sharpness issues? (1 Viewer)

marcel steenkist · Feb 7, 2010

hi all, been out all day yesterday shooting waterfowl
Upon return find all images quite unsharp
I shoot in RAW, use lightroom, also use nikon d2x with gitzo tripod with gimberly head. even static objects appear unsharp on cropping i.e a wall from 10 meters away.
use a nikon 300mm 2.8 vr with nikon1.4 teleconverter. have tried hi/low iso and different apertures. there is no camera shake, as tripod combo is rock solid. use (S) AF and spotmetering and centred focussing

I see those pin sharp images on the forum but cant seem to get same results
any tips, attached moorhen picture I took from about 30 meters

marcel

RJM · Feb 7, 2010

You shot that pic at 1/100sec. Way too slow for a moving animal at 420mm on a crop sensor camera even with VR on a tripod mount. You need to be at least 1/600sec. That means raising ISO (and on your old generation 1 D2X that will be a bad thing since this was already ISO640) or opening up the aperture to F4 which will mean less depth of field. And only use Spot metering on a backlit target.

good luck,
Rick

marcel steenkist · Feb 7, 2010

thanks rick,

will try to keep shutters speeds at approx focal length for cropped sensor
does the D2X generate a lot of noise?
helpfull tips though
marcel

Duke Leto · Feb 7, 2010

Fair to say the older the body the likelyhood that noise will be an issue at higher iso's on a d2x probably wise not to use anything higher than 800. Practising panning will pay dividends, even at speeds hgher than 1/1000 it's still not easy getting a pin sharp image

Derry · Feb 7, 2010

would also recommend a bright day when you have good contrast,,

you don't see a lot of photos taken on overcast days offering razor sharp details,, need some good light,, also agree on the speed issue,, the faster the better,,

Derry

GYRob · Feb 7, 2010

in cs3 i gave it +30 contrast and +10 brightness ,then magnetic lasso round the bird and gave it 125 sharpness radius 0.6 - 0 threshold
Then save for web
then reopen in cs3 and give a further 80 sharpness then save for web ready to post.
hopefully its better

Rob.

RJM · Feb 7, 2010

Frankly, don't think there is much you can do in post processing to fix this. Using Spot instead of Matrix metering did not help get the correct exposure. One of the reasons to pick Nikon over Canon is Nikon's superb RGB Matrix metering.

Post processing of the RAW file can let you adjust exposure for up too ~2 stops but does nothing for sharpness due to blur. In this case, the shutter speed was basically 3 stops too slow. You would have had to shoot this at ISO 1600 and F4 to get the shutter speed up to an acceptable level for moving target like a bird. Having VR doesn't really help in this situation.

The D90 has the best cropped sensor performance of all current cameras so upgrading to it would gain you another stop over the D2x. The new D3s would get you 2 stops, but since it is FX you would loose the crop "magnification" DX advantage that is important when using the 300mm f2.8.

Rick

Neil · Feb 8, 2010

Marcel,
For birds I don't like to be under 1/800th second unless the bird is standing still. There heads always seem to be moving, either eating or watching.
I noticed that the bird is off-center so it's possible that focus was not on the bird. I find , even with my D3, that the further I move from the Center Focus spot the more unreliable the AF becomes, particularly in low light.
It's also worth checking your camera/lens combo for Front/Back focusing issues.
Neil

marcel steenkist · Feb 9, 2010

as always thank you for the contributions,
getting my head around the iso issue, has sharpness anything to do with the iso setting as such? I was inclined to think that F settings were more important, but pls enlighten me. I tend to shoot at shallow depth of field to blur out background, but by doing so do i render more of the subject unsharp?
marcel

ps GYROB thanks for editing in CS3, makes a difference, I only use lightroom and photoshop essentials!

swainsons · Feb 9, 2010

This is very much similiar to issues I have been having, only difference I use a Sigma 150-500, and upgraded from a D60 to D90, and honestly, I have seen an improvement, but still not happy. I am suprised you dont get better results with the 300 f2.8. Suspect you have a light issue more than anything. I have also started shooting at -0.3EV, a tip I got from another D90 user. Time will tell if that helps???

A nice setting on the D90 is that you can set Max ISO and min shutter speed, dunno if you can do that on the D2X.

