Greater Crested Tern in Djibouti (1 Viewer)

Aladdin · Oct 14, 2018

Dear members and bird watchers

I have seen a few Tern and I have identified them as Great Crested Terns mould in to winter plumage, they all fly with a fork tail as the bird in the first picture.

But today I spotted one bird flying with a tail formed as a V. Anyone know the reason for the different tail?

For me it seems that they are flying in the same way but different tails

Kind regards
Aladdin

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aeshna5 · Oct 14, 2018

Agree they are Greater Crested/Swift Terns.

sicklebill · Oct 14, 2018

The Crested (Swift) Terns I see in Queensland have greenish-yellow bills, whereas Lesser Crested have orange bills like these birds, and show the very white forehead pictured here. I imagine the tail fork is due to either moult or the way the bird is holding the tail.

Nutcracker · Oct 14, 2018

sicklebill said:
The Crested (Swift) Terns I see in Queensland have greenish-yellow bills, whereas Lesser Crested have orange bills like these birds, and show the very white forehead pictured here. I imagine the tail fork is due to either moult or the way the bird is holding the tail.

The pics look very red-toned to me, both in the brown-ness of the bird and the water colour - if I edit this (below), the bill ends up yellower. Also, this bird is much too dark for Lesser Crested, which is only marginally darker than Sandwich Tern, and the bill also too massive for LCT (bill almost identical to Sandwich in size & shape). So I'd go for Greater (proviso: no personal experience of Greater!).

Aladdin · Oct 15, 2018

Nutcracker said:
The pics look very red-toned to me, both in the brown-ness of the bird and the water colour - if I edit this (below), the bill ends up yellower. Also, this bird is much too dark for Lesser Crested, which is only marginally darker than Sandwich Tern, and the bill also too massive for LCT (bill almost identical to Sandwich in size & shape). So I'd go for Greater (proviso: no personal experience of Greater!).

Nutcracker, thanks again. You have really been a great help here on Birdforum

They might be a bit redish as it is early morning and the sun is really red

You remember our Gull thread a while back, the gull pictures from the forest and I had a hard time see the colour on the legs becaue of the very red sun

The Tern really have a bright yellow bill when they come in to the shadow and during the day, more orange in the early morning sun shine

They are flying by and as I pan following the bird I go from different light condition and water and bird change tone and colour for every picture. I'm not any good at the bird pictures but I practise as much as I can. But it is very hard as the light condition changes every second as the bird is moving

Thanks again and kind regards
Aladdin

Aladdin · Oct 15, 2018

sicklebill said:
The Crested (Swift) Terns I see in Queensland have greenish-yellow bills, whereas Lesser Crested have orange bills like these birds, and show the very white forehead pictured here. I imagine the tail fork is due to either moult or the way the bird is holding the tail.

Thank you very much sicklebill

Yes, I was reacting as all of them have the fork tail and suddenly one with the V so that made me wonder

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin

Aladdin · Oct 15, 2018

Thank you

aeshna5 said:
Agree they are Greater Crested/Swift Terns.

Thank you very much aeshna5

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin

sicklebill · Oct 15, 2018

Nutcracker said:
The pics look very red-toned to me, both in the brown-ness of the bird and the water colour - if I edit this (below), the bill ends up yellower. Also, this bird is much too dark for Lesser Crested, which is only marginally darker than Sandwich Tern, and the bill also too massive for LCT (bill almost identical to Sandwich in size & shape). So I'd go for Greater (proviso: no personal experience of Greater!).

Queensland Crested Terns never have bills this colour, and both colour and shape looks OK for Lesser Crested to me as well, as does the very white forehead, I don't agree the bills are too massive and I was looking at both species just last week. The only thing that bugs me is how dark they appear, happy to be enlightened otherwise......

jmorlan · Oct 16, 2018

Lesser Crested Tern (Thalasseus bengalensis torresii) & Great Crested Terns (Thalasseus bergii cristatus)30 July 2014. East Point, Darwin, NT, Australia.
Here a Lesser Crested Tern in the center is flanked by two Great Crested Terns for comparison. To me, bill color looks yellow on Greater and decidedly orange on Lesser but I wouldn't be surprised if they vary some. Other species include two (Australian) Gull-billed Terns on the far left, a preening Pacific Golden-Plover on the right and numerous Great Knots. Digiscoped with Panasonic DMC-LZ5 | Nikon FieldScope III | 30XWA | hand-held (no adapter)

Aladdin · Oct 16, 2018

sicklebill said:
Queensland Crested Terns never have bills this colour, and both colour and shape looks OK for Lesser Crested to me as well, as does the very white forehead, I don't agree the bills are too massive and I was looking at both species just last week. The only thing that bugs me is how dark they appear, happy to be enlightened otherwise......

Hello sicklebill

The tern is kind of dark grey but still a huge difference from the blackish feathers on the tip. I don´t know, but I think some of the darkness is due to underexposure with the bright background. Quick shutter speed and the dark is getting darker.

The bills are really bright yellow on these birds and they are sticking out even from a great distance.

See attached picture of a picture I had thrown away as it is too far away and in poor quality. I have over exposure the picture to compensate for the back light 0.33 EV

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin

sicklebill · Oct 16, 2018

Thanks for sending the throwaway pic, again to me I'd call this Lesser Crested, that orange bill is the clincher for me, and I'm pleased this one looks pale like they usually do! Thanks also to Joe Morlan for his shots of the two species together, his shot shows the greeny-yellow of Crested as compared to the orange of Lesser Crested very nicely.

Nutcracker · Oct 16, 2018

One caution: the subspecies of both species in Djibouti, are different to the subspecies in Australia. Not sure how this might affect bill colour & mantle tone.

