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spotless or common starling (1 Viewer)

marnixR

marnixR

WYSIWYG
i see that apart from the common starling, the iberian peninsula also harbours a species called the spotless starling

tbh i haven't the foggiest how i would distinguish the two from one another, so would appreciate some help placing each of the attached 5 pictures in their appropriate species

details for where the pictures were taken
(1) Idanha-a-Nova, mid-east Portugal
(2) and (3) Aljezur, south-west tip of Portugal
(4) Castro Verde, inland southern Portugal
(5) Zamora, Castille & Leon

all from the first half of september
 

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All Spotless. Down here in the southwest we get our first arrivals of Common Starlings next month, which settle for the winter. Nice birds "they knock the spots off Common Starling"...........
 
... in which case the common starlings would also be spotless 3:)

but seriously, apart from not having any spots, and being the more common bird this time of the year, are there other characteristics to go by ?

colour of plumage ? + i notice they seem to have their feathers more fluffed up
 
The spots is the main feature that separates the two, both in non-breeding and breeding plumages. In winter Spotless shows tiny spots, usually hard to see whilst CS shows big white blobs. Spotless do have loose long nape and upper breast feathers, particularly noticeable when singing. The song has differences too and very complex to sort out from CS but with more clear notes notes, IIRC - its been a while since I've heard a CS singing ;).
 
i noticed the spotless's song was very versatile, whereas with the common it often quickly degenerates to a chatter rather than a tune
 
Top 10 ID tips:

1.Spotless is a Common Starling which has had a bath in an oily puddle and forgot to preen. Then got a shower in molasses, soy sauce and marmite...

2. Spotless sings like Common. The first part only. Then, it's a bit alien and simplified. A bit like Brian Eno's stuff. and very quiet experimental jazz. But more quiet, than experimental. And you continually look for a volume knob to turn it up. But the first bit's freakin' loud after poor sleep and drinks around the pool last night!

3. Spotless, like Common, are really social. But instead of half a million going to roost, you'll probably get about 40 on large TV aerials feeling a bit shy and trying to keep the noise down as not to annoy the holiday-makers. Like a 6th form party at someone's parents' house, which was gonna be the Dog's, but only the Science Club turned up. And the house smelt funny...

4.The last Ice Age separated Common and Spotless and made one weird and the other spotty and a YouTube Bore!

5. They are the Starling version of Spotted Crake for UK birders who've never seen one. And imagine they'll be just like Water Rails. So, you think you've just seen a Common Starling, like back at home, but it's a bit X-Files-ish, and you feel you might have a psychosis.

6. They do not Murmurate. Only in rubbishly small groups... And it's a bit crap. Like throwing raisins at an old yellowing wedding dress...

7. They speak Spanish & Portuguese. Which is probably why their calls go unheeded by Linguophobes.

8. They are Spotless Starlings. And they are not countable as real birds, as they might not exist at all. In fact they don't. Like something you saw in the corner of your eye, which was just mascara, or just that bit of the corner of your eye, where you see stuff, and attempt to inflate your life-list, then your eye pops out...

9. When illustrating them in field guides they save money on paint.

10. You're probably not gonna see Common Starlings in Iberia until Autumn. And they will leave in Spring. That bit in the middle is SPOTLESS! :t:
 
phil baber said:
Top 10 ID tips:

1.Spotless is a Common Starling which has had a bath in an oily puddle and forgot to preen. Then got a shower in molasses, soy sauce and marmite...

2. Spotless sings like Common. The first part only. Then, it's a bit alien and simplified. A bit like Brian Eno's stuff. and very quiet experimental jazz. But more quiet, than experimental. And you continually look for a volume knob to turn it up. But the first bit's freakin' loud after poor sleep and drinks around the pool last night!

3. Spotless, like Common, are really social. But instead of half a million going to roost, you'll probably get about 40 on large TV aerials feeling a bit shy and trying to keep the noise down as not to annoy the holiday-makers. Like a 6th form party at someone's parents' house, which was gonna be the Dog's, but only the Science Club turned up. And the house smelt funny...

4.The last Ice Age separated Common and Spotless and made one weird and the other spotty and a YouTube Bore!

5. They are the Starling version of Spotted Crake for UK birders who've never seen one. And imagine they'll be just like Water Rails. So, you think you've just seen a Common Starling, like back at home, but it's a bit X-Files-ish, and you feel you might have a psychosis.

6. They do not Murmurate. Only in rubbishly small groups... And it's a bit crap. Like throwing raisins at an old yellowing wedding dress...

7. They speak Spanish & Portuguese. Which is probably why their calls go unheeded by Linguophobes.

8. They are Spotless Starlings. And they are not countable as real birds, as they might not exist at all. In fact they don't. Like something you saw in the corner of your eye, which was just mascara, or just that bit of the corner of your eye, where you see stuff, and attempt to inflate your life-list, then your eye pops out...

9. When illustrating them in field guides they save money on paint.

10. You're probably not gonna see Common Starlings in Iberia until Autumn. And they will leave in Spring. That bit in the middle is SPOTLESS! :t:
Click to expand...

