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Old Wednesday 17th January 2018, 17:30   #1
dries1
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New Bins for 2018

What do you think Nikon will come out with this year, new binoculars, any ideas?

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Old Wednesday 17th January 2018, 21:52   #2
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Hi,

a Monarch HG in 8x32 would make sense...

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Old Thursday 18th January 2018, 08:56   #3
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Joachim,

It will be interesting if they come out with one, Nikon seems to do a really great job with the 8X32 Format.
It can't be much smaller than the 8X42 which is a nice small tight package.

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Old Thursday 18th January 2018, 16:02   #4
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Nikon has made very few 8x32 binoculars in the last 18 years. Three, if my memory is correct. Two roof prisms in the EDG and HG/HGL series and one Porro prism; the 8x32 SE. All of them are Alphas.

Nikon has also made a couple of low to moderate priced 8x30 roof prisms which are found in the Monarch Series and Pro Staff series and are not in competition with the above EDG series.

They also made a popular Monarch ATB 8x36 roof prism which has been discontinued. There also was a 10x36.

http://www.nikonsportoptics.com/en/n...-8x36-atb.html

The 8x36 had only a 7º FOV.

Personally I think that the 8x36 format would be well suited to the new Monarch HG construction. That is my opinion only.

An 8x32 Monarch HG would, if it had a wide FOV, be in very close competition with the 8x32 EDG and at a much lower price.

Bob
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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 08:58   #5
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Hi,

well, I think Nikon can build 8x30 bins a lot smaller than the Monarch HG 8x42 - look at the tiny Monarch 7 8x30. I hope though that they will refrain from building extra tiny at the cost of some optical flaws - the M7 8x30 could have used a bit more baffling for better reflection and glare control plus in an MHD the field flattener will bring a bit of weight.

Regarding the list of nice Nikon 8x30 bins from Bob - it's missing the E2... and yes a very good MHD in 8x32 at $1000 or so will sure be a bit of competition to the EDG, but even more so for Conquest, Trinovid, CL et al.

Joachim
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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 15:29   #6
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Hi,

well, I think Nikon can build 8x30 bins a lot smaller than the Monarch HG 8x42 - look at the tiny Monarch 7 8x30. I hope though that they will refrain from building extra tiny at the cost of some optical flaws - the M7 8x30 could have used a bit more baffling for better reflection and glare control plus in an MHD the field flattener will bring a bit of weight.

Regarding the list of nice Nikon 8x30 bins from Bob - it's missing the E2... and yes a very good MHD in 8x32 at $1000 or so will sure be a bit of competition to the EDG, but even more so for Conquest, Trinovid, CL et al.

Joachim
I don't think Nikon makes anything in this segment.
Regarding the M7 8x30:
Swarovski came out with the "old" CL 30 and Kite Optics send a sample straight to Kamakura with the task "copy this one". The Kite Lynx was born. The volume Kamakura had to make for the pricetag was not what Kite had in mind so they contacted Nikon for a co-operation to get the required volume. Nikon wanted a lower pricetag so the modifications changed. The M7 was born.

Jan
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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 15:37   #7
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The Monarch HG 8x42 and the Monarch 7 8x30 have the same very wide 8.3º FOV. The big difference is that the HG also has a Flat Field and the Monarch 7 does not which shows in their prices.

Nikon only makes 6 wide field roof prism binoculars, which includes the 2 HGs and 3 Monarch 7s, and they only make 7 binoculars with Field flatteners (the 5 EDG's and 2 HG's. The HG/Ls are discontinued). And note that Nikon does not consider the EDGs as being "wide field" binoculars although most users would consider them as having wide FOVs.

So making a Monarch HG 8x32 with an 8º or more FOV and giving it a Flat Field will put it directly in competition with the 8x32 EDG which has a 7.8º FOV at about 1/2 the price of the EDG. Perhaps giving the 8x32 HG a FOV of less than 7.8º will solve that dilemma?

See the Nikon "Performance Icons Compatible Chart below:

http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/spor...e_Chart_En.pdf

Bob

Last edited by ceasar : Friday 19th January 2018 at 15:44.
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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 16:50   #8
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Hi,

thanks to Jan for an interesting inside view... Regarding cannibalizing your own top model vs. giving the competition a hard time in the upper middle class... Nikon has already done the same thing with the 42mm MHD models.

As to why, we can only speculate. My theory is that the EDG is unfortunately not selling that well among the alphas, as can be seen by fairly moderate pricing.
Reasons might be their weight, size and probably most important in that range, the lack of a well known blue, red or silver logo...

So maybe the rationale was to try to get a good market share at the $1000 price point and if they loose a few sales of EDG (which at their current price point might not be too lucrative for Nikon anyways) to the MHD, so be it.

Joachim
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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 16:51   #9
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Bob,

AFAIK does Nikon no optics production on themselves (except for the EDG series) but outsources everything to OEM's like I mentioned above just like Bushnell and all the others do.