MacNara · Oct 17, 2018

sicklebill said:
Thanks also to Joe Morlan for his shots of the two species together, his shot shows the greeny-yellow of Crested as compared to the orange of Lesser Crested very nicely.

Yes, here's another one also from Queensland. In my mind, Lesser was a lot smaller than Greater, but it isn't actually such a big difference. But the bill colour is very different.

jmorlan · Oct 17, 2018

Nutcracker said:
One caution: the subspecies of both species in Djibouti, are different to the subspecies in Australia. Not sure how this might affect bill colour & mantle tone.

Apparently the subspecies of Lesser are rather poorly differentiated from what I've read. I have seen Greater in Australia and South Africa and my photos look about the same except for seasonal differences. Greater has a dull yellow bill in both. The form of Greater found in Djibouti is race velox which is the largest and darkest race and has the longest bill. My only experience with Lesser is from Australia where the orange bill of Lesser and overall bulk recall the slim orange bill of Elegant Tern which is a bird I see often in California. To me, all the photos of the Djibouti terns lack the orange bill color and I would call them Greater based on what I see as a cold yellow color. Another point is their streaked and unevenly marked hood in non-breeding plumage. Don't Lesser Crested usually show a more solid black nape patch? And there is also the uniform gray rump and upperside of the tail. Don't Lesser Crested usually have more contrasting white tail as well as overall paler mantle?

Aladdin · Oct 17, 2018

jmorlan said:
Lesser Crested Tern (Thalasseus bengalensis torresii) & Great Crested Terns (Thalasseus bergii cristatus)30 July 2014. East Point, Darwin, NT, Australia.
Here a Lesser Crested Tern in the center is flanked by two Great Crested Terns for comparison. To me, bill color looks yellow on Greater and decidedly orange on Lesser but I wouldn't be surprised if they vary some. Other species include two (Australian) Gull-billed Terns on the far left, a preening Pacific Golden-Plover on the right and numerous Great Knots. Digiscoped with Panasonic DMC-LZ5 | Nikon FieldScope III | 30XWA | hand-held (no adapter)

Great pictures! Actually a dream picture with two different bird together like this. Easy to see the difference

If I should go for the colour of the bill and what I see I say it is a Great Crested Tern that I see around me.

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin

Aladdin · Oct 17, 2018

MacNara said:
Yes, here's another one also from Queensland. In my mind, Lesser was a lot smaller than Greater, but it isn't actually such a big difference. But the bill colour is very different.

Hello MacNara

Same here, I would go for the yellow bill for the birds I see around here. The orangein your picture looks almost red

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin

MacNara · Oct 17, 2018

Aladdin said:
If I should go for the colour of the bill and what I see I say it is a Great Crested Tern that I see around me.

Aladdin said:
Same here, I would go for the yellow bill for the birds I see around here. The orange in your picture looks almost red.

Well, for my own part, I thought the colour of the bill of your bird in post #1 was orangey and closer to Lesser Crested, as Sicklebill suggested.

Of course, arguments from authority are not conclusive, since even the greatest experts can be wrong sometimes, but Sicklebill under his actual name is one of the world's leading birders, possibly the most distinguished birder who generously contributes his knowledge on Bird Forum even to ignoramuses like me, so I would give his opinion on a bird he sees regularly a lot of weight; and he thinks it's Lesser, and that your third picture in post #10 is fine for Lesser, not Greater, not just on bill colour but on overall colour and patterning.

Aladdin · Oct 17, 2018

MacNara said:
Well, for my own part, I thought the colour of the bill of your bird in post #1 was orangey and closer to Lesser Crested, as Sicklebill suggested.

Of course, arguments from authority are not conclusive, since even the greatest experts can be wrong sometimes, but Sicklebill under his actual name is one of the world's leading birders, possibly the most distinguished birder who generously contributes his knowledge on Bird Forum even to ignoramuses like me, so I would give his opinion on a bird he sees regularly a lot of weight; and he thinks it's Lesser, and that your third picture in post #10 is fine for Lesser, not Greater, not just on bill colour but on overall colour and patterning.

Thank you MacNara

I will try to get some more pictures. I´m mostly in the morning so it is very red around here with the sun rise.

And I´m also a ignoramuses as I´m all new to this birding and I have learned to ID some of the colourful birds. But the sea birds are very hard and I have only been looking at Gulls since the summer when I learned to see difference between Herring gull and the common gull and it started to get fun.

Kind regards and happy birding, and I will hopefully be able to get some more pictures in a good light
Aladdin

jmorlan · Oct 17, 2018

MacNara said:
....and that your third picture in post #10 is fine for Lesser, not Greater, not just on bill colour but on overall colour and patterning.

FWIW I agree that the bird in post #10 looks good for Lesser with its solid black crest. On second look, the birds in post #1 with streaky black crests and dark mantle seem different at first but I now agree their bill color and shape also suggest Lesser.

Aladdin · Oct 17, 2018

jmorlan said:
FWIW I agree that the bird in post #10 looks good for Lesser with its solid black crest. On second look, the birds in post #1 with streaky black crests and dark mantle seem different at first but I now agree their bill color and shape also suggest Lesser.

Cheers jmorlan

Well, it is very hard to see for me. It started to pour down here today, first rain since I arrived to Djibouti so today there will most likely not be any pictures of the terns.

But I have one picture of a Great Crested Tern that I took on Fiji in October last year. I can see the black wing tip as I have on my birds in the two first pictures.

But I took quite a few pictures on Fiji and not all of them have the black tip. Maybe they hold the wings differently like the the terns flying with a fork tail and a V tail

I will return as soon as I can get any good pictures of the tern here in Djibouti, but they are very hard to catch as they are quick.

I saw two of them fighting the other day but they were friends by the time my camera was ready

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin

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