My experience in the breeding season is that the legs tend to be a much brighter bubblegum pink, sometimes almost orange. All year round, the loose, shaggy throat feathers are quite apparent
 
Seeing green iridescence on the belly in some of those pictures, something I haven't seen in CS. Is that a thing?
 
phil baber said:
Top 10 ID tips:

1.Spotless is a Common Starling which has had a bath in an oily puddle and forgot to preen. Then got a shower in molasses, soy sauce and marmite...

2. Spotless sings like Common. The first part only. Then, it's a bit alien and simplified. A bit like Brian Eno's stuff. and very quiet experimental jazz. But more quiet, than experimental. And you continually look for a volume knob to turn it up. But the first bit's freakin' loud after poor sleep and drinks around the pool last night!

3. Spotless, like Common, are really social. But instead of half a million going to roost, you'll probably get about 40 on large TV aerials feeling a bit shy and trying to keep the noise down as not to annoy the holiday-makers. Like a 6th form party at someone's parents' house, which was gonna be the Dog's, but only the Science Club turned up. And the house smelt funny...

4.The last Ice Age separated Common and Spotless and made one weird and the other spotty and a YouTube Bore!

5. They are the Starling version of Spotted Crake for UK birders who've never seen one. And imagine they'll be just like Water Rails. So, you think you've just seen a Common Starling, like back at home, but it's a bit X-Files-ish, and you feel you might have a psychosis.

6. They do not Murmurate. Only in rubbishly small groups... And it's a bit crap. Like throwing raisins at an old yellowing wedding dress...

7. They speak Spanish & Portuguese. Which is probably why their calls go unheeded by Linguophobes.

8. They are Spotless Starlings. And they are not countable as real birds, as they might not exist at all. In fact they don't. Like something you saw in the corner of your eye, which was just mascara, or just that bit of the corner of your eye, where you see stuff, and attempt to inflate your life-list, then your eye pops out...

9. When illustrating them in field guides they save money on paint.

10. You're probably not gonna see Common Starlings in Iberia until Autumn. And they will leave in Spring. That bit in the middle is SPOTLESS! :t:
Click to expand...

Fun read - the artist in you :t:
 
pianoman said:
Seeing green iridescence on the belly in some of those pictures, something I haven't seen in CS. Is that a thing?
Click to expand...

I just wonder whether that’s an illusion caused by the early morning sunlight in the treetops - (3) was taken a little later the same morning as (2) and they don't look green
 
Showing my age here: the first spotless starling in Denmark, when found, caused a lot of discussion. I think the long, shaggy feathers at throat/upper breast was what settled the id for most of us, even though the mass of photos also showed other differences. The third photo therefore for me shows the most important field mark.

Niels
 
Heaven forbid trying to identify a juvenile, away from known breeding distribution areas. I think the bird claimed as S.S. on the Isles of Scilly was eventually deemed to be an eastern race of Common Starling?
Are they fairly straightforward Simon?
Only ever seen them near Calp (5km from the Rock ) Spain.
 
njlarsen said:
Showing my age here: the first spotless starling in Denmark, when found, caused a lot of discussion. I think the long, shaggy feathers at throat/upper breast was what settled the id for most of us, even though the mass of photos also showed other differences. The third photo therefore for me shows the most important field mark.

Niels
Click to expand...

That would be an understatement in relation to the Isles of Scilly bird in the UK which I and many others twitched. Many people were ticking it for a while until it was unveiled as Pats says, as an Eastern race Common Starling.
 
PYRTLE said:
Heaven forbid trying to identify a juvenile, away from known breeding distribution areas. I think the bird claimed as S.S. on the Isles of Scilly was eventually deemed to be an eastern race of Common Starling?
Are they fairly straightforward Simon?
Only ever seen them near Calp (5km from the Rock ) Spain.
Click to expand...

Well by the time CS get down here there are no juv. plumages so I'm not in a good position to compare. Adults are easy, really! What the UK needs is an adult Spotless in a CS flock. They stand out like mad - in decent lighting. Down here the 2 mix a bit in the winter and when they are lined up on a wire, from a distance the CS look grey and the Spotless look jet black.

At least down here in the south, wintering CS seems to be exclusively a country bird.

By the way, Spotless Starlings are not boring - many times I admire them when at close range.
 
All starlings are wonderful! Sorry about the Top 10! Got a bit carried away.. Have seen many Spotless and love them to bits, like a Common Starling trying not to be too showy. But, as was previously stated, I missed an important ID tip:

11. Has legs made of Hubba Bubba. Not Bazooka Joe, or Bubbly.

PS October's Birdwatch mag has a nice ID feature on separating Common, Spotless and Rosy.
 
phil baber said:
Top 10 ID tips:

1.Spotless is a Common Starling which has had a bath in an oily puddle and forgot to preen. Then got a shower in molasses, soy sauce and marmite...

2. Spotless sings like Common. The first part only. Then, it's a bit alien and simplified. A bit like Brian Eno's stuff. and very quiet experimental jazz. But more quiet, than experimental. And you continually look for a volume knob to turn it up. But the first bit's freakin' loud after poor sleep and drinks around the pool last night!

3. Spotless, like Common,... etc, etc
Click to expand...

You should write a bird ID book with all the descriptions like that!!
 
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