them they are all winners even when they finish dead last.

A lot of those very same generations are conscious consumers though so that's one good thing - they just need to move beyond the accepted culture of drugs, vapidness and 'selfies' long enough to become engaged with a sustainable future. Here's hoping, but in the advent they don't - those are the sustainability arrangements I'd be working towards .... you can also direct any investments ethically along those lines too :t:




Chosun :gh:

Chosun Juan said:

I'm not sure what your living situation is, but you could implement those things on a modern very stingy subdivision lot of say 400m2. Even if folks are on a terraced townhouse or duplex lot of as little as 150~250m2 it's still doable - admittedly you'd be doing a bit of vertical gardening etc - but that's ok, it could combine with a cool wall etc.

Click to expand...

Townhome, no yard, no balconies, not allowed to do anything in the common area (home owner's association, liability issues, etc.).

And this isn't unusual around here. Such is the price for "affordable" living of half-decent quality: higher density and HOAs.

CalvinFold said:

Townhome, no yard, no balconies, not allowed to do anything in the common area (home owner's association, liability issues, etc.).

And this isn't unusual around here. Such is the price for "affordable" living of half-decent quality: higher density and HOAs.

Click to expand...

Uggh - that's tough. You might be able to get a self contained planter (or hydroponics setup) etc and at least grow most herbs, and maybe some small veggies (mini tomatoes, cucumbers, carrots, beets etc). Supporting organic farmers markets if there are some near you is also valuable.

For renewable power, the HOA/building owners would have to get together to install the solar pv (and battery if applicable) infrastructure and agree on a suitable operating model and income share.

If you really really like people, it is possible to live cheek by jowl with a plethora of people and use your consumer and investor power to influence the story. For the price of a new car though you could set yourself up with the sustainability /renewable power generation infrastructure you need. It's just a matter of juggling location then - something to put on the bucket list anyway :t:



Chosun :gh:

nartreb said:

Just what I said in my initial post - "probably not good for you, but obviously not catastrophic." If any mammals are going to suffer from endocrine disruption, it's long-lived, slow-breeding mammals like us. Most species can evolve faster and adjust their hormonal regulation. Could be bad news for whales or elephants, worth doing some research, but if we're going to say we care about them let's start with actually enforcing bans on whaling and elephant hunting.

Generally, although I don't completely dismiss the idea that multiple simultaneous threats to ecosystems can interact and "death by mosquito" can result, there are some clear and present dangers that need to be, and can more easily be, tackled head-on. In the coastal context, eutrophication (caused by agricultural runoff). Oceans generally, acidification and global warming. Terrestrial forests, clear-cutting.

Click to expand...

I had typed up a long, detailed and considered reply - but a tab crash scotched that ! grrrr ...

Long story short - I agree there are other problems and then some - but micro-plastics is no trivial matter.

Ocean, land, surface and aquifer freshwater, even air - it affects the lot.

It is widespread from simplest organisms to the top of the food chain including us.

The research showed it is affecting the Web of Life. That's major. That leads to an increased risk of ecosystem collapse.

Micro-plastics cross the gut barrier into the bloodstream of the studied animals - overloading immune systems, and even a liver tumour was noted.

Then there is the effect on the reproduction systems.

Numbers are needed, but the case and conclusions seemed well made to me.

Read the transcript that I originally posted - cause for concern and further research, and countermeasures /action, in my book.



Chosun :gh:

A rather shocking photo of an Albatross feeding it's chick a gullet full of plastics - larger than the microplastics that are the subject of this thread, but as they break down in physical size the surface area and toxic load per particle increases exponentially ....... :-C
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?st...141&id=1557794451143875&anchor_composer=false





Chosun :gh:

nartreb said:

People get a little more freaked out about this than is reasonable.

You should be aware that you swallow several grams of micro-plastics daily.* It's probably not good for you, but it's obviously not catastrophic. Similarly, though it certainly is reasonable to worry about some species or ecosystems (e.g., sea turtles swallowing larger chunks of plastic because it looks like jellyfish, and subsequently dying of impacted gut), and unknown knock-on effects (if some small plankton are adversely affected, what does that do to the ecosystem as a whole?) there is plenty else to worry about when it comes to the health of the oceans and of the planet as a whole.

The vast majority of plastics are not much more dangerous than sand. You wouldn't want it in your eye, and you should take reasonable steps to keep it out of your food, but the fact that some of it ends up in the ocean is, on its own, not particularly alarming.

* Take a look at the lint screen in your clothes dryer. Chances are that most of what you see is small, broken bits of nylon, rayon, etc. Your clothes shed that all day long, and your carpets shed even more. A lot of that, especially the smallest bits, float through the air and end up in your lungs. From there, they get trapped in mucus and swept up to your esophagus, and you swallow them.

Click to expand...

BIB okay that's alright then - no need to worry about it.

How's about rather than defending and justifying the issue (my words not yours) - we act and don't wait until we are all screwed :smoke:

I wonder how a (human) baby in the womb will deal with micro plastics as it grows... |:||

Hi Chosun, all,

The attached review paper contains a lot of recent information, although it is a rapidly developing field so potentially subject to change.
As always, happy to download additional references if anyone is interested

Best,
Joost

It is raining plastics

"More than 90% of plastic waste is not recycled, and as it slowly degrades it breaks into smaller and smaller pieces. “Plastic fibers also break off your clothes every time you wash them,” Mason said, and plastic particles are byproducts of a variety of industrial processes."

"Rainwater samples collected across Colorado and analyzed under a microscope contained a rainbow of plastic fibers, as well as beads and shards." . :eek!:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.th...2/raining-plastic-colorado-usgs-microplastics

https://pubs.usgs.gov/of/2019/1048/ofr20191048.pdf




Chosun :gh:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-49295051

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-49380633

It'll all come out in the wash ! .....

"Don't set your washing machine to its 'delicate' setting: Scientists find a single spin creates 1.4MILLION microplastic fragments - 800,000 more than an average cycle"
https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www...leases-800-000-plastic-microfibres-modes.html

Sometimes I have to wonder if man even deserves to be here. What's the guarantee that any plastics used in road construction are going to stay locked up in there? Or with every passing vehicle, and every rainstorm does the same problem just continue?
http://www.igpn.org/news/2017/03/waste_materials_are_an_underus.html




Chosun :gh: