Isidore Geoffroy Saint-Hilaire in isidori and a certain geoffroyi … (1 Viewer)

Here´s another exercise in both translation and understanding of French …

As far as I (without knowledge of French) understand it the two species:
1. Black-and-chestnut Eagle (Spizaetus) Oroaetus isidori DES MURS 1845 (a k a "Isidore's Eagle" or "Isidor's Eagle") and ...
2. Wedge-billed Hummingbird (Schistes) Augastes geoffroyi BOURCIER 1843 (a k a Geoffrey's Wedgebill)
... both commemorates the French zoologist, ornithologist, professor: Isidore Geoffroy Saint-Hilaire (1805–1861), for many years manager of the collections at "Jardin des plantes" (The Zoological Garden of Muséum national d'histoire naturelle) in Paris.

Anyone in opposition so far?

The Former (the Eagle) was described [as Falco (!) Isidori] in: Des Murs, O. 1845. Description de quelques espèces d’Oiseaux. Revue Zoologique, par la Societé Cuvierienne 8:175-179 (attached; as No 1) + an additional Note, by the same author, further on in the same journal; pp. (207) 208-211 (attached; as No 2) … with the following dedication (from page 175, in No 1.):

”Seulement, à l’exception de ces quatre Oiseaux, rangés tous dans les Aigles-Autours, celui que nous avons dédié, comme hommage de notre respect, à M. le professeur Isidore Geoffroy–Saint–Hilaire, constitue véritablement un Aigle proprement dit, et est le premier de ce genre ou de cette familille qui présent ornement particulier.”

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Does No 2, especially pp. 208-211, says anything additional? Or just worth knowing?

The latter (the Humming-bird) was described on page 101-102 [as Trochilus Geoffroyi] in: Bourcier, J. 1843. OISEAUX-MOUCHES noveaux. Revue Zoologique, par la Société Cuvierienne 6: 99-104. (attached) … with the following dedication:

”Nous avons dédié cette espèce, remarquable par la forme de son bec, à M. Isidore Geoffroy St.-Hilaire, membre de l’Institut et professeur administrateur au Jardin du Roi.”

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Without knowing any French I have to ask you all, dear Bird Forum readers: Anyone feel like translating those two quotes? If so, please, as accurate as possible, as I would like to quote them myself in Swedish. And don´t hesitate to remark on any errors that I might have done transcribing it!

Or if it reveals anything else about Mr. (M = Monsieur) Isidore Geoffroy Saint-Hilaire?

For me it´s even hard to tell if his Family name is Geoffroy Saint-Hilaire or Saint-Hilaire (with or without hyphen) and if Isidore is his (one and only) First/Christian name!? Does anyone of our French readers know his correct name and how it is written?
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PS. Not to be confused with his father, zoologist and professor (as well): Étienne Geoffroy Saint-Hilaire (1772–1844), his predecessor in the same "Jardin des plantes" – who is commemorated in several other birds and various other species. (To whom the same spelling rules might apply?)

Whitout any responses to this post I have to "push on", and will go for (as in #1):

Isidore Geoffroy Saint-Hilaire (1805–1861), whose double Family name (or even triple, if you feel like it?) sometimes is written (without hyphen) as Geoffroy Saint Hilaire.

Still no-one with an uncontrolled urge to translate those two quotes from French?

The second one is just by language fairly easy

Nous avons dédié cette espèce, remarquable par la forme de son bec, à M. Isidore Geoffroy St.-Hilaire, membre de l’Institut et professeur administrateur au Jardin du Roi.

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"We dedicate this species which is remarkable for the shape of its beak to M. Isidore Geoffroy St.-Hilaire, member of the institute and administrative professor of Jardin du Roi (this surely must mean Royal Gardens).

However, you have to do the digging to figure which institute and if they had a top position they called "administrative professor" (administrating professor?) or if the intent was "professor and administrator"? The last form would be my guess.

Niels

njlarsen said:

Jardin du Roi (this surely must mean Royal Gardens).

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The "Jardin des Plantes de Paris" used to be the "Jardin du Roi".

”Seulement, à l’exception de ces quatre Oiseaux, rangés tous dans les Aigles-Autours, celui que nous avons dédié, comme hommage de notre respect, à M. le professeur Isidore Geoffroy–Saint–Hilaire, constitue véritablement un Aigle proprement dit, et est le premier de ce genre ou de cette familille qui présent ornement particulier.”

As none of our Francophone members have come out yet, I'll have a stab.
I hope this will provoke someone into correcting me ...

"Alone, with the exception of these four Birds, all included in the Hawk-Eagles, this one, which we have dedicated, as a mark of our respect, to Professor Isidore Geoffroy-Saint-Hilaire, in truth is an Eagle sensu stricto, and is the first of this genus or of this sub-family showing particular ornamentation."

Notes :
1. I do not know exactly what "Aigles-Autours" are: Aigle is Eagle, and Autour Goshawk - the word may be used for Hawk-Eagles, or may also include Serpent-Eagles or other similar raptors.
2. I do not know from this quote what the words "these four Birds" relate to.
3. I haven't seen the word "familille" before: I have guessed "sub-family".

Lights blue touch-paper and stands back ... (appropriately on Nov 5th)

Thanks, Niels, Daniel and Dave!

Your replies will help me fine …

And Dave, about your three notes.

1. I think "Aigles-Autours" is just an older (now out-dated) French plural term that was used for quite a few of the "smaller" Eagles. Compare with, for example, the following species:
a./ Cassin's Hawk-Eagle Spizaetus africanus = Aigle de Cassin a k a Aigle-autour africain or Aigle-autour de Cassin.
b./ Ayres's Hawk-Eagle Hieraaetus ayresii = Aigle d'Ayres a k a Aigle-autour d'Ayres.
c./ Madagascar Serpent-Eagle Eutriorchis astur = Serpentaire de Madagascar a k a Aigle-autour de Madagascar.
d./ African Hawk-Eagle Hieraaetus spilogaster = Aigle fascié a k a Aigle-autour fascié.

2. "These four birds" relates to the 4 birds described in the same article by Œillet (Oeillet) Des Murs 1845. The other three was (all type descriptions!): "Haliætus vociferoïdes" (today Madagascar Fish-Eagle Haliaeetus vociferoides), "Mesites unicolor" (today Brown Mesite Mesitornis unicolor) and "Merganetta Colombiana" (today the subspecie "Colombian Torrent Duck" Merganetta armata colombiana)

3. And finally: No wonder you don´t know what "familille" is … it’s a typo!

After having re-checked the Type description (attached as pdf in post #1) the correct quote is:

”Seulement, à l’exception de ces quatre Oiseaux, rangés tous dans les Aigles-Autours, celui que nous avons dédié, comme hommage de notre respect, à M. le professeur Isidore Geoffroy–Saint–Hilaire, constitue véritablement un Aigle proprement dit, et est le premier de ce genre ou de cette famille qui présente cet ornement particulier.”

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Sorry about that! It´s hard to transcribe quotes from languages you don´t know, just gazing at words and sentences that doesn´t make any sense. That´s why I always try to attach the original type description to my post here on Bird Forum. As a precautionary measure, for anyone to check, if my scribblings are incomprehensible.

But so far, so good. This will make me able to finish my entry on this man.

If no-one has any counter-arguments:

Isidore Geoffroy Saint-Hilaire ... over and out!