Post Processing will only get you so far, sadly!!!

I shot the attached at ISO800 and it did not bother me at all.

Regards,

marcel steenkist · Feb 9, 2010

Hi,

i dont think the material is to blame, just my technique i suppose!
the 300/F2.8 lens is fantastic but light here in ireland has been really dull/murky and overcast, must be that, even on full open aperature in those conditions you may not get the shutter speed required without increasing the iso values. Since joining this forum already learned loats new. like to learn more on how to achieve bright sharp pictures, especially how speed/iso/aperture play a role in this. I have the gitzo tripod/wimberly head with remote control for the camera, so camera shake is something I have excluded from the equasion i think. more learning objectives would more focus on camera settings/technique i suppose. Your picture seems ok to me, but your light is defenitely a lot better!!

marcel

gvca1 · Feb 11, 2010

ISO shouldn't have much to do with sharpness when in RAW. Basically, high ISO just means more noise, and a raising of the noise floor in the blacks, which kills contrast. Contrast is a big contributor to perceived sharpness, as previous posters have suggested.

In JPEG mode, OTOH, I think that sharpness is dinged by high ISO's. The codec may try to do some noise reduction, which will improve compression, and noise reduction usually involves some loss of resolution.

As to aperture, the 300 f/2.8 VR is superb wide open, so that should not really be a factor, either.

So, to agree with previous replies-- since you're shooting RAW, that leaves shutter speed, camera support, focus issues, and, of course, just having enough light to begin with.

BTW, just having a Gitzo tripod with a Wimberly head doesn't guarantee a stable platform. When you put your 'pod down on soft ground, you can still get noticeable camera shake.

Maybe you could post a couple more examples. I'm wondering if there might be a bit of front-focus in your posted image, as some of the grass blades on the right might be a little sharper than the bird?

Oh, yeah, one more thing: If you DO have solid support and a good 'pod, and you have your Wimberly head locked down, you're better off shooting the 300 f/2.8 VR I with VR OFF. The VR II has 'tripod mode', but I'm not sure that the VR I does?

Jim

tombac · Feb 11, 2010

I have had exactly the same problem with my D300 and 300mm 2.8 VR lens +1.7 converter..
Shooting on non moving birds with camera on tripod. (sometimes even used flash+ better beamer). Tried Vr on and off. As soon as the bird is littel further away the problem occures! Many times I'm not happy at all! I think the problem is in the focusig. Maby back or front focusing? I really dont know!

RJM · Feb 11, 2010

Try this to see if it is your gear or your technique,
http://www.birdsasart-blog.com/2010/01/29/basic-sharpness-testing/

The last paragraph is particularly important to remember. Take LOTS OF PICS with the knowledge less than half may be acceptablely sharp with only 10% of those being technically good enough to keep and with only a handful of those interesting enough to print or show off to friends.

Rick

marcel steenkist · Feb 11, 2010

again thank you for all the contributions, am strengthened by the fact of last poster: only a few off all photos taken may be of acceptable quality. having said that, I will go out this weekend, weather is very cold and clear now, and practise focussing on static objects, using different speeds and apertures
marcel

stoop · Feb 11, 2010

Man, back in the days of slide film it cost a dollar a shot so I wanted more than a 10% success rate. I think it's good to get every shot as sharp and as technically spot-on as can be. Some rare encounters may only be fleeting so don't waste your time shooting off blindly! (I'm not a fan of any make of teleconvertor).

tombac · Feb 11, 2010

Photos taken with the TC 1.7 on the 300mmVR at close range are razorsharp! I think I have to try different AF-settings.

Duke Leto · Feb 11, 2010

if you review the images in camera It'll show you which focus zone was used for the shot, it may help you work out where you're focusing on. personally if its a static bird I only ever use single point AF

tombac · Feb 11, 2010

I use AF-S and I always try to put the focusingpoint at the eye. Could be that the focuspoint is to small and does not focus where it should. Have to do some testshooting now.

Gaz Shilton · Feb 11, 2010

It's also worth checking your camera/lens combo for Front/Back focusing issues.

How do you check for this?
I feel I could/should be getting better results with my 1D MkIII on a 300f2.8 even with converters.

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