Jan
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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 16:56   #10
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Speaking of FOV, I have been looking through the 8X32 EDG and the FL 8X32 and between the 8 degrees and the 7.8 for the EDGs and my HG 8X32, it is difficult to notice any real difference. I just wonder that Nikon now has the 8 and 10 X42 HGs which already compete with the EDGs in the same format, perhaps they are waiting on the sales of the new HGs before they pull the trigger on the 8X32s, or, that since the 8X42 and 10X42 EDGs are likely lower sellers than the 8X32 EDGs they will only produce those formats, so not to compete with the Monarch 8X30 and the 8X32 EDGs.

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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 20:19   #11
jan van daalen
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Originally Posted by jring View Post
Hi,

thanks to Jan for an interesting inside view... Regarding cannibalizing your own top model vs. giving the competition a hard time in the upper middle class... Nikon has already done the same thing with the 42mm MHD models.

As to why, we can only speculate. My theory is that the EDG is unfortunately not selling that well among the alphas, as can be seen by fairly moderate pricing.
Reasons might be their weight, size and probably most important in that range, the lack of a well known blue, red or silver logo...

So maybe the rationale was to try to get a good market share at the $1000 price point and if they loose a few sales of EDG (which at their current price point might not be too lucrative for Nikon anyways) to the MHD, so be it.

Joachim
Hi Joachim,

Don't know how it is in Germany, but in Holland Nikon is only represented in the Photo sales channel. Red, bleu and silver are also represented in the hunting, travel-leasure and birding sales channels.
IMHO the EDG is in performance absolutely compatible to the top dogs of red, blue and silver, but taking the aspect of after sales service in consideration they are on North Korea 2.0 level (same as Canon in that aspect with their absolutely superior IS bins).
For them optics is peanuts compared to the photo sales and is treated accordingly.

Jan

Last edited by jan van daalen : Friday 19th January 2018 at 20:57. Reason: typo
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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 23:15   #12
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Hi Jan,

yes indeed, the marketing for Nikon sports optics leaves room for improvement. The lower and mid range series are often found in electronics malls right beside the cameras - sometimes a cheap M7 demo can be snagged up there...

In specialized stores for Birding, Hunting and Outdoor Nikon is sometimes available, sometimes not. But usually the top series are not on offer - If I would want to buy an MHG or EDG in a brick and mortar store, I would have to do a lot of searching online and probably drive for hours.

Joachim
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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 23:26   #13
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Hi Joachim,

Don't know how it is in Germany, but in Holland Nikon is only represented in the Photo sales channel. Red, bleu and silver are also represented in the hunting, travel-leasure and birding sales channels.
IMHO the EDG is in performance absolutely compatible to the top dogs of red, blue and silver, but taking the aspect of after sales service in consideration they are on North Korea 2.0 level (same as Canon in that aspect with their absolutely superior IS bins).
For them optics is peanuts compared to the photo sales and is treated accordingly.

Jan
Jan,

I don't know anything about Nikon's service on the EDGs in Europe but in the USA, I know from personal experience that if one has registered their EDG with Nikon USA and a problem with its construction subsequently occurs Nikon will repair it or replace it at their cost with a new EDG.

Note that this policy applies to any new Nikon binocular that is registered with Nikon USA.

I owned a 10x32 EDG I for 4 years when its covering started to bubble and come loose. I followed Nikon's procedure in contacting them about it and they replaced it with a brand new 10x32 EDG II. My only costs were for the shipping and insurance in sending it to Nikon USA.

Nikon's response was prompt and efficient. I was advised that there would be a 2 week delay in order for Nikon USA to get a new one from Japan. (Perhaps they had to make a new one? Who knows?)

Incidentally one can purchase any Nikon binocular directly from Nikon USA right off their website. Information about any back orders is noted like with the 8x42 EDG below:

http://www.nikonsportoptics.com/en/n.../edg-8x42.html



Bob

Last edited by ceasar : Friday 19th January 2018 at 23:37.
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Old Friday 19th January 2018, 23:55   #14
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In Spain is little known as a sport optics brand,yet people recognizes the brand as top quality, so the right market strategy would grant them a better niche in that market...their customer service and technical service,for optics,need serious training as well....
Back to the binos...Maybe they introduce a line of EDG porros to replace the SE !!!!!..the SEdg !!!
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Old Saturday 20th January 2018, 00:59   #15
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Incoming

I have the 8X32 EDG shown here with the FL 8X32, the big brother is incoming early next week.
By the way I was stargazing with the HG 8X32 tonight,and with the flat field really enjoyed the view. In Scope Views, the author still likes the HG, though a bit darker than the new glass, it is still a great glass in its own right.

A.W.

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Old Saturday 20th January 2018, 03:09   #16
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My theory is that the EDG is unfortunately not selling that well among the alphas, as can be seen by fairly moderate pricing.
Reasons might be their weight, size and probably most important in that range, the lack of a well known blue, red or silver logo...
They are the most expensive binoculars in their respective ranges at B&H, that hardly qualifies as moderate pricing. That also explains why they are special-order-only.

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Old Saturday 20th January 2018, 09:38   #17
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Hi Jan,

yes indeed, the marketing for Nikon sports optics leaves room for improvement. The lower and mid range series are often found in electronics malls right beside the cameras - sometimes a cheap M7 demo can be snagged up there...

In specialized stores for Birding, Hunting and Outdoor Nikon is sometimes available, sometimes not. But usually the top series are not on offer - If I would want to buy an MHG or EDG in a brick and mortar store, I would have to do a lot of searching online and probably drive for hours.

Joachim
Hi Joachim,

Down here you won't find them in any brick&mortar store except those of the photobranche.
Nikon is/was represented for the non-photobranche by a external distributor who had to take his margin which came on top of the purchage price.
The photo branche didn't have to pay that "added value" and together with their end year bonus (camera sales included) their consumer prices were below our purchage prices.
Exit Nikon in the other sales channels.

Canon decided to bring their distribution exclusivly at 3 purchaging volume groups of which the (photo)retailer has to become a member of. On this way Canon has no "hassle" with dealing of hundreds of retailers. Same result: no Canon present except in the photo channel.

Jan
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Old Saturday 20th January 2018, 10:00   #18
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Hi Joachim,

Down here you won't find them in any brick&mortar store except those of the photobranche.
Nikon is/was represented for the non-photobranche by a external distributor who had to take his margin which came on top of the purchage price.
The photo branche didn't have to pay that "added value" and together with their end year bonus (camera sales included) their consumer prices were below our purchage prices.
Exit Nikon in the other sales channels.

Canon decided to bring their distribution exclusivly at 3 purchaging volume groups of which the (photo)retailer has to become a member of. On this way Canon has no "hassle" with dealing of hundreds of retailers. Same result: no Canon present except in the photo channel.

Jan
In the UK the situation is the same as mentioned by Joachim. For example the In Focus Group, Focus Optics and Cley Spy all list Nikon but only show a handful of models at the maximum and none of these lists EDG.

Lee
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Old Saturday 20th January 2018, 12:51   #19
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They are the most expensive binoculars in their respective ranges at B&H, that hardly qualifies as moderate pricing. That also explains why they are special-order-only.

There are only 5 Nikon EDGs in traditional 42mm and 32mm formats and they are priced very competitively with their equivalent Zeiss and Swarovski binoculars. Here is a B&H link listing the prices of Nikon, Zeiss and Swarovski binoculars from highest to lowest:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/searc...&N=4083534123&

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Old Saturday 20th January 2018, 13:01   #20
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They are the most expensive binoculars in their respective ranges at B&H, that hardly qualifies as moderate pricing. That also explains why they are special-order-only.
It is pretty clear that the EDG models are not meant to compete with Zeiss Conquest or Kowa Genesis for example, so in that sense one could say their pricing isn't moderate, but they are very competitive at the alpha level as Bob has pointed out, and there can be many reasons for 'special-order' status which it would not be fruitful to speculate about.

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Old Saturday 20th January 2018, 22:04   #21
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Hi,

as has been said, here in germany it's hard to find a brick & mortar store to try Nikon EDGs in, so one can only compare online prices - there they tend to be at the lower end of current alphas while being equal or better optically and mechanically.

They're lacking the super wide field of the Zeiss SF or the super light and small package of an FL 8x32 and of course the premium label - unlike the other alpha manufacturers Nikon offers optics in all price ranges (although Zeiss is also trying entry level)...

Joachim
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 21:56   #22
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A new 8X42 EDG arrived today as if it came off the show room floor (with the new car/rubber odor). I paid less than retail, much less, and preliminary findings are that every thing functions like my 8X32 EDG and the diopter I find easy to use and works flawlessly. While both were purchased second hand from the initial owners, both are mint and function perfectly. The 8X32 was purchased new from eagle Optics in 2016 new, and the 8X42 were purchased from the original owner who had an EDG 1 which when sent to Nikon for repair, was replaced with this EDG II, the bino is about 1 year old. Here it is next to the MHG another fine 8X42.

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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 22:53   #23
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Pics here

Pics here.

A.W.

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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2018, 04:00   #24
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A new 8X42 EDG arrived today as if it came off the show room floor (with the new car/rubber odor). I paid less than retail, much less, and preliminary findings are that every thing functions like my 8X32 EDG and the diopter I find easy to use and works flawlessly. While both were purchased second hand from the initial owners, both are mint and function perfectly. The 8X32 was purchased new from eagle Optics in 2016 new, and the 8X42 were purchased from the original owner who had an EDG 1 which when sent to Nikon for repair, was replaced with this EDG II, the bino is about 1 year old. Here it is next to the MHG another fine 8X42.

A.W.
Eagle Optics still had Nikons to sell in 2016? I'm trying to remember when Nikon dropped them. I know Eagle Optics wasn't pleased when it happened and it was a subject of discussion here. I thought it was a couple of years earlier than 2016 but I could be wrong.

Bob
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2018, 04:20   #25
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I can only repeat what the seller told me, but perhaps he could be off by a year. I have no idea about the Nikon/Eagle optic relationship, too bad Eagle Optics seemed to be a good outfit. The serial number seems high enough.

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